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Bastardization at its finest...V6 Vette

Old Oct 21, 2006 | 07:22 AM
  #31  
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Re: Bastardization at its finest...V6 Vette

Thats gender-bending at it's worst. WTF? Did GM forget the meaning to the words 'heritage' and 'Corvette'? V6 hell no. At least put an LS1 in it. By now it shouldnt cost any more to produce anyway. V6's belong in front wheel drive econopiles IMO. Not in a rear wheels drive sports car.

if GM wants to do something different, they'll make an AWD Corvette or at least an option out of one of these Corvette SS's or the stingray or something. A V6 Vette is ghey with a capital A lol
Old Oct 21, 2006 | 08:22 AM
  #32  
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Re: Bastardization at its finest...V6 Vette

Originally Posted by posaune
What does GM have to really compete with the higher end roadster (BMW Z4/M, 350Z, S2000)???

Certainly you don't expect the SKY to do that. That is a hole in GM's line up that can easily filled by this car. How many people do you think are going to cross-shop the Saturn SKY and a BMW Z4??? More would do that for a Corvette than a Saturn.

Also, How would this be a competitor to the Camaro???
Two completly different markets and demographics.
Uh...GM has a car to compete with those higher end roadsters. It's called corvette. They are also competing with them at the bottom end of the market with the Sky/Solstice. Check the sales numbers of all these cars and then report back and tell us exactly how badly GM is doing and how they need another (fifth!) roadster.
Old Oct 21, 2006 | 08:30 AM
  #33  
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Re: Bastardization at its finest...V6 Vette

Originally Posted by posaune
Wilmington HAS the extra capacity for more Kappas to be built...something like 125,000 more
No it doesn't. The Kappa line is full and is located in a corner of Willmington. The L-series line still stands, unused. That line can be retooled and a whole new line can be put in. But Kappa wasn't designed for high volumes.
Old Oct 21, 2006 | 10:09 AM
  #34  
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Re: Bastardization at its finest...V6 Vette

Originally Posted by 91_z28_4me
No it doesn't. The Kappa line is full and is located in a corner of Willmington. The L-series line still stands, unused. That line can be retooled and a whole new line can be put in. But Kappa wasn't designed for high volumes.
So the other kappa cars that people allude to are going to be built where?
Old Oct 21, 2006 | 10:21 AM
  #35  
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Re: Bastardization at its finest...V6 Vette

Originally Posted by posaune
OK...let me play devil's advocate

Why couldn't the Kappa chassis spawn a Corvette. The chassis are very similar in design and function. The Kappa chassis looks like a slightly smaller Y-body. There is no really good reason the Kappa chassis could not be used for an entry level V6 Corvette.

Wilmington HAS the extra capacity for more Kappas to be built...something like 125,000 more

Lets say Chevy makes this kappa Corvette with a design very similar to the 2004 Nomad concept (I'm not talking wagon, the front end) Very C1 in style. With a HF V6 it would be a very decent performer with killer looks and I would assume a profitable car if priced around 30k.

Target market...

Corvette owners who want an extra toy that it very much an attention getter

Baby boomers who grew up with the C1

Those who don't have enough to get a new vette but could afford this.

Entry level vette =
I see this car as more of an image "halo" car in the same vein as the SSR or most recent Thunderbird. It let's Chevy dip into the retro bucket with classic first generation Corvette styling while maintaining the forward direction of the V8 Corvette. It would be limited run and could be replaced with another feature image/halo vehicle. It makes you look at the somewhat quirky Nomad concept a bit differently.

To me, this sounds more like capitalizing on Corvette's retro appeal for an image car than attempting to redirect the current Corvette's model lineup to introduce an entry level variant. And it still sounds cool...


1953 Corvette

Un-Nomad it: chop the top and ditch the bed. Instant SSR replacement.
Old Oct 21, 2006 | 12:38 PM
  #36  
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Re: Bastardization at its finest...V6 Vette

Originally Posted by WERM
Uh...GM has a car to compete with those higher end roadsters. It's called corvette. They are also competing with them at the bottom end of the market with the Sky/Solstice. Check the sales numbers of all these cars and then report back and tell us exactly how badly GM is doing and how they need another (fifth!) roadster.

