Headporting question
Registered User
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,309
From: sebewaing, mi
Re: Headporting question
bret, the intake side is the only thing not polished up. your combustion chamber and exhaust should be mirrored. correct?!
ps: yes, i need to match my combustion chambers now after polishing, i may also have it decked to bring the chamber size down if i feel it needs it.
ps: yes, i need to match my combustion chambers now after polishing, i may also have it decked to bring the chamber size down if i feel it needs it.
Registered User
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 2,931
From: Upstate NY
Re: Headporting question
Originally Posted by limige
lol, i guess i was just in a mood, ace thanks for the link, i ordered it, i'll look it over to see if i wanna change anything i've done so far.
as far as on the clock stuff goes, my employer likes me to come in and check on the machines when we're really busy to make sure they burn through the night. i get paid 2 hrs showup whether i'm there for 5 minutes or 2 hrs. so i use that time to get some work done on my heads provided my machines are running. i could just go home but it gives me some time and if the machines stop, hey i'm there and can get them restarted. this has worked in the company's favor several nights when the wires broke while i was there. they are awesome about me working on my stuff. they ordered my steel for my sfc's and torque arm, as well as allowing me to work on my heads over the past year. i've made tools to check the endplay on a t56 as well as making my own wheel spacers and brake brackets to make an 8.5" rear work on my 4th gen.
i just wish i could afford to dump $1000 on the stage 3-4 job i'm doing myself to have someone else do it. but the fact is, a couple more dollars i could buy better castings the would outflow the ported ones. so why do it? bottom line is i'm scaping up money just to get it back on the road. i want to build a turbo motor next so i'm not really concerned with making this one get every last hp. as long as i'm better than stock i'm happy.
if you have the money, no doubt take them to someone. if not, and your concerned with messing up your heads then just take a sandpaper roll and smooth it all out.
on a side note, anyone know where to buy a graduated burat tube??? i don't know of any local lab supply stores, i'm thinking of using a syringe but unsure how well that's gonna come out. 1cc is equal to 1 ml right?
as far as on the clock stuff goes, my employer likes me to come in and check on the machines when we're really busy to make sure they burn through the night. i get paid 2 hrs showup whether i'm there for 5 minutes or 2 hrs. so i use that time to get some work done on my heads provided my machines are running. i could just go home but it gives me some time and if the machines stop, hey i'm there and can get them restarted. this has worked in the company's favor several nights when the wires broke while i was there. they are awesome about me working on my stuff. they ordered my steel for my sfc's and torque arm, as well as allowing me to work on my heads over the past year. i've made tools to check the endplay on a t56 as well as making my own wheel spacers and brake brackets to make an 8.5" rear work on my 4th gen.
i just wish i could afford to dump $1000 on the stage 3-4 job i'm doing myself to have someone else do it. but the fact is, a couple more dollars i could buy better castings the would outflow the ported ones. so why do it? bottom line is i'm scaping up money just to get it back on the road. i want to build a turbo motor next so i'm not really concerned with making this one get every last hp. as long as i'm better than stock i'm happy.
if you have the money, no doubt take them to someone. if not, and your concerned with messing up your heads then just take a sandpaper roll and smooth it all out.
on a side note, anyone know where to buy a graduated burat tube??? i don't know of any local lab supply stores, i'm thinking of using a syringe but unsure how well that's gonna come out. 1cc is equal to 1 ml right?
Try Comp Cams P/N 4991 for the burette or P/N 4974 for the complete kit. The economy kit is 4975.
http://compcams.com/Technical/Curren...ML/368-389.asp
Scroll down to pg. 385.
Registered User
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 401
From: VA
Re: Headporting question
Best knowledge you'll ever aquire is self taught sometimes.... my advice is get a lt1 head and have it cut in half down through the port and across the length.... then you have a guide to where material can or cant be removed..As far as tips or tricks ,while thier may be some alot of porting is trial and error ,,,just have some clay and epoxy handy and get to working...
Registered User
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,309
From: sebewaing, mi
Re: Headporting question
What would you use clay for? also where can you find high temp epoxies for use on heads? i did blow through in the bottom of the intake bowl near the guide, but i just had that welded up and reground it in.
thanks for the link for comp cams, can any cc. dealer order this stuff??
as for cutting one in half i can do it easy on the edm's but i posted several times looking for junk heads and nobody responded. i want a pair for mockup to do my turbo piping and i'd like to cut one up like you suggested. if anyone cares to donate a junk head, i'd be glad to post pictures and measurements.
mike
thanks for the link for comp cams, can any cc. dealer order this stuff??
as for cutting one in half i can do it easy on the edm's but i posted several times looking for junk heads and nobody responded. i want a pair for mockup to do my turbo piping and i'd like to cut one up like you suggested. if anyone cares to donate a junk head, i'd be glad to post pictures and measurements.
mike
Banned
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 6,518
Re: Headporting question
Originally Posted by limige
What would you use clay for?
Originally Posted by limige
also where can you find high temp epoxies for use on heads?
[QUOTE=limige]thanks for the link for comp cams, can any cc. dealer order this stuff??/QUOTE]
Yep Comp Dealers can get them for you, 4975 is $100
Originally Posted by Joes94TA
Best knowledge you'll ever aquire is self taught sometimes.... my advice is get a lt1 head and have it cut in half down through the port and across the length.... then you have a guide to where material can or cant be removed..As far as tips or tricks ,while thier may be some alot of porting is trial and error ,,,just have some clay and epoxy handy and get to working...
Bret
Moderator
Joined: Dec 1969
Posts: 10,745
From: Buffalo, New York
Re: Headporting question
I have become a believer in specialization.
