Me.

For it's looks, it's interior, it's ride, and it's Hemi.

 

Incorrect. Pontiac has models that STAND ALONE with distinctive features for their class. Anyone else beside Pontiac offering a 303-hp performance sedan in the GP GXP's price class, that can stride confidently in four-season climates? For that matter, is there ANY make offering the GXP's HUD, integrated with visual and voice DVD navigation cues? *crickets chirping*
And BTW... who besides Pontiac, is going to bring a 400 HP RWD IRS 2+2 muscle car to the party, with a street price south of $30k? And if I add the constraint of having a real back seat, not even ignoring the price will allow the new Shelby Mustang into the party. For that matter, the G6 GTP, with it's competitive performance, M6 trans, and panoramic roof, is also uniquely equipped and a difficult act to follow. Despite the doom and gloom draped around here, customers in the real world are beginning to notice. And you better believe, it is good news for the dealers.
You're in a mighty small minority if you think the new C6 is bland. I've ridden in one and they are quite nice... and using GuionM's crude sales-only metric, Vette sales are up 18% Oct. vs. Oct. 04. Less IS sometimes ok... especially when you end up with a new Vette weighing less and giving more grins at the track, all for the same or LESS $$. (Is less COST ok with you?)
Fine. But we WERE NOT talking about cars. (Your homework is to go back and re-read the entire thread). Full-size SUV buyers are an older, more mature tribe - they're not looking for the next Trans Am WS6. I do agree the Escalade owes some success to its looks (What?! A GM vehicle is a hit due to styling?! oh. FRINGE vehicle only... doesn't count as a success). But I'd bet the Escalade would never have made it as a cult hit with stars and the other rich folks buying it, if it did not also offer Cadillac quality and features, a dependable, simple, powerful and fuel-efficient LSx V8 engine, and so on.
Ba-loney. It has consistently been the UNIONS supporting GM who have been greedy. Greedy, selfishly forcing wage structures and benefits WAY up out of norms for the skill sets needed, to the point where now, a forklift operator with a GED can get $80k or more a year, and with excellent benefits to boot. Cars too costly as a result? Tough. You can't stop the factory, you will still have to pay the workers, in the UAW job bank, while they sit at home watching TV! So GM has done the only thing they can... tilt their whole marketing and distribution strategy to accommodate the UAW, keep lines running, move the metal at any cost. THAT is the core reason for the ongoing rebates. Given this nutty scenario, I'd say GM has not done too terribly bad.

 

ROFLOL. That's a great quote...I should save it.

You're a GM Executive's wet dream. Unfortunately, there aren't enough totally-blind loyalists like you to keep ANY corporation aflot.

And that's actually a good thing.

 

Don't brag about this to me. Go find a Dodge fan site and crow about your ugly-ute.

 

Is that all you've got? Let me know when you've got something more substantial than name-calling, to add to a debate.

 

Ok. But my statement is still accurate. Anyways...

Above, you quoted that GTO was up ~5% for the year. Neat. It's down ~50% in Oct 05 over Oct 04.

You quoted that the Corvette was up 18% in Oct 05 over Oct 04. Neat. It's also down 14% for the year.

You also quoted that the Vibe was up 11.8% for the year. Neat, but its down ~25% for the month.

So you use good numbers when it helps, and ignore the numbers that don't. Selective use of data is fun, is it not?

PS...I wasn't calling you a name - I was providing a description.

 

Good God Big, I'm not bragging. You asked and I answered.


(It's cool lookin' and you know it.)

 

PS...for all your crowing about the new Buicks...total Buick sales are down ~17% this year (and ~42% for Oct 05....just so I don't selectively quote). But that whats-its-name car is doing just fine, thank you very much.

 

As accurate as any other obscenely-worded opinion, I guess (?)...

...although I differ specifically with the 'totally blind' characterization. My family has had Fords, Dodges, and in fact my sister is currently a happy 2000 DCX Sebring convertible owner. I've driven many makes and roundly acknowledge many of them are great, such as the new F150, for their buyers. Just don't expect me to sing their praises, if I choose not to.