Corvette coupe - 45k
Corvette Conv - 53k
Solstice - 22k
Sky - 25k

BMW Z4 3.0i - 35.6k
BMW Z4 coupe - 40k
BMW Z4 s.0si - 42k

S2000 - 34.2k

350Z - 27.6k
350Z enthusiast- 29k
350Z touring- 32.5k
350Z track- 34.5k
350Z grand touring- 35.8k

Crossfire coupe - 30k
Crossfire roadster - 35k

SLK280 roadster - 44k

So where exactly does GM have a 30 - 45k dollar roadster???? GM doesn't!

Vette starts at 45k and that is for the coupe. The Convertible starts almost 18K over the BMW Z4 3.0i.

This is another hole in GM's line up that could be filled with a entry-level V6 Corvette.

* the only thing that is close is a fully loaded (every box checked) saturn Sky Redline which is 35K.
Old Oct 21, 2006 | 07:37 PM
  #37  
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Re: Bastardization at its finest...V6 Vette

Originally Posted by posaune
Corvette coupe - 45k
Corvette Conv - 53k
Solstice - 22k
Sky - 25k

BMW Z4 3.0i - 35.6k
BMW Z4 coupe - 40k
BMW Z4 s.0si - 42k

S2000 - 34.2k

350Z - 27.6k
350Z enthusiast- 29k
350Z touring- 32.5k
350Z track- 34.5k
350Z grand touring- 35.8k

Crossfire coupe - 30k
Crossfire roadster - 35k

SLK280 roadster - 44k

So where exactly does GM have a 30 - 45k dollar roadster???? GM doesn't!

Vette starts at 45k and that is for the coupe. The Convertible starts almost 18K over the BMW Z4 3.0i.

This is another hole in GM's line up that could be filled with a entry-level V6 Corvette.

* the only thing that is close is a fully loaded (every box checked) saturn Sky Redline which is 35K.
I didn't say pricing, I said break out the sales numbers. Besides, even if there is an open niche by pricing, there are LOTS of other niches that GM needs to be in right now other than sports cars.
Old Oct 21, 2006 | 11:17 PM
  #38  
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Re: Bastardization at its finest...V6 Vette

Originally Posted by posaune
What does GM have to really compete with the higher end roadster (BMW Z4/M, 350Z, S2000)???

Certainly you don't expect the SKY to do that.
Forgive me for expecting an upmarket brand to carry an upmarket vehicle. [Sarcasm] It makes far more sense to use a value brand to compete with luxury car. By that logic I suppose it also makes sense to shoehorn such a car into the image of another value car that anyone honest will tell you doesen't carry the grandeur its more expensive and exclusive competitors do. [/Sarcasm]

That is a hole in GM's line up that can easily filled by this car. How many people do you think are going to cross-shop the Saturn SKY and a BMW Z4??? More would do that for a Corvette than a Saturn.
You want people to cross shop this Corvette-lite with a Z4 in the same way they cross shop a ZO6 and 911?

Regardless of how you or I may feel about Saturn's current or future market position GM is spending millions on making it an upscale brand. It would be ridicolous to create an upscale competitor to the Sky two rungs down on the latter.

IF, and this is a fairly large "if" there is a a substantial amount of people who have the attitude, "I want a roadster thats negligibly smaller and lighter than corvette, slower and at the same price" and GM needs to cater to them then the obvious solution is make the Sky that car.

Not **** away a few million on designing, styling and tooling a new car thats branded wrong and waters down the best thing the company has.

Also, How would this be a competitor to the Camaro???
Two completly different markets and demographics.
Was it not you who suggested this should be a Corvette for people who could not afford it? While they may not be its proper purpose Im sure a lot more people can tell you what a "Corvette engine" is than a "Pony car".

Of course you also said this should be an upmarket 40k car. So maybe you're a bit confused.

