bossco

Get ready to cry, they've extended the Bullitt for another season.

guionM

You'll see the Bullitt all the way up till the new Mustang hits production.

Word on the street is that the new Mustang's been moved ahead and will be out by the the time the new Camaro is.

GTOJack

Jan. 09 = 2010 Mustang. Will Ford or GM be the first to announce price?

falchulk

So when wil the glass top debut? Sept?

Derek Smalls

Ford is holding all the pony car cards. The general public doesn't know a new Mustang is coming next spring,and GM tipped their cards way too early with Transformers and the no camo pictures that are clogging up every message board. The Camaro might pull a T-bird and seem to be yesterdays news when it finally shows up,especially with a 5.0L 350HP+ Mustang GT doing its best to steal every bit of thunder from it. Think about it,we have no concrete ideas of what this new Stang will look like,the mystery is still there,unlike the Camaro.
I am of a big fan of the Camaro,don't get me wrong,i think it's awesome looking and i hope it's a huge hit,but i truly believe Ford will pull the rug out from under the general when the new car show season hits. Not to mention the ADM at the dealers,it could be summer or fall '09 before anyone gets a decent price on one,all the while everyone else is driving their Challengers and new Mustangs. GM really screwed the pooch on the timing of this thing.

falchulk

lets hope they both pull the te rug out from under the wrx, evo, eclipse, 300z and others............

bossco

Wasted effort, that crowd has little or no respect for anything with a US nameplate, you'd sooner get peace in the middle east than even the slighest bit of recognition from those jokers.

falchulk

Nah, I think good product and great styling will pull in customers from that crowd. Hell, most of them onlyl joined that crowd because they played playstation. Great product and the right marketing will be our salvation

guionM

Falchulk, all those cars you mentioned combined probally won't equal what Camaro (let alone Mustang!) production will equal annually.

Those car's following is by no limits of the imagination matched by their production numbers and sales figures.

It's like the Nissan Skyline. Every teenage male with a game attached to their parents TV knows what a Skyline is and worships the thing. But that doesn't mean they actually have the ability to buy it.

Anyone ever check out the insurence on an Evo or WRX?

falchulk

In sales yes, but its the "hearts and minds" of that crowd we need. These cars have the potential to bring exponential sales to GM and Ford. The same way that crappy product word of mouth drove it away.

GTOJack

I think the 300Z is actually up to a 350Z. I remember when the first 240Z came out in 1970 when I was in high school. Kids in Florida have found out what a bargain the 05 and 06 GTO is as the demand for them has kept the prices up.

guionM

I agree that crappy word of mouth drove buyers away from US based car makers. It was well deserved. Late 70s Fords and GM's cars for most all of the 80s and Chrysler pretty much forever took the cheap way out and it often bit them in the ****. But the way to reverse that is making better cars over a long time to change opinions, and it's finally starting to happen as people are starting to realize some US cars are better values and just as well made as many made from foreign based automakers.

Honestly, we really don't need the STi or Evo crowd. Even if GM, Ford, or Chrysler wanted to jump into that market, to be taken seriously, they have to not only compete in Rally racing (which hasn't caught on in the US despite being around for 40 plus years), they'd have to do extremely well in it.

This isn't a group or market where you can simply drop an AWD system in a turbocharged Cobalt SS and send it out the door, and expect it to pull in people used to factory rims that cost $2500+ per set, Brembo brakes capable of stopping 18 wheelers standard, an engine and drivetrain that is basically racecar quality and $33,000+ pricetags.

Besides, Cobalts are already grossly outselling Lancers and Impresas (what Evos and STis are based on). Taken all together, it would be a hard sell convincing any US maker to make their own AWD performance sub-compact IMO.

97z28/m6

too bad as it would be a fun ride if they did.

latinspice-94T/A

Ford won WRC manufacturers championship in 2006 right? The WRC spec focus is competitive, way more than Mitsu who had to leave the scene.

The Euro spec focus is one of my dream cars. They just don't feel the market is there in the US. Meanwhile, Mitsu and Subbie laugh all the way to the bank selling all the EVO's and STi's they can make...

bossco

Perception is reality Latin, like M said rallying isn't even a blip on the radar for the general populace, the WRC Focus could have steam-rolled the competition but its like a tree falling in the woods with nobody around. In Europe its obviously different since they have some kick-**** Foci (isn't the top model the ST???).

Like I said, its a wasted effort to try to impress the import crowd, they are what, 3 generations deep in thier conviction? Some of these guys are so rabid, they are convinced domestic manufacturers are so inept that they deserve nothing less than to disappear from the car manufacturing business.

--->that said<---

IMO, even by taking the slow steady approach to rebuilding thier reputations through well engineered and reliable products probably won't be enough.

I'm just throwing this out there, but maybe the path to success lies outside the country? I'm not talking importing euro/asian products developed by GM or Ford, but trying to dominate those markets so that the world see's GM or Ford (I've got the feeling that DC is about to become Nissodge) in the same light as say Toyota or Honda outside the US. Then going back and really tackling the home market.

Its amazing how bad the american public sees its own products, I hawk tires for a living and I've met people who absolutely refuse to purchase tires produced in an american plant, most big name tire manufacturers pretty much use an automated process to manufacture tires, both to save money and remove human error, but one people will invent excuses to avoid buying american made tires, I had one customer that said the equipment that produced the tires had to obviously been made here and by extensionwould produce an inferior tire.

I honestly couldn't tell him where the equipment was made, so I just shrugged my shoulders, thanked him for his time and went about my way.