I posted a similar thought on another thread, but felt that this was worthy of it's own thread.

Was the 4th gen Z/28 really a Z/28?

Z/28s...especially early ones were identifiable by all their "special" performance parts.

*Premium "special" high performance engine components.

*Highly tuned "special" suspensions.

*"Special" wheels.

*"Special" brakes.

*Distinctive look.

Other than the LS1...was there anything really special about the 4th gen Z/28?

Wasn't it more of a modern rendition of a late '80s Mustang 5.0 LX "motor in a box", rather than a "SPECIAL" Z/28?

What do you guys think?

 

Nope, not when the SS came along. It was bacically a mid model, something it never was. Before the 4th Gen the Z28 was a Special Performance Option/Top Model. It was like the M*****g comparison you just made.

 

I just don't understand this obsession with the slash. Was the original Z/28 (the one with factory headers tossed in the trunk) a stunning, special, "boutique" performance car? Sure it was. But by the time the 4gen's appeared, the practicality of such a car was long gone. To succeed in today's marketplace, a sporty car has to be full-featured and sophisticated. Air bags. ABS. Creature comforts like a robust stereo. Mustang Mach I and Pontiac Monaro---GTO are good examples. The 4gen Z28 was/is true to this modern concept, not the 1969 version. Perhaps you'd like to return to the 1970's completely? If so, bring these along for your adventure:

1. Bias ply tires
2. 10 MPG
3. Frequent spark plug changes
4. Bell-bottom pants with exotic, colorful piping on the bottom edge
5. Incense and other forms of recreational smoke
6. Prehistoric restraint systems and crashworthiness
7. Prehistoric suspensions and trucklike handling

 

BDnF, Happy Thanksgiving.

Don't tell me that you don't love the slash...or even the occasional bell bottom, (with or without piping) .

Rather than trying to go back in time....on the contrary...I would have really liked to see the last Z/28 as a modern rendition of the original.

Would it have hurt if Chevy made the previous Z/28 a specific and more special package. Special and good looking 17" Z/28 specific wheels would have been a good start. Maybe some badging that cost more than 3 cents would have been good too. Something...anything that would have made it more "special" or at least special at all.

Could I dare ask for something really special, like Brembo brakes...as on the Cobra, Mach 1, 350Z, G35, etc? How about supportive "road race" seats? Standard 1LE pieces? Special gearing?.....I know I may be going over the top here.

Let's face facts....it was the absolute minimal package, at the absolute minimal cost that GM could throw together. It was an austere package, wrapped around the LS1. Not to say that many didn't appreciate it....it just wasn't a modern Z/28. It was the "Camaro LX".


PS

I like your '90 IROC....I have an '89

 

....the proper mission for the Z/28.

It was NEVER supposed to be the fully option-able V8 model with all the frills.

That was meant for the "SS" pure and simple.

As far as our obsession with the the ///////// it's just our way of campaigning for a return to this mission.......and leave the frills and cushy stuff for the rest of the masses.......

It wasn't until the early 70's that Chevy saw the thirst for this car and dropped the SS to cash in on the popularity of a factory built racer.....only to water down the formula to the point of extinction in the mid 70's. See how fast the car died when it lost it's mission??

Today, we suffer the loss of the entire model due to a nearly complete lack of committment to the car since the late 80's.......and the worst part of it all is that the Z/28 was regulated to the base model V8 .

So, yes.....maybe we are obsessed with the slash ///////// but we gotta' have something to wish for.......don't we??

Until Chevy gets back into the affordable V8 performance market, we're left with no other choice...........I personally don't think the anticipated high $30k - low $40k GTO fiits this bill at all........look what a mid $30k Camaro did...it killed it

 

True, but were 305 3rd-gens really special performace vehicles? The Iroc sort of took control of the top spot for 3rd-gens as well. To me, the Z/28 hasn't been a special performance only type package since the early second-gen LT1's. It's been watered down to just another trim level since then. They have still been great cars, but the name doesn't evoke the same feelings.That's a shame, because both the Z/28 and SS have a special history with GM and Camaro. I just wish GM would do a better job of celebrating their storied models, like Ford does with the Mustang.

-Mike

 

Well by God you better believe they are really Z28s

 

Amen to that! This is one area where Ford has so completely blown GM away....it makes you sad.

Is it really so hard to just get it right?

