Automotive News / Industry / Future Vehicle Discussion Automotive news and discussion about upcoming vehicles

The case for a FWD MonteCarlo.......

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Sep 25, 2002 | 12:13 PM
  #16  
Erebus's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 8
From: All Over Mass
The only problem I see with using a Buick nameplate is the name Buick itself. I really believe that Buick will go the way of Oldsmobile. The name Buick has had nothing since the Grand Nash to invoke any kind of excitement. To me even an upscale Buick would be out of the question. My grandparents drove Buicks to church the whole time I was growing up. They have a reputation of being an "old person's" car. You only see guys with grey hair and liver spots wearing button-down shirts and ties driving them. And their ain't a blinkin thing Tiger Woods can do about it!!
Old Sep 25, 2002 | 12:28 PM
  #17  
guionM's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 13,713
From: The Golden State
Originally posted by Erebus
The only problem I see with using a Buick nameplate is the name Buick itself. I really believe that Buick will go the way of Oldsmobile. The name Buick has had nothing since the Grand Nash to invoke any kind of excitement. To me even an upscale Buick would be out of the question. My grandparents drove Buicks to church the whole time I was growing up. They have a reputation of being an "old person's" car. You only see guys with grey hair and liver spots wearing button-down shirts and ties driving them. And their ain't a blinkin thing Tiger Woods can do about it!!
Not too many years ago, Cadillac was in the same position, so anything's possible.
Old Sep 25, 2002 | 12:32 PM
  #18  
Chuck!'s Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Aug 1999
Posts: 2,610
From: Cincinnati, OH
I think that the Pontiac line up is more of a Solara/Accord coupe fighter. The Grand Am seems like it would be more of competition for those cars, not the Monte. Probably the new Impala SS will fill the semi-performance FWD section that I dont think the Monte should be in.

I love the mid 80s Monte SS's so Id love to see them return to more of a RWD V8 form, but then again it would probably be hard to sell 80,000 rwd Montes.
Old Sep 25, 2002 | 12:59 PM
  #19  
Erebus's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 8
From: All Over Mass
Originally posted by guionM
Not too many years ago, Cadillac was in the same position, so anything's possible.
Yea but Buick will never get the benefit of an LMP Program[RIP] and I wouldn't say that Cadillac is in any kind of good standing with the youngest generation of drivers. Other than the Escalade selling to the *bling-bling* croud which the H2 is about to take away.

Basically Caddy and Buick have to find ways to attract the younger buyers so that when they are financially ready to buy a luxury car they will look their way. You ask any kid under 25 what his idea of a luxury car is and it will be most likely be from Japan or Germany. Maybe England, although they are mostly Fords now anyway.
Old Sep 25, 2002 | 01:54 PM
  #20  
guionM's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 13,713
From: The Golden State
Originally posted by Erebus
Yea but Buick will never get the benefit of an LMP Program[RIP] and I wouldn't say that Cadillac is in any kind of good standing with the youngest generation of drivers. Other than the Escalade selling to the *bling-bling* croud which the H2 is about to take away.

Basically Caddy and Buick have to find ways to attract the younger buyers so that when they are financially ready to buy a luxury car they will look their way. You ask any kid under 25 what his idea of a luxury car is and it will be most likely be from Japan or Germany. Maybe England, although they are mostly Fords now anyway.
You forget the CTS. Out here, it seems to be selling well to the same age of people who would be driving 3series BMWs. The 6 speed CTSv will only build on that. I don't see the H3 taking the place of the cushy and pretty stylish Escalade. It has built a name for itself, not just with the "bling bling" crowd either. Alot of not-quite older, rich women drive them alot here in So-Cal.

But the XLR I can easily see ending up at the country club, but STS is sounding like another potential hit.
Old Sep 25, 2002 | 02:04 PM
  #21  
Darth Xed's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Dec 2000
Posts: 8,504
From: Ohio
Originally posted by Erebus
I guess what I am saying is that the Monte is a beautiful car for what it is intended to be. It just shouldn't be called a Monte Carlo.

