I like all of Jason's suggestions, so mine will be very similar:

G5: Think Dodge SRT-4. This car does not have to be refined, does not have to compete with Corolla. It needs to be fast and create a youth presence for Pontiac. Give it the turbo that will be in the HHR-SS, but let it have it FIRST, along with unique suspension mods similar to the Grand Prix GXP. This is also the only car I'd say should remain alpha numeric.

G6- Give it a refresh, rename it Grand Am. Sure, the name has some baggage, but so does G6 (Think of Oprah jumping up and down saying, "Everybody gets a car!"). And Grand Am sold more - with fewer variants. Moving onto important things, I agree it needs a hotter engine and a manual. There's plenty of motors to choose from - Pontiac can go with whichever is cheapest. Again, it doesn't need to have the best interior. Let the Aura be class leading. The Grand Am must be fast.

G8 - Name it Bonneville or Grand Prix. Either name works. I would not be so opposed to G8, but it's quite clear Pontiac is not going to get the necessary ad money to properly establish a new brand name. Everyone knows what a Grand Prix is. Bonneville too. And unlike GTO, neither of these cars have fans expecting it to like something out of 1964.

Solstice - No issues here.

GTO - Pretty clear what Pontiac needs to do here.

All in all, this brand would be stocked to compete with Nissan, Mazda and Dodge. They might steal a few sales from Acura, Infiniti and BMW as well. It seems to me as if GM tried to excorcise Pontiac's purile image, and threw out the baby - "excitement" - out with bathwater. This brand needs to be obnoxious. It needs to make a certain segment of the population roll its eyes.

 

For a good part of the 80's and 90's, most of pontiacs product was just poorly disguised hand-me-down product from chevy. Now, they are also getting barely disguised product from Holden (although I will add that the product is excellent). It's a little better now, but still, when I look at the Torrent, I see an equinox. It's even worse with the G5, they barely changed a thing.
Pontiac needs more cars like the solstice, something that you think of as a Pontiac first, not a last minute touch up of a chevy.

 

First thing to do is figure out what the story is with mainstream midsize sedans. Right now they have 3 (G6, Grand Prix, LaCrosse) -- soon will be 2. Question is if they can get away with with one and which one is it.

 

They can pull it off. One sporty midsize sedan, one midsize sports sedan, and one midsize luxury sedan.

 

Very good point.

First off, we'd have to decide if we want Pontiac to continue with the distinction it had the last 10 years, or if we want to throw it back to the 70s and arguably the 80s. Do we want Pontiac to continue to be the number one car brand for women (Pontiac has infact sold a greater percentage of vehicles to women then any other nameplate, including Honda at least to 2005), or do we want Pontiac to go the route of Dodge (the full line brand that sells the greatest percentage to men, save maybe Jaguar).


General Motor's official line is that they want Pontiac to be the American BMW. What they mean by that is NOT that GM has intentions of taking Pontiac and putting it in the same place in the market as BMW, it means GM wants Pontiac to have that great handling, feel, and balence that's made BMWs famous, but drape it in strong styling that says "America". Have optional engines that pack enough punch under the hood to run with anything in it's class and in top form, suspension pieces that leave the competition in the weeds. The G8 is the 1st Pontiac developed under this philosophy, though the Grand Prix's GXP competition package was really the first real step towards that.


To GM's already good (IMHO) direction they're taking Pontiac, I would add a return to real names. Sure it takes focus off of the Pontiac name and moves it to indivdual models, but that's how legends and reps are born. Sure, everything from Bonneville to LeMans to Grand Am to Trans Am were fingered from race cources and series till someone sued, but when you say a name you get a mental picture. The name "Sunfire" has more emotional connection than the sterile "G5". I'd drop the "G6" name in favor of returning "Grand Am".

Speaking of G5 and G6....I mean, Sunfire and Grand Am..., as a pair of the only American coupes in that market (Chrysler's Sebring and Chevy's Cobalt are about the only other US offerings in those 2 respective sizes), I'd market the things as a continuation of Pontiac's performance history.

Pontiac's non-performance cars had high style. The Grand Prixs of the 70s took on the Dusenberg lookand added split grilles and chrome vertical slats. If Pontiac is going to share showroom floorspace with Buick, however, I don't think it's be wise to return to those days, and instead continue with a performance look and leave the flash to Buick.

As for lineup, keep it simple. 3 sedans (large, medium, & compact), 2 coupes (large & compact) and a sports car. Pontiac should have more models than Buick IMO. Buick should have 2 sedans (volume medium and a large that's bigger than Pontiac's) and a medium sized premium coupe-convertible.

Buick would be about chrome, wood trim, auto-everything, long distance interstate cruiser with power.

Pontiac would be about perforated leather, turned alumunum (you older guys remember those ), driver-involved, California Highway 1 carver, with track credentials.


