Thanks Chuck, we all enjoy your coming here, even those of us who have no idea what your talking about

 

I know we are not supposed to "ditto",
but
"ditto" to what Doc said.

Thanks Chuck, and everyone, who took the time to post here.

Seriously, the reason I post questions on this board is to get good info, and that's what I'm getting.

Karl

PS: My 2nd question, what is it that helps an engine to NOT detonate, in regaurds to the cooling system?

 

so are you guys running a thermostat in the LT1. I have seen 10 degree increase in water temp. from 200 to 210+

 

That's not a bad thing. Increases in water temp with Evans NPG is common and all though you can loose VE to increases in engine temp the added thermal efficency of the motor usually makes up for it. The motor is going to be much less likely to detonate (if at all) with the NPG so you are not better off staying with water.

Bret

 

wow, first time i have read this topic, and thanks for the great input. i just never bought it because it costs so much more than regular antifreeze, lol! sometimes i do cheap out on certain things but I have never had any cooling issues with the motor except when the fan died, and or when the pump died. lol! but that had nothing to do with the coolant mixture used.

maybe it is time to breakdown and buy the Evans! sounds like it is worth a try, afterall the block and rad is currently drained (sitting in the car)

thanks to MR. Horsepower and others with the insite, and their experiences!!!
I, amongst (many) other appreciate the input!

 

My car will become a test subject on NPG+ next year and how things go. Knowing that the coolant temp could increase safely makes me wonder what thermostat I should use, as I have a full assortment now.

Also there is a really stupid factor that nobody has really gone after - propylene glycol in NPG+ has additives - but I'd bet it is not nearly as toxic as standard Ethylene Glycol or dex-cool. For myself, having now 3 heater cores blow/leak in the past 90k on my 94 Bravada, I'd look at it for that alone.

Coolant is extremely toxic. Inhaling only a few breaths of "steam" fumes could be enough to do serious harm. Nearly killed me, and now 4 years later my kidneys still arent as good as they used to be. Not to mention for over a month every time I took a leak the bathroom reeked of coolant. I have been hesitant about normal PG coolants because of other issues where water is proven and I know it's safe to inhale pure steam. But now that I've read on NPG+ even if it means a loss in effectiveness (which I doubt) I will be putting it in my truck and in my Camaro.

Propylene Glycol is used to de-ice planes. Our Company actually builds some of those systems. It is cheap for them, but the grade of PG they use compared to what NPG+ or NPG contains as well as all the additives make a huge difference in cost. They charge more for 94 Octane then 87 - but both are gasoline. The PG used in de-icing is also diluted a lot, as they do not need the benefits of a pure PG fluid.

 

FWIW, I've been running Evans NPG+ for over a year in my blown 385 and wouldn't run anything else again. Before going to NPG+ I tried water wetter and H2O, 50-50 ethylene glycol mix, 25% coolant 75% water mix etc. and couldn't run as much timing especially in the summer without detonation. I don't get any detonation with 91 craptane using NPG+ . NPG+ boiling point is 375* so you won't have boiling in the water passages by the combustion chambers. I use a 160* thermostat and a 3lb Radiator cap which is easier on the cooling system. With the 160* Thermostat my Temp gauge is usually at right above the first line on the gauge and on a 100* plus day sitting in traffic it might get to the halfway mark. The deisel industry has been using it for years to avoid detonation. I'm usually willing to try anything as long as it gets results and NPG+ works for me, Just my .02

 

I ran NPG+ in my previous Impala for over a year. It sure did allow me to run any amount of timing I wanted, and on crap 91 octane California gas. I found that my gauge showed what was going on in the combustion chamber....i.e, at a stop, or stuck in traffic, the guage showed cold, whereas when pushing it hard, the gauge would show hot. I love the stuff, and will more than likely be running it again in my new setup.

 

I intend on running NPG+ in about two weeks in an LT-1 with a DCR of 9.5+ on pump gas and on the street.Some of the things Chuck was refering to (basic things) have been done to prevent detonation.I just can't afford the research to try any more things.I will be running a Evans spect radiator,no thermostat and their water pump trick with an elect.pump and 7# cap as per their instructions.
We will see how it goes.

 

May the force be with you.


I'm thinking about running it myself soon, but i don't have the $ for some of it, so i'll just be using the NPG+ and 7# cap.

 

is it a must to change the rad cap? just curious, also will deleting the thermostat help alot?

thanks
taner

 

Taner,

When talking with Evans, they recommended running without the stat in order to ensure a continuous flow system....which of course requires a radiator capable of such flow. I actually found that i ran too cool when trying it without the thermostat, and went back to a 160* as a compromise. Your mileage may vary.

As far as the cap goes, it is a pressureless system, so NO cap is actually needed. The reason for the zero pressure cap, as Evans puts it, is to avoid inhaling the fumes from the NPG+, which can get irritating at times....based on my experiences. The stuff actually smells alot like pancake syrup if you ask me.

Anyway...because the Impala has its cap on the overflow tank as opposed to the radiator, and no zero pressure cap is available for it, I simply ran my stocker without problems. I suppose you could take the stock cap and remove the spring pressure mechanism and arrive at the same goal.

 

If you take out the Tstat you need to call them and do their water pump trick. This gains flow.There is no need to run a high pressure cap to raise the boiling point which makes it a safer system and easier on hoses.

 

OK so I guess the next question would be "what If I was running a mezinere waterpump?" what do you do to ensure proper flow?

 

I was speaking about an electric water pump.