Quite honestly, I don't think the fact that the Monte is FWD means it shouldn't be called Monte Carlo.

The old Monte's were the same type of car. A Mid-Lux larger coupe. RWD was not an mandatory part of that formula like it is in cars like Camaro or Corvette. EVERYTHING was RWD back when these cars came out.

For that reason, I don't see anything wrong with Monte Carlo, Impala, Malibu, et al being FWD.

Still, I'd perfer RWD, but I won't call blasphemy on cars where it doesn't really belong...
Old Sep 25, 2002 | 02:20 PM
  #22  
Erebus's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 8
From: All Over Mass
Originally posted by guionM
You forget the CTS. Out here, it seems to be selling well to the same age of people who would be driving 3series BMWs. The 6 speed CTSv will only build on that. I don't see the H3 taking the place of the cushy and pretty stylish Escalade. It has built a name for itself, not just with the "bling bling" crowd either. Alot of not-quite older, rich women drive them alot here in So-Cal.

But the XLR I can easily see ending up at the country club, but STS is sounding like another potential hit.
While I agree that the CTS wil steal some sales from the imports I am not sure it will make a significant dent in their numbers. In other words I am not sure that Cadillac will be able to make a big enough splash to draw a real significant portion of BMW and MB's customers away. While I have absolutely no doubt that Buick hasn't a prayer of drawing any of them.

And I am sure there will still be people buying Escalades for many years to come, there is a whole sub culture that changes tastes as often as most people change underwear. Escalade had a surge of sales and I think that is great, but I don't expect it to be maintained without some really good marketing and some good PR in the form of appearences in movies and music videos.
Old Sep 25, 2002 | 02:28 PM
  #23  
Erebus's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 8
From: All Over Mass
Originally posted by Darth Xed
Quite honestly, I don't think the fact that the Monte is FWD means it shouldn't be called Monte Carlo.

The old Monte's were the same type of car. A Mid-Lux larger coupe. RWD was not an mandatory part of that formula like it is in cars like Camaro or Corvette. EVERYTHING was RWD back when these cars came out.

For that reason, I don't see anything wrong with Monte Carlo, Impala, Malibu, et al being FWD.

Still, I'd perfer RWD, but I won't call blasphemy on cars where it doesn't really belong...
I just feel that the name can better be used on a RWD coupe that can be used to cushion an all out Camaro effort. Rather than having a V6 Camaro, there could be a V6 or V8(smaller displacement) RWD Monte Carlo. But keep the FWD W-Bod under another nameplate.

Although they could leave the Monte Carlo as it is and built the cushion RWD car and put the Chevelle nameplate on it. That would give me a big toothy grin.......

Last edited by Erebus; Sep 25, 2002 at 02:32 PM.
Old Sep 25, 2002 | 03:38 PM
  #24  
Z284ever's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 16,176
From: Chicagoland IL
Originally posted by guionM


Let me throw this out & get your opinion. Buick currently has no coupes whatsoever. If GM were to go after the Solara & Accord market, wouldn't Buick rather than Chevrolet be a better brand to go that route? I mentioned a Malibu based coupe yesterday, but instead, what about a luxury version of the upcomming Grand Am coupe, sold under Buick?
Good question...and one which I am undecided about.

On the one hand...it may be a good fit with Buick's "relaxed luxury" definition.

On the other hand, Chevy is GM core product....as Toyota and Honda are..., for well Toyota and Honda. Might it be more appropriate for core brands to compete with core brands.

Anyway...I wonder what your take on this would be if the upcoming "SS concept" goes into production as say ...oh I don't know.... Chevelle and Chevelle SS, (just a guess, not insider info), and became a platform mate to the next GTO.

