"230"
Take that Prius
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Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 20
From: Abilene,Texas
Just read this on Fox News.com
"General Motors announced on Tuesday that its upcoming Chevrolet Volt extended-range electric vehicle will be given a city fuel economy rating of at least 230 miles per gallon by the EPA, nearly five times more efficient than the current Toyota Prius.
The Volt, which runs purely on electricity for the first 40 miles of driving, carries a small internal combustion engine on board to generate electricity after the battery has drained. The EPA is currently developing a special methodology to calculate fuel efficiency for vehicles that work in this fashion which averages the results of test cycles run separately in electric and internal combustion modes.
The Volt’s highway and combined fuel economy ratings have not been calculated yet, but during the press conference, GM’s C.E.O. Fritz Henderson said that that the combined figure would be in the triple digits, meaning at least 100 mpg.
The 4-passenger hatchback is expected to go on sale in late 2010 for approximately $40,000."
"General Motors announced on Tuesday that its upcoming Chevrolet Volt extended-range electric vehicle will be given a city fuel economy rating of at least 230 miles per gallon by the EPA, nearly five times more efficient than the current Toyota Prius.
The Volt, which runs purely on electricity for the first 40 miles of driving, carries a small internal combustion engine on board to generate electricity after the battery has drained. The EPA is currently developing a special methodology to calculate fuel efficiency for vehicles that work in this fashion which averages the results of test cycles run separately in electric and internal combustion modes.
The Volt’s highway and combined fuel economy ratings have not been calculated yet, but during the press conference, GM’s C.E.O. Fritz Henderson said that that the combined figure would be in the triple digits, meaning at least 100 mpg.
The 4-passenger hatchback is expected to go on sale in late 2010 for approximately $40,000."
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Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 1,296
From: Beaumont, TX
NEW YORK (CNNMoney.com) -- The Chevrolet Volt, GM's electric car that's expected to go on sale in late 2010, is projected to get an estimated 230 miles per gallon, the automaker announced Tuesday.
That exceptionally high government mileage rating could give the Volt a major boost. For the first time, car buyers will easily be able to compare electric cars with ordinary gas-powered cars.
"Having a car that gets triple-digit fuel economy can and will be a game changer for us," said GM CEO Fritz Henderson.
Determining fuel economy for an electric car is a tricky matter, and General Motors (GM, Fortune 500) has been working with the Environmental Protection Agency for years on the issue.
50 mpg? or 5,000?
Fuel economy for hybrid vehicles like the Toyota Prius is displayed in the same way as it is for any other gasoline-powered vehicle. It gets 46 mpg, for example, versus 19 mpg for a V-6 Ford Mustang.
That standard works because all the energy used by the Prius ultimately comes from burning gasoline. The Prius just uses that energy more efficiently than other cars do.
The Chevrolet Volt, on other hand, runs on electricity that comes from two sources -- a battery as well as a gasoline engine. How much is generated by burning gasoline depends on how far the car is driven.
The Volt's lithium-ion batteries will hold enough juice to drive the car for about 40 miles, GM has said. Once the car goes beyond that, a small gasoline engine will turn on, generating electricity to power the wheels for longer drives.
When gasoline is providing the power, the Volt might get as much as 50 mpg.
But that mpg figure would not take into account that the car has already gone 40 miles with no gas at all.
So let's say the car is driven 50 miles in a day. For the first 40 miles, no gas is used and during the last 10 miles, 0.2 gallons are used. That's the equivalent of 250 miles per gallon. But, if the driver continues on to 80 miles, total fuel economy would drop to about 100 mpg. And if the driver goes 300 miles, the fuel economy would be a just 62.5 mpg.
The EPA rating for the Volt is based on a draft report and applies to city driving.
GM started pre-production of the car in June is making about 10 a month. "Volt is becoming very real, very fast," Henderson said.
Other manufacturers, including Ford (F, Fortune 500) and Nissan, are expected to have electric-only cars hitting the market around the same time as GM. Those vehicles are expected to have a range of 100 miles on a fully charged battery. But these cars won't have an on-board gas generator and must be recharged to drive farther. To top of page
That exceptionally high government mileage rating could give the Volt a major boost. For the first time, car buyers will easily be able to compare electric cars with ordinary gas-powered cars.
"Having a car that gets triple-digit fuel economy can and will be a game changer for us," said GM CEO Fritz Henderson.
Determining fuel economy for an electric car is a tricky matter, and General Motors (GM, Fortune 500) has been working with the Environmental Protection Agency for years on the issue.