 

Here's something fun to try:

Put some random 4th gens of both makes and all models and all engines and plenty of colors, at the end of a quarter mile track, in 3/4 view (so you can see the front and the side). Find someone who considers themselves an F-Body fan. Blindfold them and take them to the other end of the track. Take off the blindfolds and ask them to identify those cars 1/4 mile away. If they can tell you with certainty what specific model and year each of those cars is, then buy them a 6-pack and wish 'em Happy Thanksgiving, because they just accomplished a mind-bendingly difficult task! All 4th gens look the same, pretty much. There is NO variety, NO distinction. This applies to the interiors too.

Try this test with a rear 3/4 view, so that you can see the sides and the rear of the cars. It gets even more difficult. From 93 to 02 there were pretty much no differences. what, ONE taillight refreshment? different exhaust pipes? That's about it.

Now... do this same front & back test with 2nd and 3rd gen lineups, and the percentage of correct answers should approach 100%, since those cars actually had some character, in contrast to the 4th gens.

Basically NO, the 4th gen Z/28 was not a Z/28, it was just a nice big V8 in a bland & bloated whale package, just like any other 4th gen. The only distinction is between Pontiac and Chevy, but within each division, each submodel looks pretty much the same. What's the point? Not surprising that they got axed.

IMHO

GT

 

I dont know about everyone else, but from ¼ mile away I can pick a SS out from a Z28 or V6 Camaro. Distinguishing a V6 from a Z28 from ¼ mile is a little more challenging though.

Same thing with Pontiac though. From ¼ mile, I dont think I could pick out a Formula from a V6, but I know I could definaltey spot a Trans Am, WS6 or Firehawk.

 

That just proves my point. You can tell the SS because of the slightly different wheels; you can tell the T/A because of the slightly different front bumper. Formula and base firebird look basically identical. 3.8 or 5.7 camaro look pretty much identical. WS6 with bigger wheels. That about sums up the variety in the dreadful 4th gen.

2nd gen / 3rd gen: as many as five to six engine a year, as many s 5 or 6 exteriors a year, plus variety in interiors. On top of already beautiful packages. That's why *those* didn't get killed off. You don't have to listen to me, but hopefully someone at GM will.

GT

 

Ugh, you can say the same things about a lot of the 3rd Gen cars as well. The lack of differences between years is something that GM has always done. What's the difference between a '97 Vette and a 2003? Maybe the wheels? From a 1/4 mile away can you tell the difference between an '88 IROC and a '90? Or even an '88 V6 and '88 V8? During the 3rd Gen run it also got just ONE front end and tail light re-style....It's amazing how history can be skewed.

 

During the 3rdgen era,you can tell the differences between a coupe,berlinetta from an '82-87Z '85-90 IROC-Z(with its' louvered hood,decals,ground efx,and 85-87s had different wheels from 88-90s ) and the '91-92 Z28s(hood w/revised to blisters not louvers,emblems,revised ground efx(RS too),hood,wheels(some RS had them)and rear highrise spoiler).I'm sure there were other differences that I forgot to mention.4th gen Zs have emblems/wheels to differentiate(but not from a distance) them from V6s,excluding later models.It seems to me that the 3rds had alot more things to tell them apart,eh?EDIT: Oh yeah,there were different grills between those models/years too.

 

The SS and WS6 are distinctive(appearance wise) because of their hoods mainly. There are also the wheels and spoilers (at least on the SS). I agree, this was one of the 4th-gen's problems. The models simply weren't different and unique enough. Yet, the automotive world isn't like it used to be. There are less trim levels to save money. But, I hardly see how this made them "dreadful"

-Mike

 

Granted the 4th generation Camaro looked pretty-much the same from the outside. This is good as the F-Bodies had the most radically racked windshields of any sporty car.

However, the Z28 was quite different from a V6 or RS model under the skin. The LT1 (as well as the LS1) had a major infusion of power over their previous powerplants. Other upgrades like 4 wheel ABS brakes and the heralded T56 6-speed were the real "slam dunk". Where else could you get 30mpg and still pull 0-60 in 5.5 seconds or less bone-stock on street tires, for $20k to $30k.

I bought the 1994 Z28M6 purely for the 6 speed and sold my 1974 Formula SD-455 with Turbo-400 Trans and highly modified road-race suspension, as it was not as fun as the M6!

Combine the Z28M6 with black-paint (which hides the Z28 emblems somewhat) with stock salad-shooter wheels and relatively quite stock exhaust and many Corvette owners were very surprised!

Sad to see the F-Body go. Ditching the F-Body is certainly NOT going to get me to buy other GM crap models!

Rick R