That's how I'd define the 21st century Pontiac.

 

I have read all the different threads about why its not gonna happen and a bunch of other bs but pontiac will never be the same without firebird. Firebird had one of the best followings for the past 40 years right there with camaro corvette and even mustang. I still say that GM is working on another firebird developing it right along the with the camaro and will be released not long after the camaro, hopefully with some different offerings than the camaro.

 

As I said in the other thread...I think killing the Grand Prix is a mistake. A lot of people want a large FWD hot rod (or a car that looks the part). To give you an idea, the GP's biggest market is Chicago. These people will not buy RWD G8's. They also certainly will bot buy a big FWD Buick because it happens to be in the same showroom.

 

The G6's wheelbase is actually longer than the Grand Prix's. So if they ever got rid of the G* names, they probably should use "Grand Prix" on the Epsilon model instead of "Grand Am".

The days of the Giant American Trunk (as seen on W cars) is over I'm afraid.

 

It is amazing how many Grand Prix's there are prowling the Chicago area. I agree that Pontiac needs the sporty FWD car. Niche RWD vehicles are fun and all, but even a supposed "niche" brand like Pontiac will supposedly be needs to pay the bills. As we've said, Pontiac needs to invest in the G6. If the brand played there cards right, they could cover a lot of bases with this car.

There is also something to be said for taking the ordinary car and really taking the time to spruce it up. The Grand Prix GXP was by no means a big investment, but it worked because they took the time to actually make the car better. There's no reason why the brand could not to the same with the Torrent and G6.

 

Haz-mat, I am with you all the way. Especially with the "best" Pontiac.
Your line up seems reasonable.
What i find unique, is that everyone is talking about sporty cars. So, we are defining Pontiac as "sporty". So, we want soul in our Pontiac's. Not this crap they have been giving us lately.

 

Pontiac = 90% of a BMW at 70% of the price and 125% the HP

 

The more I read and think about it, but more I think the G6 is the single model in the Pontiac showroom that needs to change.

Nissan realized a couple years back that their fate lied with Altima, and poured their resources into it. If you think about it, none of Nissan's other products are class leading, but they've made sure their volume seller - the one people see on the streets - is a barnstormer.

Pontiac could do the same, only they have the advantages of better economies of scale and not needing to compete in every model range. Whereas Nissan has had to sorely neglect the Maxima (even the long in the tooth GP is a better performer IMO), Pontiac can just snap their fingers and get a billion dollar product from Australia. Additionally, they can do fine with the one volume selling mid-size and a bunch of sweet niche products. They don't need to field a van or truck because Buick and GMC have it handled.

All Pontiac needs to worry about, all they should worry about, is making the G6 the best product possible.

 

One thing that always comes through in these "Bring back the Firebird" posts is that it isn't so much a bring back the Firebird post, but really a bring back the Trans Am post.

While it's possible that the Firebird name will come back, it's most certainly not going to be a "Pontiac Camaro" as it's always been, and it most certainly will not include a Trans Am named version, so I'd really wonder how comitted that so called "following would be if the name does come back.

Just to give an idea of how skewed the Firebird brand was towards the Trans Am, consider that in 2001 Pontiac sold 21,436 Firebirds. Out of that total, 9,538 were Firebird coupes, and a mere 1037 were LS1 powered Formula Firebirds. The rest were some variation of the Trans Am.

Before you point out that percentage justifies bringing back the Trans Am name, consider that leaves only 10,861. In fact, the only year the 4th gen Trans Am Firebirds (including the WS6) exceeded the average sales numbers of the GTO was in '99 & '00 (16,100 & 15,600). 2002 was a long 16 month production run.

However, the whole thing is moot regardless. Both Chrysler and Ford pulled out of the "Twin" coupe market because it canabalized sales. Firebird actually did the same thing (if you ever get a chance to talk to Scott, you might ask him about the disproportionate funds Firebird siphoned from the F-body budget from Camaro... despite Camaro selling in greater numbers).



BTW: What part of Pittsburgh are you from? I'm from Monroeville and Scott's from Mars.

 

Does Pontiac still have the rights to the name Catalina?

 

I disagree that Pontiac needs a FWD vehicle. FWD and performance are two words that don't belong together (without "lack of" in front of them). If Pontiac is truly to be a "performance" division, as is its heritage, then it needs to lose the FWD vehicles. Period. Leave those to Buick... let them all be FWD except for the big Roadmaster/Park Avenue/Electra sedan.

I see a lot of folks who owned FWD vehicles over the past 20 years buying Chargers and 300's. If you are REALLY concerned about selling RWD in northern climates, offer AWD as an option and push it - or offer an option package that's a set of steel wheels with some Dunlop WinterSports on them.

I live in the Milwaukee area and am not going to let the fact that the G8 is RWD prevent me from getting one in a couple of years... just plan to budget for some rims and snows...