Remember now, I TRIED to warn folks how crude this sales-change data is. Perhaps you should direct your inquiry to GuionM, who seems confident in the logic of diagnosing an entire corporation's health on such a simple measure. All I did was make note of some of the stats he missed

 

Is that all YOU have? I wasn't talking about your family - I was talking about you.

And I find it ironic that I made note of some of the stats that you missed too (which, being rather indisputable, is likely why you have no retort).

BTW I agree about the unions.

 

you ARE kidding, aren't you?

 

I think the real issue here is "what defines a luxury car?" Lexus gets those numbers by selling many many many cars in the low 30s.........I may be wrong, but RL Polk defines "luxury car" as over $42K. The others are 'near luxury cars" in terms of segmentation.

By the way........every Cadillac (and other North American car) gets a 38% tarriff placed on it when exported to the European Union. Not so when their cars are imported into this country. That may not be the 'end all' ...but it certainly impacts sales in those countries.......and Japan? Don't get me going.

 

I just went to the site and it said "Curb weight, lbs 2860"
And the solstice comes with 16.7% more cubic inches in its 4-cylinder than the miatas.
How much are you guys willing to pay per pound off of the car?
I've heard from 5-10 $/lb.

 

'Ya know, I've read this entire post and I don't profess to be an expert in marketing, sales, trend analysis or the automobile industry (in any way).

For demographic purposes, I am in my 30's with 3 kids. We drive an '04 Avalanche, an '02 Camaro SS ragtop and a pair of bikes. We do well and have some disposable income (hence the 2 bikes) and are a perfect (moving) target market for auto makers. From a true layman perspective, here's a quick-look on GM.

GM doesn't produce a car that grabs our attention for anything, except possibly a land-yacht Tahoe/Suburban. They (the vast majority of their cars) are booring, value dawgs that are getting their proverbial clocks cleaned by the better handling/performing/value imports and the more interesting 300M/Charger type domestics.

We are brand loyal, but GM by and large, has become completly lifeless. Someone stole GM's innovative, creative, exciting spirit (along with their *****) while we were'nt looking.

I almost choke when I admit our next car will probably be a BMW 330i. Why the hell can't Pontiac (the "We build excitement" folks) build something rear-wheel drive that is WELL BUILT and take a little pride in it! Not to mention taking a few risks and kicking some import **** with styling, performance and QUALITY!

I was initially impressed with the new GTO- seemed like someone with a little moxie stepped up. IMO it is a nice car, and is damn close to the mark.... just a little bland and could benefit from a better quality interior and attention to detail! I don't know a thing about designing cars, but why is that so hard?

We will be in the market for new wheels before too much longer. Hopefully GM will take some risks with styling and performance while improving fit, finish and overall quality. If not, the (mainly Japanese) imports will just keep improving their craft, growing and will simply out sell GM into submission. This is not a GM bash, just a consumer giving opinions to whoever will listen.

GM- Sad, but true.

Allen

 

I think the Impala and Malibu are quite good looking. I prefer their looks to the Charger/300 cars, though I prefer the drivetrain of the latter.

If someone wants a competent, FWD family sedan, then the Malibu/Impala seem to match up reasonably well to the Camry/Avalon. The latter two are probably a little higher grade (according to what I read), but they are also more expensive.

I agree about the LaCrosse. I'm not sure what GM could do to make it a more convincing competitor to the Lexus ES330. Somehow, GM has to convince people that Buick is to Cadillac as the ES330 is to the IS/GS Lexus models. That's going to be really hard!

I drove a Pontiac G6 GTP on Sunday (a very short course at Autoshow in Motion), and it was very nice for a FWD car -- lots of power. It should be able to do well against cars like the Honda Accord V6 coupe or the Mazda 6s or the Nissan Altima SE-R, though it doesn't seem to be doing so. If I wanted that type of car (FWD powerful V6), it would be on my shopping list.