I didn't think GM was that far behind the curve. I know the PT Cruiser came out about 3 years ago. And sales are declining on this car too. So now GM will come out with something to compete 4 years after Chrysler did the PT Cruiser.

Well I do hope it looks cool and they sell a lot of them.

 

I agree, between the PT, VW Beatle and the Mini, that shrinking market is crowded. Even then, the PT dominates and will be very hard to overcome.

Hell, you can buy used highend PT's with under 30k miles for less then 10k and the brand new for 05 base model for 13k! And there is currently a huge glut of used PT's with low milage. I would be suprised if GM's clone was a hit.

 

Translation. GM is tricking us by thinking it is a front engine car but it is actually a rear engine car but the body is on backwards. when it is introduced watch which wheels turn. thats right the back ones as they are driving it in reverse. Guess what this means. thats right. the return of the car nader killed. o yes the Chevy Corvair

 

My faith is there, its just that from any way you look at it, GM dropped the ball. I know there are more than a few inside GM that push HARD for the program, yourself included, but it seems at times that GM as a whole just doesnt give a rats *** about the HUGE amount of fan support they have, and are content churning out mediocre econo-boxes and SUVs. I know that is no longer the case, but the bad taste is still there. As you say, the General probably has very, VERY good reasons to create a black hole of information regarding a 5th gen, but damned if I can think of a situation where that would tie my hand (assuming I ran GM personally ) from at least issuing a formal statement saying that GM's legions of performance enthusiasts, who CANT afford a Corvette, will not be forgotten, or forced into FWD, which we dont want.

Its just frustrating to see Holden, bubbling with all the things that we want. To see GM-Middle East delivering full size RWD V8 sedans that we cant get here. To see cars not get updated because some marketer says they dont need to be (Lets use Cavalier) , or killed, just as they get good (B-Body/Impala SS). I mean, we're talking about the GM that created the Tri-Five Chevrolet, each year of which was different looking, and all three of which are complete American classics. The GM that created the Corvette. The company that employed such greats as Harley Earl and Zora Arkus-Duntov, the company that put LS-6 Chevelles out on the street in force.

We watched as our brand(s) of choice got pissed down the toilet for thirty years, and even now, with Maximum Bob at the helm, it still seems like theres quite a lot of GM thats stuck in the mediocre 80s mentality, which is supremely frustrating for me at least.

It is guys like you though, Scott, that bring that faith and hope, as well as the knowledge that in there somewhere are car guys who care about the product first. Something sorely lacking at the big three until very recently.

Keep it up.

Meanwhile, Im going to go buy a new keyboard. That went way long.

 

Wow, that is exactly how I feel about GM right now.

 

I agree with the above, I have faith for sure. I will wait until '07 before I buy a new car, and It's because I want to. But it gets hard when you don't hear anything for a couple months about the car... and then with the release of the new stang... and then driving one... It sort of rattles my faith a bit.

But when I read a post by guionM or Scott, it restores my faith completely, because I know they wouldn't tell us all to keep the faith and keep trying if there wasn't something in the making, that we weren't allowed to know of. I'm sure there are reasons why everything must be kept quiet. And I'll respect that. I just hope that they're right.

And if not, then by '07/'08 those Mustangs should be pretty quick.

 

I guess you never got the joke. Some picked up on the sarcasim...guess some did not.

My point of saying "But a Mustang" is to get all the worthless posts and constant sobbing of some people that is tossed around this board about "I want a Camaro NOW or Im getting a Mustang", or "How come GM doesnt see the popularity of the new Mustang and make a Camaro!"
Yeah...Like GM will just pull one right out of thier a$$.

The starter of this thread is a perfect example of me saying "buy a Mustang".

 

well, Big Al, a lot of people are going to jump ship and buy a mustang. If GM had any brains, they wouldn't have discontinued the Camaro.

However, I will never buy one because Fords are pieces of junk and that new Mustang will be all over the place in 6 months.

The main thing I hate is this "keep the faith bull **** that is going on"
There better be a legitimate reason why that is going on, and I still think I'm right that GM hasn't made up its mind to build the Camaro yet. Its problaby stuck in some "focus group" or whatever they call their beuracry b.s. decision making process that has to go through 10 different committees. I don't see how it is that hard for GM to make up their mind on this matter. There should be one question running through GM right now, "Can we make a profit on this new Camaro?" And the answer is yes.