Last edited by Good Ph.D; Oct 21, 2006 at 11:22 PM.
Old Oct 22, 2006 | 10:28 AM
  #39  
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Re: Bastardization at its finest...V6 Vette

Originally Posted by posaune
So the other kappa cars that people allude to are going to be built where?
On the retooled L-series line. But it ain't running now and won't be retooled for 2 seaters.
Old Oct 22, 2006 | 03:48 PM
  #40  
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Re: Bastardization at its finest...V6 Vette

Originally Posted by posaune
This is another hole in GM's line up that could be filled with a entry-level V6 Corvette.
Want heritage for cheap? Spin an I6 off the Atlas 4.2L and lob this theoretical engine into the vette as the base model.
Old Oct 22, 2006 | 05:07 PM
  #41  
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Re: Bastardization at its finest...V6 Vette

Originally Posted by AlfredB18
Want heritage for cheap? Spin an I6 off the Atlas 4.2L and lob this theoretical engine into the vette as the base model.
The Atlas 4.2 IS an I6, and it isn't cheap either, exhaust VVT DOHC all aluminum construction. It likely costs more than the LS2 to make.
Old Oct 23, 2006 | 01:56 AM
  #42  
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Re: Bastardization at its finest...V6 Vette

The Corvette would also require a 6 inch cowl hood to house that very tall, very wide, very long 6cyl engine.
There are some times that I think that GM has some ideas that really should just be put to rest.
Old Oct 23, 2006 | 02:56 PM
  #43  
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Re: Bastardization at its finest...V6 Vette

Originally Posted by Good Ph.D
IF, and this is a fairly large "if" there is a a substantial amount of people who have the attitude, "I want a roadster thats negligibly smaller and lighter than corvette, slower and at the same price" and GM needs to cater to them then the obvious solution is make the Sky that car.
This roadster would not be at the same price as the normal Vette. This "Corvette lite" as you put it, Would/should start around 33 - 35K. So it would not be at the same price as the standard Vette, it is meant to be below that. Also, you don't think a highly styled vette with a 300+ hp HFV6 at that price couldn't compete performance wise with the 215 HP I6 Z4 3.0i?


Originally Posted by Good Ph.D
Was it not you who suggested this should be a Corvette for people who could not afford it? While they may not be its proper purpose Im sure a lot more people can tell you what a "Corvette engine" is than a "Pony car".

Of course you also said this should be an upmarket 40k car. So maybe you're a bit confused.
Gm tried the Camaro = 4 passenger vette...that strategy worked very well!

"Corvette engine" goes into many more vehicles than just Pony Cars.

45K is where corvette starts now. This Corvette Lite shouldn't get that high.


If so many of you can't see this as a corvette ( I think it should) then it should be a Cadillac but NOT a Saturn that should try to fill this void.
Cadillac = upmarket/ luxury
Corvette = upmarket
Buick = upmarket (under Cadillac)
Saturn = NOT Upmarket
How can you push Saturn upmarket...there is no place for it. Every GM brand CANNOT move upmarket, they all have there role to fill. Saturns...??? IDK but there is no room for it to be upmarket, including SKY. That is meant to be a Halo car to get people into show rooms, not compete against a Z4, 350Z, Crossfire or S2000.
Old Oct 23, 2006 | 03:07 PM
  #44  
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Re: Bastardization at its finest...V6 Vette

Originally Posted by posaune
* the only thing that is close is a fully loaded (every box checked) saturn Sky Redline which is 35K.
So there you go, Sky = $22K-$35K. Camaro vert will be $25K-$40K+ and maybe they will even make a GTO vert this time around.

For $0 and about 1 hour of your time you can even turn your Camaro into a 2 seat raodster.
Old Oct 23, 2006 | 03:18 PM
  #45  
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Re: Bastardization at its finest...V6 Vette

Originally Posted by Z28x
So there you go, Sky = $22K-$35K. Camaro vert will be $25K-$40K+ and maybe they will even make a GTO vert this time around.

For $0 and about 1 hour of your time you can even turn your Camaro into a 2 seat raodster.
You can turn your Camaro into a convertible and remove the back seats in an hour? I would have thought it would take longer than that

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