If I recall correctly, the hardtop initially only came with a Z51 and six speed.....and Corvette team kept telling us, from the beginning, that this is just a preview of things to come.

 

It was indeed, which wasn't a bad thing for me personally. But given the fact that you also got stuck w/ an ugly body, black only interior, no sport seats, no HUD, no auto A/C as I recall, no targa...all for a savings of a whole $1000 over the coupe, most people decided that it wasn't worth it and just got a coupe.

Back to this Camaro thing, assuming 3 engines, base, optional, and top dog, it's safe to assume that the SS and the Z28 would both have the top dog as part of the deal. Can we agree that the SS would be the cruiser and the Z28 the bruiser? I doubt the new car will be available at all w/ manual windows or locks so it wouldn't be a stripper in the traditional sense. But here it is...if you want leather, DVD, t-tops/sunroof, top end stereo (DVD Nav integrated), automatic?, vert...get the SS. If you want gears, big brakes, big wheels, suspension that jars your fillings loose but pulls 1g, lighter weight for better acceleration...get a Z.

Same engine, but 2 flavors, cruiser and bruiser.

 

Exactly!

If you want the T-tops or convertable and the top motor, opt for the SS. If you want an exclusive all out performance Camaro with the top motor, get the Z28. Performance as in awesome acceleration, top speed, handling like no other, and body rigidity and stiffness that only a hardtop car can provide.

 

agreed, but if the Camaro is designed based on whatever info we have, it doesnt look like its gunna get ttops. I think there should be some options that transfer from one end to the other.
I do like the "Odd Couple" set up of the Z28 and SS. Let them share the basic set up with the same engine, but different standard options. The Z comes with more basic options like cloth seats while the SS get the leather. That would leave people wanting a luxury cruser to get the SS, and people looking for a "stripper" car(or with less options) as the Z28.

 

but why make people who want some creature comforts get the ss name?
i personally like the z28 name but i know some people would like some options on it
i don't favor the ss because it sounds so generic and can be grouped into a lot of other chevys where as z28, is just z28, enough said

 

yeah, I think that the ability of leather, electronics, and other things should be an option on the Z.

 

So what would have happened to the sales of the Formula if it had a more track ready suspension than the Trans Am? Or is the consensus that the Z28 sales figures shouldn't matter at all. The reason I bring this up is that there was no Formula convertible after the update in MY1998, and a Formula with a better suspension seems like the kind of car you guys want the Z28 to become.

 

I agree with most of this, as far as the "cruiser/bruiser theory. I have no problem with that. However, IF T-tops are avaliable I think they should be an option on both models. Yes I think the Z28 should have less avaliable options, and be more of the hardcore performance enthusiast car. But T-tops is ONE option it should have avaliable to it. Not only because I want a no frills ***** to the wall car yet with T-tops myself. But based on past sales as has been beaten into the ground in this thread. We KNOW T-tops sell so if even cutting out most of the options to the Z28 model that should be one taht is avaliable.

I'd also like to say that most of the push for a quote "stripper" Z28 IMO is to be able to keep COST down. Weight is over-rated, no F-bodys are really what I would call light. And while they neednt make it a pig, its alot easier to swallow a little extra poundage that can ussually be stripped out pretty cheaply, than it is to swallow a 29k starting Z28 price compared to a 23-24k price.

And thats what needs to be concentrated on, so it can be an extreme high performance yet near entry level sports car, so the people who would be really interested in having one. Could afford it. Im talking 22-28 year olds.

 

If the plan is to keep the "Z" a standard shift only, true sports car, then why would anyone want to weight it down with things like : leather, power seats, electric mirrors etc???
Heck, you might as well throw in an Auto-Tranny option as well...

I say if you want a true "Z" , a modestly equipped, full on-buisness sports car buy a Z28...still NOT a stripper..
But if you want the power(spirit) of the "Z" with more creature comforts and flashier(?) looks, the buy an "SS"...
(Like the LX and the GT were to the Stang..)

And about T-Tops, if built on the new zeta platform, will body flex still be an issue??? Doesn't it have a full hydraformed frame??
And with the smaller roof area, wouldn't a Targa top be more feasable??(That is if, it there is NO flex issues..)

 

I think that demographic is more inline with Cobalt SS or the base Camaro...or perhaps if Chevy makes a RWD 5.3 SS.

The target demographic for the top Camaro SS and Z/28 will for a higher age group.

 

If they did that, they wouldn't need an SS.

And the Z28 wouldn't be "de-contented", it would have options appropirate for the car. Instead of leather it would have Brembos. Instead of DVD Nav/stereo, it would have gears, a Ripper, and a decent but not top end stereo (most people replace it anyway). Instead of t-tops, it would have Eibachs and Koni's...ect.

Keep in mind that this RPOZ28, i.m.o., would sell at a pretty small volume, as Joe Public would want the luxuries and gadgets over the raw performance. The original Z28 never sold that well compared to the SS. But that shouldn't be considered a sales failure, it's just an option that didn't appeal to the mainstream. A few other options that didn't sell well were ZL-1, LT-1, and a few vettes had L-88's, L-89's, ZR-1's (the original one), and ZR-2's. Granted these were all engines, but they still transformed the nature of the car, much like RPOZ28 would.

 

OK that wont work. I mean your right thats the age group targeted with the cobalt SS, but it only targets a certain percentage of that age demographic. I dont want a FWD 4 banger, nothing against the cobalt I think GM going in the right direction with it but I want RWD V8 power. At the least a supercharged V6, but we already discussed this would be more expensive than an 8.

Now I supose I could live with taking a 5.3 Camaro if necessary, if it had decent enough power, and all the upgrades for the 6.0 would bolt to either. However I would be bitter about giving up over a half liter. Now I realize me being bitter, wont make GM give me the 6.0 just because Im not happy, but I think that they should make an option that comes with al the performance options AND avaliable T-or Targa top for only a couple thousand more. And then have your fully optioned out lots of flare panels for your 30-40k price.

Honestly Im not opposed to an LS2, and T-56 being avalible in a base camaro with no Z or SS name at all.

 

No one will prevent a 22 yo from buying a 400+ hp car...if he has the means.

But forget about getting one for low to mid $20's. And forget about GM targeting this segment with such a car.

 

Ok, and like I said I can understand, that "if" GM offers the 5.3 for around the price of the Supercharged Cobalt. Becuase now you have your base covered with the 20-25 year olds (the import type "tuner" crowd,and V8 enthusiasts), and most above that age who want the 6.0 liter car can afford it.

However, I think you could get the LS1 Z28 for aruond 24-25 k couldnt you? So I think its reasonable to be able to get the LS2 for 26-27 if you keep it in check with luxury, and looks options. At the least one should be avaliable for just under 30k.

However like I said, for this plan to work the 5.3 needs to be mod freindly. And as I understand it wont anything that would bolt onto the bigger motor bolt onto the 5.3? Arent they basically the same?

 

I have a feeling that the 5.3 will be extremely mod friendly.