Look at Ford and the Mustang. I am willing to bet that if Ford discontinued the Mustang back in 1993 the company would have gone bankrupt(or really close to it) back a few years ago with that Firestone tire debacle. Just think of all of the revnue Ford would have lost if it hadn't been making those Mustangs.

 

I belive GM understood this back in the late 90's when they cut the Fbodies. Its not like it was an afterthought 3 years later.

"oh crap....we totaly forgot about the Mustang. Im sure a lof of future Camaro buyers will no go to Mustang. How come we didnt think of that?"
Im sure that in the planning of killing the Fbodies, this came up and apparently no one at GM really gave too big of a F to care. Who ever did care tried to keep some sort of performance alive.
Im sure GM broke it down like this, or something like this at some time
V6 buyers= who gives when 90% of them coudlnt tell the difference between FWD and RWD. Give them the Monte, and for thoes wanting a bit more, give them the GTP motor.
V8 buyers= Bring the GTO to retain the people who got the higer end Fbodies, which made up a lot of the V8 purchases, and give them a car that offers a bit more then just low 13 sec 1/4 miles. The other few numbers of people that got the base Z28's and the like could move on to the Mustang.

I have also noticed that most people who got teh LS1 Fbodies got them not because they are die hard Camaro or Chevy buyers, but becaue they wanted what was fast. I noticed that a lot of them had a 5.0 Mustang when they were kids. These people will just migrate to the next thing. I notice that a lot of people dropped there LS1 fbodies and got a 03/04 Cobra. Just migrate to the faster thing. This is why I think GM has nothing to worry about as people will just drop there 300hp-350hp Mustangs and just go twards the 400hp Camaros.

 

Hardly,
If ppl thought this way then GM would have sold alot more Z28s and Trans Ams than Ford Did GT's..

Also, they'd better fix the interior when the Camaro comes back( Damn you Gm for Not Bringing back the Firebird!)

 

So if not in the 2005 show what about the 2006????

 

Quite the opposite in my case....

I've never owned a Mustang, I have only owned one Ford, which was a Contour I inherited. I've owned a '79 Trans Am(Purchased 2/99?), an '84 Camaro(still own, it was my first F-body, purchased about 10 years ago, $900, and now I wouldnt take $30K for it), a '91 Camaro(Still own, just purchased June '04), and a '99 Camaro(Still own,daily driven, purchased 2/04)

Im in my early twenties so I have owned quit a lot of vehicle for my age though but there are others like me that are diehard Camaro fans. I could have bought a lot faster car when I bought the '79 & '91, but I chose them because I like them.

There are also people that feel the same way about Mustangs.

GM isnt really concerned with the diehard fans because they will buy it no mattr what(sad). They only need to worry about the type of people mentioned by Big Al. People that will migrate to the newest and coolest thing, which I guess is OK to a point.

If GM grabs people's attention, they will get sold. They need something for everybody. The V6 should be an awesome car by itself. Auto or manual. Fast(enough), fun, comfortable, stylish, dependable, and most of all, affordable.
Then the Z28 or SS can get the performance suspension, V8, and whatever appearance differences they can come up with. Im fine with a plain-jane Z28 with no difference from a V6's appearance but some little badges and different rims...it make the price lower so fine by me, Im all for saving a buck. Most are. Rich or poor it doesnt matter.

If they get the look right then they will sell tons of'em.

I really dont care bout what engine it gets, as long as its a V8, LSx based or better, and offered with a stick and can beat the performance and price of whatever Mustang has at the time that would be direct competition for it.. Also I would like some sort of silver color available. The last 6 vehicles I bought were either silver or silverish grey...its earier to mantain and really shines in the sunlight, and photos very well.

Thats it. gimme a nice looking car, not too conservative but not too tacky, offered with a V8 and a stick, in silver, for a good price. Dont forget the Performance, please.

 

I don't think we'll ever see a "concept" persee.

 

Me neither. I think its intro lies in direct connection with how the C6 was introduced, and we knew next to nothing about that car till a FEW MONTHS before it came out......