That's a pretty interesting way to put it.

A year? Far from it. One of the fastest cars through the GM system was the Cobalt at 19 months. If you ask the people who were waiting for it like we are waiting for the Camaro, it took forever.

The Camaro project is moving quicker than the norm. It seems like it is taking longer than other cars normally do because it has had more than the average amount of exposure and earlier on, IMO.

 

So they GOT a cobalt in 19 months, but we cant even know what the camaro is gonna be like in 24 months? Only thing we know is what sorry "spy" pictures we get smuggled. It's nonsense. I bet the G8 and the Malibu you coulda found out anything you wanted to know.

Keep the people in the dark who will be BUYING the car, thats really bright!

 

The difference is the amount of interest in the Camaro...how many people are on the edge of their seats wanting to know about future models of the Malibu? GM has a lot riding on the Camaro...and it has a lot of competition. GM is doing what they have to...We've waited this long, be patient, news will come.

 

Maby not the Malibu, but deff. the G8 and it is well advertised and well informed. Look at the GXP, they tell you everything. The G8 has PLENTY of big money competitors.

 

OK...but the GXP production car has been unveiled and is being released this year, before the Camaro, isn't it?

I think it's safe to compare options/specs/prices of the G8 to that of the Camaro.

 

GM is being far more open with the Camaro then I have ever seen them be with any new car. Having top GM brass like Bob Lutz and Ed Welburn pubilcly acknowledge the car and then go further to pull off camo and actually put pictures on the internet of test mules is unhead of in all of GM and probably autodom history. GM may have gone too far IMO because now the question that started this thread can be asked and while the answer is clear to me it may not be to those outside of the auto industry.

GM isn't trying to keep the buyers in the dark but they don't want the competition to get a jump on their plans. The sport coupe market is getting a bit more crowded in a very short time and Ford, Dodge and even Hyundai would love to have some specific info on the Camaro from an engineering standpoint so they can plan accordingly for their segment sharing vehicles.

The competition doesn't care that much about the exterior or interior to a point. What they want in the details on engine, weight, performance and other info that isn't able to be seen easily in spy pics. Ford isn't likely to change the looks of the 2011 Mustang because of how the Camaro looks. But they could plan some engineering development if they knew what engine the car had or it's EPA figures.

If you're not in a competitive manufacturing, engineering or design job or field then the idea of why corporate designs are kept top secret until the end is an foreign concept. I would bet from the length of this thread no amount of expanation is sinking in. Just know that's how the game is has been played and how its going to play out now and in the future for the reasons listed above

 

Pictures of test mules would not be taken if GM wasn't so hush-hush about the cars final appearance. In one paragraph you say that the competition doesn't much care about the exterior or interior and in this one you say they went to far by dropping the camo. Please explain to us stupid people outside the automotive industry.

How the heck would the competition get a jump on their plans by showing things now? Are you saying that despite the fact GM has been working on this car for a few years that if Hyundai and others found out about the look of the headlights for example, they could beat GM to market with that look? That would say something about GM efficiency now wouldn't it!

Okay then why not just show us the final product for crying out loud? With respect to your points about performance, you do not have to be a rocket scientist to know how the car will perform with an LS3 in it. An LS3 has already been torn down a few times by Ford and Chrysler already so nothing new there.

You engineers know everything about how to design, build and bring a product to market don't you? Everyone else should just shut up and take whatever you give us because you know more than anyone else what's best. Doesn't the Chinese government operate like that?

 

How many pre production cars have pictures of spy photographers next to them without camo. That is that are parked for the picture. How many manufacturers have preproduction pictures on their site as well as their blog. Different GM brass have commented and interviewed on the car. Not to mention the fact that Scott is even here dropping hints and flat out telling us info including correcting the media when they get it wrong. If this is your idea of hush hush, Im never telling you anything :P


GM's efficency? Not in my opinon. If Ford has a car that is close to being done. If they see a line or portion they like they can graft it onto an existing design and bring it to market first. Now GM is perceived as copying their own design.

