OTOH, if the programmer or operator of the CNC screws up you might lose a part. Oh well, make another one. If you screw up in your work, Rich, or don't work fast enough, or make an incorrect diagnosis, you might lose a patient.

Big difference...HUGE difference.

Imagine Boyd Coddington (American Hot Rod) or even Paul, Sr. as your lead trauma doc. The mind reels!

 

fuel for thought
the thing wraps like an electric drill...reminds me more of a pit stop than the engine
http://www.angeltowns2.net//smele/video/f1.wmv

edit: this may be the same video from earlier in the thread, the other link is down so i'm not for sure
and with the budget they have i have a question about the headers. with all that money couldn't they just use a metal with a really low melting point, fill the tube of .015 thick metal with it and cap the ends, take it into a giant freezer, let it cool into maliable metal, and then bend the headers?

 

If the metal has that low of a melting point after they bend them into headers and use them wouldnt they just melt of the car??


-john

 

Pretty much....

They make those headers out of Inconel and it's really thin and holds up to lots-o-heat.

Bret

 

i mean have the outside metal whatever you want the headers to be made out of, fill it with a special metal with a low melting point. then put it in a giant freezer (big enough to work in). the liquid metal inside of the .015 tubing would turn into maliable metal. in the freezer you could bend it. then take it out of the freezer and allow that special metal (with a low melting point, hopefully a little above room temperature) to melt out of the thin walled bent tubing.
i'm just pulling this out of no where, but to this 19 yr old it sounds more efficient, no welds, can be bent to any shape with the inside special metal supporting the header metal, and faster thought?

 

Sorry, but things just don't work that way.

Inconel is usually the metal of choice for F1 (and Nextel Cup) headers because of it's ability to work at the high temps ecountered in thinner sections than other stainless steels, or plain steels.

FWIW, F1 headers are a little thicker than .015. The are probably around 0.5 mm to maybe .75 mm (.020-.030). When they were allowed qualifying engines they did use .015 thick tubing, but it could only last a few laps. Obviously the reason for the thinnest tubing is weight reduction. Same thing for Cup cars. Lighter headers allow putting the weight where it does the most good for handling.

There are a number of ways to fabricate the bends required, but that's another story. Low cost isn't one of the parameters.

 

Same material you can get for the Enzo exhaust ...... We have an Enzo here with a SS Fuchs system on it. Sounds...

 

Darn. I just figured the inside metal could support the tubing while it was being bent.

 

Some folks have packed dry sand inside a tube, sealed the ends and used the sand to support the tube while it is bent. A backyard approach that can work.

With a VERY high-end mandrel bender you can bend even very thin, tough tubing succcesfully. There are other ways to get tight, smooth bends other than using tubing. How about hydroforming?

Last time I checked, Inconel headers for a Cup car were over $6000 per set. That might be low. For that price they usually come polished.

 

How about this thing

http://www.radicalextremesportscars..../indexspec.php

Good noises.... http://www.radicalextremesportscars....runs/00004.MP3

Here is a pic of it... http://www.radicalextremesportscars....s/Dscn0021.jpg

Yep that's what you get with 2 HayaBusa motors strapped together.... Now if someone wanted to make a 4.0L V8 out of two S2000 motors that were tuned up, 500hp easy.

Bret

 

thats pretty damn cool!

 

Here is another one to add to the mix

http://www.cosworth.com/

Bret

 

20002

 

I wonder if they will spin the new 2.4L V-8's any faster?

Rich

 

My guess is YES!

With the shorter engine length they will be able to increase the bore and shorten the stroke some more and keep the 300 cc per cylinder. With larger bore and more valve area possible, they should be able to keep the same torque/L @ hp peak, which I estimate at 90-93 lb-ft/L. If they can push the peak hp rpm from about 17800-18000 where it appears to be now, even with 19-20K max rpm, to 21000, they should be pushing 900 hp! It might take them a year or so, but who knows...some of them might be there now.