I'm fed up. I've spent more time trying to get my car to work than I have studying for class. My car won't start. I've posted this topic a few times, but it still will not start. The car cranks, the car gets fuel, and the plugs are sparking. The problem? The car won't turn over. It will occasionally fire, but never consistently detonates. I took a plug out and the spark its getting is a dull red/orange color, and doesn't look very big. I'm not sure if that's the problem or not. If you guys don't know what's wrong with it, how do I know a mechanic will be able to fix it?

Before you suggest replacing everything, please note that I've replaced and/or tested:
wires: MSD Heli-Core, Universal set. 2 weeks old. I crimped these with a C-clamp, and re-crimped them to double check after the car wouldn't start. resistance checks out fine.
cap/rotor: Accel, 2 weeks old, no carbon tracking
ignition module: Mallory (OEM style); week old, same results as the stock module gave
plugs: Autolite 604s, gapped at 045 out of the box; three weeks old, fouled but cleaned w/toothbrush twice, have same results with other plugs with smaller gap (however have not re-gapped these plugs to smaller- will try it later)
coil: MSD Blaster (external OEM Style); my old one (year old) is the same coil, I replaced it with the identical one (week old) with the same results. I tested both coils as per Chilton's instructions, and come out fine.
battery: DieHard Silver, new as of yesterday, 12.64V at terminals, and about that from positive-to-chassis
relocated ground wires: to ensure a good contact surface
valve lash: I reset lash a few times with both methods (Chilton's and Haynes). Valves indeed open without coil binding, as I have tried to start the car with the covers off.
pushrods: they are straight as an arrow, not bent or anything.
timing: the rotor is pointing to #1 cylinder on the #1's compression stroke (both valves closed) with the piston at TDC (as per balancer). The timing light DOES go off consistently after the battery was replaced (12.3v on that battery) which it didn't before.
fuses: all of them check out fine, including the ones under the hood. I checked all of the fusable links I could find, and they're okay.
ECM/PROM: although the computer does not control the engine under 400rpm, I've tried both the stock prom and the one from TBIChips.com.

The problem all started after my project (in the sig). With the exception of a bad EGR, my L03 was running flawless before I started the mods. The car ran at one point with the new mods, but poorly. It would bog and stall when I put it in gear or gave it too much gas, but it idled fine in the driveway. The timing was probably the culprit, but I don't know how good the spark was then. I'm guessing it probably has something to do with my problem. There are no SES codes aside from 12, due to the EST is disconnected. Yes, I've tried starting it with the connector on as well.

I bought a new multi-meter and I have no clue what to test aside from the obvious. I'm getting good voltage from + to chassis. I've got little resistance from the heads/intake/accessories to the chassis and battery (~10milliOhm). I don't know if the spark is bad, or if it's just not sparking when it should. I have not checked if the distributor is grounded or not, but I will as soon as I go outside to test other things.

I put the stock TBI on the other day and noticed it was dumping tons of fuel into the intake. I had to take the plugs out and dry them off with a lighter (to burn the fuel out). I put the TPS on the Holley so it wouldn't flood the engine. Now it just mists the fuel (like it should) into the intake instead of pours it in. I think the stock TBI's TPS may be dead or something now. The weatherpack connector only goes in one-way... Anyway, that's probably not the reason the car won't start, because the plugs are still getting a bit wet.

Carb is definitely not an option for me. I've already spent too much money on trying to make this car run with EFI; custom PROM, Holley 670cfm, TBI-to-carb adapter, Vortec throttle linkage, etc. To give up now would be a huge waste. I can't afford a $300 carbeurator plus tuning supplies, and a $100 vacuum-advance distributor, and then a carb fuel pump and/or AFPR. Then you can't forget the extra things I'd still need, such as fuel lines and throttle linkage brackets and miscellaneous fabrications. Then it doesn't stop there, because I'd only be getting half the gas mileage I'd have with TBI, not to mention I'd constantly have to fiddle with it to make it work. Carb is definitely nothing I want to consider.

Tomorrow (or tonight if I can't sleep) I will check things with my multi-meter including the coil voltage and distributor ground/resistance. If that's not the problem... the car is being towed to a shop, where I will pay a million dollars to get it fixed.

:lala:


Thank you for reading.

 

Reddish orange is definitely a weak spark...it should be whitish blue, especially out of a high-output coil. Try pulling the coil wire off the cap and see what kind of spark you get there. You might also try unplugging one injector to see if you can keep it from fouling out long enough to get the timing set right. Check the vacuum hose to the MAP sensor....if it sees no vacuum it'll richen the hell out of the mixture.


That's it off the top of my head. Hope it helps.

 

Also check the compression, and maybe stick a vacuum gauge on the intake. You may have the cam timing off, although I doubt it since the car DID run briefly.

 

as stupid as it may be i had a similar problem and it was because a ground to the block was loose....it was snug but it didn't have the contact that it should have. if all else fails check the easiest things that are most often overlooked.

 

car wont turn over? have you checked starter or wiring to the starter?

 

Yes replace them...also recheck those grounds!

 

A few questions.

When you installed the cam, were you "real careful" to keep the dots on the timing chain lined up before you installed the distributor (on the #1 cylinder)? If so, you are 180 degrees out of time. I did that on 3 occasions until I figured that out. That is my first guess. And, yes, the timing mark will line up on the balancer, even 180 out. You must install the cam, spin the crank one complete turn, then you are on the compression stroke of the #1 cylinder, with the dots at 6 and 12 o'clock, you are firing #6 (lift the distributor, spin the rotor button 1/2 turn and reinstall).

Second. As I remember, Holley does not list any throttle bodies for trucks after 1989 (1990 and up seem to be different). They don't say anything about cars, but guessing that GM used the "corperate parts bin", the computers are probably similar and it may not work on your year vehicle either (I'd call holley and check with their tech guys, they never worked on new trucks for any of my customers that tried to use them anyway). However, I've been wrong before.

That may be more cam (What are the exact specs on that one?) than the ECM can handle without tuning. If the car makes less vacuum at idle, it will think it is accelerating and "add fuel" causing a rich condition. Add free flowing cylinder heads and you have changed the characteristics of that motor enough that the stock chip (or any aftermarket for a stock motor) may not even be close to correct. This may require a call to Ed Wright or a friend with a prom burner. (Guess #3).

Fourth. If everything else checks out and you still have a weak spark, I'd begin to look at the pick up coil in the distributor. It may be going bad (loose connection, etc) or a bad ignition module (I think you changed that already).

I'd start with the timing, verify that and then work through the list.

Hope that helps.

 

The spark was blue after I replaced the battery. The spark is on time (both valves closed). The PROM is fine.

it's going to the shop monday.

 

Ok, i'm probably not much of a help, but did you have someone else look at it. Last week I spend half an hour looking for a box of screws that was right infront of me the whole time. I think all of us have done somthing like that, just suggesting having someone else look it over and see if they can find something.

 

IT sounds like the pick up coil in the distributor went bad. I would get a remanufactured distributor from the autopartsstore of your choice and install it. Make sure you swap the old distributor gear on to the new or reman distributor.

 

where about are you located? any update on the problem....if it's driveable and your not to far maybe you could bring it by the shop to have a look at it.

 

Sorry I,m located in Connecticut. If I was within an hour I could look at it. Maryland is too far.