I needed to put up some drywall recently. I built the partition, no one will ever see it anyway. But I have previously put up drywall. Ever try to put up drywall? Ever see a pro do it? Self reliance is good, but just 'cause you CAN do something yourself doesn't mean you SHOULD do it. I had a guy come in, money well spent.
My race car needs paint, my friend is a painter. I setup the data acquisition system on his car and maintain his website, he is painting the car. I COULD cover the surfaces with paint, but how would it look compared to his work? Not too good. He COULD have setup the system on his car or done his own site, but I am much more familiar with that stuff than he is.
Every situation is different.
Just rambling, thanks for listening.
Rich
I needed to put up some drywall recently. I built the partition, no one will ever see it anyway. But I have previously put up drywall. Ever try to put up drywall? Ever see a pro do it? Self reliance is good, but just 'cause you CAN do something yourself doesn't mean you SHOULD do it. I had a guy come in, money well spent.
My race car needs paint, my friend is a painter. I setup the data acquisition system on his car and maintain his website, he is painting the car. I COULD cover the surfaces with paint, but how would it look compared to his work? Not too good. He COULD have setup the system on his car or done his own site, but I am much more familiar with that stuff than he is.
Every situation is different.
Just rambling, thanks for listening.
Rich
Registered User
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 401
From: VA
Re: Headporting question
[QUOTE=SStrokerAce]To build up areas and see what that does on the flow bench
Edelbrock has one that you can use....
Well your partly right other than I get to watch and he shows me more info than most share, that and the fact no money is exchanged since he helps me I help him 
we do everything in-house as it were...
I wasn't saying that everyone should port heads,I'm just speaking in general sometimes being fed to the wolves is how some of the best tuners,builders,porters come to be!!
Edelbrock has one that you can use....
Originally Posted by limige
thanks for the link for comp cams, can any cc. dealer order this stuff??/QUOTE]
Yep Comp Dealers can get them for you, 4975 is $100
True but you don't your own heads... so you would be lumped into the rest of us paying for good work. I'm sure EB likes that you don't port your own.
Bret
Yep Comp Dealers can get them for you, 4975 is $100
True but you don't your own heads... so you would be lumped into the rest of us paying for good work. I'm sure EB likes that you don't port your own.
Bret
we do everything in-house as it were...I wasn't saying that everyone should port heads,I'm just speaking in general sometimes being fed to the wolves is how some of the best tuners,builders,porters come to be!!
Last edited by Joes94TA; May 24, 2005 at 04:37 PM.
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2004
Posts: 55
Re: Headporting question
Is there a reason that vendors offer
cylinder heads with intake ports
that are sub-optimum?
You would think that vendors would know
more about this than some guy with a shop vac
and a dremel tool.
IMO, the only thing that should be custom is...
port to port matching, intake manifold - cyl head.
cylinder heads with intake ports
that are sub-optimum?
You would think that vendors would know
more about this than some guy with a shop vac
and a dremel tool.
IMO, the only thing that should be custom is...
port to port matching, intake manifold - cyl head.
Moderator
Joined: Dec 1969
Posts: 10,745
From: Buffalo, New York
Re: Headporting question
Originally Posted by contactpatch
Is there a reason that vendors offer
cylinder heads with intake ports
that are sub-optimum?
You would think that vendors would know
more about this than some guy with a shop vac
and a dremel tool.
IMO, the only thing that should be custom is...
port to port matching, intake manifold - cyl head.
cylinder heads with intake ports
that are sub-optimum?
You would think that vendors would know
more about this than some guy with a shop vac
and a dremel tool.
IMO, the only thing that should be custom is...
port to port matching, intake manifold - cyl head.
Rich
Registered User
Joined: Oct 2001
Posts: 401
From: VA
Re: Headporting question
Originally Posted by SStrokerAce
Joe,
It's always nice when they are "in house"
So the new motors up and running yet? That should be interesting when they are.
Bret
It's always nice when they are "in house"
So the new motors up and running yet? That should be interesting when they are.
Bret
Registered User
Joined: Oct 2002
Posts: 2,931
From: Upstate NY
Re: Headporting question
Originally Posted by contactpatch
Is there a reason that vendors offer
cylinder heads with intake ports
that are sub-optimum?
You would think that vendors would know
more about this than some guy with a shop vac
and a dremel tool.
IMO, the only thing that should be custom is...
port to port matching, intake manifold - cyl head.
cylinder heads with intake ports
that are sub-optimum?
You would think that vendors would know
more about this than some guy with a shop vac
and a dremel tool.
IMO, the only thing that should be custom is...
port to port matching, intake manifold - cyl head.
Heads can be ported for different applications, so often the "as cast" ports are not really optimal. Taking out material is a lot easier than putting it back in, so if anything the ports will be closer to a minimum size rather than a maximum.
If a given head porter develops a port that works "optimally" for a given engine/vehicle application, that port can be digitized and replicated by a good CNC mill. Folks like WeldTech do just that. Some of their stuff is pretty much "optimal". My guess is that Chevy did just about that for the LS7 heads. Of course they had the $ available to do that, which will be reflected in the vehicle price. It doesn't hurt the marketing image either to have fully CNC ported heads.
Of course manufacturers like Brodix, AFR, etc. know more that the average swinging Richard with a Dremel and a shop vac but they don't necessarily know what the head will be used for and they need to meet price points to be competitive. Look at LE1, 2 and 3 port jobs. They are designed for different combinations. One size (or shape) doesn't necessarily fit all (engines or pocketbooks).
FWIW, sometimes you might not want the intake port to exactly match the head. Again, it depends on the intended use and design of the engine/vehicle combination.
My highly opinionated $.02.