....would we have room for a RWD MonteCarlo then?
Old Sep 25, 2002 | 04:54 PM
  #25  
Erebus's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 8
From: All Over Mass
Originally posted by Z284ever
Good question...and one which I am undecided about.

On the one hand...it may be a good fit with Buick's "relaxed luxury" definition.

On the other hand, Chevy is GM core product....as Toyota and Honda are..., for well Toyota and Honda. Might it be more appropriate for core brands to compete with core brands.

Anyway...I wonder what your take on this would be if the upcoming "SS concept" goes into production as say ...oh I don't know.... Chevelle and Chevelle SS, (just a guess, not insider info), and became a platform mate to the next GTO.

....would we have room for a RWD MonteCarlo then?
Well slapping the Monte Carlo or Chevelle name plate on the RWD or FWD platform works for me. Just less confusing to keep the FWD platform with the names it is currently associated with.

And as far as the whole Buick thing goes, a Chevy will compete with a Toyota or Honda. But the market that GM is losing is the luxury market. And Cadillac is the only brand they have that can pick it up. But they just shot Cadillac in the foot by canning the LMP program and admitting defeat.
Old Sep 25, 2002 | 11:17 PM
  #26  
Z284ever's Avatar
Thread Starter
Registered User
 
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 16,176
From: Chicagoland IL
Originally posted by Darth Xed
Quite honestly, I don't think the fact that the Monte is FWD means it shouldn't be called Monte Carlo.

The old Monte's were the same type of car. A Mid-Lux larger coupe. RWD was not an mandatory part of that formula like it is in cars like Camaro or Corvette. EVERYTHING was RWD back when these cars came out.

For that reason, I don't see anything wrong with Monte Carlo, Impala, Malibu, et al being FWD.

Still, I'd perfer RWD, but I won't call blasphemy on cars where it doesn't really belong...
Well said Darth.

The Monte Carlo has never really been about breathe taking performance. Even early '70s 454 Monte Carlo SSs were hard pressed to break into the 15s.

The current car stays true to it's roots...even performance wise.

Cars like the Solara follow pretty much the same formula.

That formula would be a stylish, near luxury, personal coupe. And Chevy seems to have retained an audience for such a car quite effectively.

Would I be interested in a RWD LS1 Monte Carlo...the answer would be heck yes!!!!

But I'm not going to buy 80,000 of 'em.......

Last edited by Z284ever; Sep 25, 2002 at 11:25 PM.
Old Sep 25, 2002 | 11:52 PM
  #27  
smallwood's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Aug 2002
Posts: 113
From: dallas, ga
BMW seems to do well with RWD, but I'll be easy to please ( generous, aren't I ). Just put a supercharger on the SS. And as far as Buick goes, they have the senior citizen market nailed. It's no wonder that Florida is the number one state in Buick sales. They won't go the same way as Olds. Olds made cars for a market that didn't really exist.
Old Sep 26, 2002 | 07:20 AM
  #28  
Erebus's Avatar
Registered User
 
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 8
From: All Over Mass
Originally posted by smallwood
BMW seems to do well with RWD, but I'll be easy to please ( generous, aren't I ). Just put a supercharger on the SS. And as far as Buick goes, they have the senior citizen market nailed. It's no wonder that Florida is the number one state in Buick sales. They won't go the same way as Olds. Olds made cars for a market that didn't really exist.
I think a blown SS would be cool, but I still think there is room for a low end RWD coupe in the Chevy line up.

Buick is going to be hurting as the current crop of senior citizens, um.... pass away. Because later generations don't even have Buick on their radar screens. Which is going to catch up with them.
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
WobblySausage
Drivetrain
4
Oct 7, 2015 10:09 AM
Bxlt1
Drivetrain
2
Sep 29, 2015 03:18 PM
Bxlt1
Drivetrain
8
Sep 17, 2015 08:31 AM
94Form
LT1 Based Engine Tech
12
Jul 17, 2015 10:56 PM




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:13 AM.