50 mpg? or 5,000?
Fuel economy for hybrid vehicles like the Toyota Prius is displayed in the same way as it is for any other gasoline-powered vehicle. It gets 46 mpg, for example, versus 19 mpg for a V-6 Ford Mustang.
That standard works because all the energy used by the Prius ultimately comes from burning gasoline. The Prius just uses that energy more efficiently than other cars do.
The Chevrolet Volt, on other hand, runs on electricity that comes from two sources -- a battery as well as a gasoline engine. How much is generated by burning gasoline depends on how far the car is driven.
The Volt's lithium-ion batteries will hold enough juice to drive the car for about 40 miles, GM has said. Once the car goes beyond that, a small gasoline engine will turn on, generating electricity to power the wheels for longer drives.
When gasoline is providing the power, the Volt might get as much as 50 mpg.
But that mpg figure would not take into account that the car has already gone 40 miles with no gas at all.
So let's say the car is driven 50 miles in a day. For the first 40 miles, no gas is used and during the last 10 miles, 0.2 gallons are used. That's the equivalent of 250 miles per gallon. But, if the driver continues on to 80 miles, total fuel economy would drop to about 100 mpg. And if the driver goes 300 miles, the fuel economy would be a just 62.5 mpg.
The EPA rating for the Volt is based on a draft report and applies to city driving.
GM started pre-production of the car in June is making about 10 a month. "Volt is becoming very real, very fast," Henderson said.
Other manufacturers, including Ford (F, Fortune 500) and Nissan, are expected to have electric-only cars hitting the market around the same time as GM. Those vehicles are expected to have a range of 100 miles on a fully charged battery. But these cars won't have an on-board gas generator and must be recharged to drive farther. To top of page
West South Central Moderator
Joined: Oct 2000
Posts: 3,371
From: Kilgore TX 75662
I'm still not sure exactly how the EPA comes up with their numbers, but simply going off city fuel economy, if a CamaroZ28 got the same 12/18 ratings as the automatic CTS-V, then Chevy would be able to sell 8 of them for every Volt to get 35MPG average. ???
Now, who wants to take a guess at what the highway and combined ratings might be?
Now, who wants to take a guess at what the highway and combined ratings might be?
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2001
Posts: 766
From: Halifax, Nova Scotia, Canada
Ummmm, 230mpg in the city no less is a pretty mind numbing statement......yeah,... wow!!!! Take that Prius... and all the other hybrids out there while we're at it.
I suspect that the highway numbers may be quite a bit less since the gas motor will be involved, but I am no expert either, so who knows.
Too bad the car is still a year out... more or less. I think they still really need to reserve such statements for times when it can be followed up by oh, I dunno... operators are standing by to take your order. That would be a total shock and awe briefing....IMO.
I suspect that the highway numbers may be quite a bit less since the gas motor will be involved, but I am no expert either, so who knows.
Too bad the car is still a year out... more or less. I think they still really need to reserve such statements for times when it can be followed up by oh, I dunno... operators are standing by to take your order. That would be a total shock and awe briefing....IMO.
Last edited by SharpShooter_SS; Aug 11, 2009 at 09:09 AM.
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Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 1,958
From: Kansas City, MO
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,538902,00.html
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Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 824
From: North of Cincy
Someone check my math but, assuming the average driver drives 15M miles a year and gas at $2.50 with 100 MPG. One would spend $375 a year on gas. If you get 17 MPG that would cost you $2,205 a year. $1,830 savings a year at current gas prices.
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Joined: Sep 1998
Posts: 4,320
From: Memphis
I called it first!
But seriously, while this is great news for GM, I do think the EPA is retarded for trying to fit electric vehicles into its regular MPG rating.
I think that for any vehicle capable of propelling itself entirely on electricity to highway speeds, that the EPA needs to have an electric efficiency rating and a gasoline efficiency rating. Electric mode ratings should specify both electrical efficiency (x range for x amount of power), and total range on a full charge before using gasoline. Maybe also recharging times? Gasoline mode should be measured when the battery is officially depleted. For the gasoline rating it can continue to benefit from regenerative braking, the sun, or whatever other built in recharging mechanisms there are, but not from plugging in to a wall or anything else that requires stopping.
But seriously, while this is great news for GM, I do think the EPA is retarded for trying to fit electric vehicles into its regular MPG rating.
I think that for any vehicle capable of propelling itself entirely on electricity to highway speeds, that the EPA needs to have an electric efficiency rating and a gasoline efficiency rating. Electric mode ratings should specify both electrical efficiency (x range for x amount of power), and total range on a full charge before using gasoline. Maybe also recharging times? Gasoline mode should be measured when the battery is officially depleted. For the gasoline rating it can continue to benefit from regenerative braking, the sun, or whatever other built in recharging mechanisms there are, but not from plugging in to a wall or anything else that requires stopping.
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Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 200
I called it first!
But seriously, while this is great news for GM, I do think the EPA is retarded for trying to fit electric vehicles into its regular MPG rating.
I think that for any vehicle capable of propelling itself entirely on electricity to highway speeds, that the EPA needs to have an electric efficiency rating and a gasoline efficiency rating. Electric mode ratings should specify both electrical efficiency (x range for x amount of power), and total range on a full charge before using gasoline. Maybe also recharging times? Gasoline mode should be measured when the battery is officially depleted. For the gasoline rating it can continue to benefit from regenerative braking, the sun, or whatever other built in recharging mechanisms there are, but not from plugging in to a wall or anything else that requires stopping.
But seriously, while this is great news for GM, I do think the EPA is retarded for trying to fit electric vehicles into its regular MPG rating.
I think that for any vehicle capable of propelling itself entirely on electricity to highway speeds, that the EPA needs to have an electric efficiency rating and a gasoline efficiency rating. Electric mode ratings should specify both electrical efficiency (x range for x amount of power), and total range on a full charge before using gasoline. Maybe also recharging times? Gasoline mode should be measured when the battery is officially depleted. For the gasoline rating it can continue to benefit from regenerative braking, the sun, or whatever other built in recharging mechanisms there are, but not from plugging in to a wall or anything else that requires stopping.
My guess is they'll have an electrical efficiency rating in energy consumption/distance traveled. As for a range type rating, it'd be easy enough to figure out, but I don't see it going on a window sticker (just like it isn't there for gas vehicles).
Registered User
Joined: Sep 1998
Posts: 4,320
From: Memphis
When I heard the announcment, Fritz said something like 25kW/100 miles, and 230MPG. I could be WAY off on what the electrical rating was, but my point is, it looks like EPA is aware of the fact that they'll have to give electrical information as well as fuel-based info.
My guess is they'll have an electrical efficiency rating in energy consumption/distance traveled. As for a range type rating, it'd be easy enough to figure out, but I don't see it going on a window sticker (just like it isn't there for gas vehicles).
My guess is they'll have an electrical efficiency rating in energy consumption/distance traveled. As for a range type rating, it'd be easy enough to figure out, but I don't see it going on a window sticker (just like it isn't there for gas vehicles).
I want to know if I take the Volt on a 500 mile non stop trip out of state, what will my mpg be after I run out of juice on the battery? What will my in town mileage be if one day I forget to plug the car up or else drive quite a few miles and end up running entirely on the generator's energy?
If they derive 230mpg by combining electric-only and generator-supplied efficiency numbers then IMO it's a completely useless number (even if it does sound good).
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Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 2,154
From: All around
The latest issue of Automotive Engineering has a sample image in it for electric vehicles. I'm guessing the end result for window stickers will involve straight mpg, cycle mpg, and then a numbers box for electric use.
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Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 10,285
From: Albany, NY
by 2020 we will be talking about the all new 3rd generation Volt. GM is already hard at work on the 2nd gen and I suspect many cars will have the Volts powertrain by 2020.
If they could sell 20,000 Volts a year that would probably be enough to cancel out every V8 car GM makes. Cars like the Cruze, Spark, Aveo/Agile, Malibu should be above the 2020 CAFE on their own. I expect the Cruze, Spark, Aveo/Agile to be 50mpg cars by 2020 and the Malibu should be 40mpg by then just from HCCI and a 6 speed, if not much much sooner.
by 2020 I expect to see gas in the $8 range and 20%+ of the new cars sold will be plug-ins of some kind.
If they could sell 20,000 Volts a year that would probably be enough to cancel out every V8 car GM makes. Cars like the Cruze, Spark, Aveo/Agile, Malibu should be above the 2020 CAFE on their own. I expect the Cruze, Spark, Aveo/Agile to be 50mpg cars by 2020 and the Malibu should be 40mpg by then just from HCCI and a 6 speed, if not much much sooner.
by 2020 I expect to see gas in the $8 range and 20%+ of the new cars sold will be plug-ins of some kind.