Show us the final product? What do you think the latest pics are of? If the headlights were ready dont you think theyd be in? The interior is going to be different than the concept. Why would you give it away prematurely?

Man, do you just like complaining? I get the impression youd be happier if we knew nothing about the car until a year before hand, then one day it was released. Youd have the perception that it came to market within a year and all would be good and efficent.

 

How old are you?

 

My age? 31...

do you have any rational questions suggestions or comments?


Other than do it faster and tell me more

 

That is the topic of this thread. BTW - Based on your signature, I find you to be a bit hypocritical.

 

Explanation doesn't always lead to understanding. GM has treated this car differently and I surmise that it's due to the long period of time since they unveiled the concept in Jan. 2006 to the production date. I've never seen them drop camo and post pictures of test cars. That seems to have been done only because GM said the production car would closely match the looks of the concept and to appease the public and stoke anticipation for the car. This will absolutely not happen with say the C7 or next Silverado.

Each car company has had different development timelines. So in theory Hyundai could gather some info they are looking for and make changes to their vehicle to better compete in a shorter time than GM. And maybe the other way around next time.


The car is in development and probably not completed. We also don't know what engine will be in the Camaro and we also don't know what it will weigh or how many airbags it will have or how many gallon gas tank. So at this time you are correct it would not take a rocket scientist to figure out how the car would perform with an LS3 it would take a psychic.


I am not an engineer and I don't know how the Chinese government operates in the realm of automotive competition. I would also think GM is very capable of car development, production and sales as they have been doing as a corporation for close to a century.
I think your looking at this from the wrong angle. It's not that car companies are trying to hide things from the consumer (during development) but they want the best product they can so as to maximize their sales when the finished product is launched. How silly is it to be annoyed because GM won't show off the production headlights or post the performance specs of a car they are not finsihed with yet. Sit back and think of all the cars you purchased or all the ones you would like to purchase and think of the reasons why you want or wanted them. Those differences and reasons as to why you picked car A over car B is what makes that car a better choice to you. Those differneces all started out as ideas and concepts that were done to make a better car for a certain buyer and had those ideas slipped to the competition they there would be no reason to buy the other car. Because once an idea gets to a competitor they can use it or use it against you. That's just bad for business.

 

You arent making any sense what so ever.
You wana talk abou the G8? Then you must talk about the actual car, the Commodore. That car IS the heartbeat of Holden. There was a lot of people chasing test cars, snapping spy shots, but no idea about what it would do, what it would really look like, or any pricing or performance numbers till it was released.
And look, its the best selling car in Oz, or one of the best.
The Malibu had more riding on it then Camaro does. Malibu has to fight the top two best selling cars in the world, the Camry and Accord. Things were tight lipped, even though it was going to carry over on the same platform, but its interior and exterior design as well as its trim levels and pricing was kept silent till it was released at NAIAS.

Just because GM is allowing people to take uncoverd pictures of the Camaro doesnt mean that they are just gunna let the cat out of the bag. With the new Mustang coming out a year after Camaro, Ford could easily adjust its plan to edge out Camaro...at least on paper.

As Guy put it, the development of teh SN95 Mustang, Ford tried its hardest to guess what GM would do with Camaro. And even though the SN95 came out a year or so after the 4th gen, the 4th gen took the wind right out of Ford's performance asperations of being better. They did not expect that.

We allhave to wait teh same amount of time, we all are sitting here, reading and responding to as much info as we can, but no one here is getting to buy a Camaro any faster then the next person.
You must Keep the Faith and understand that this car will come to market as the best car in its segment.

 

99 - You are one of the few guys around here who can debate with others and not take anything personally. I don't agree with what you say but at least we can talk about things. We need more guys like you around here.

 

I can see how you might think that. Thats your opinon. I believe in debate and constructive critisism, cander and honest feedback to improve everything.(within reason) The exageration in your posts in this thread that if another company saw and brought peices of GMs design to market before they did as not having their act together. I cant understand how that is constructive. Im not telling you to stop stating your opinon but if youre going to throw it out there back it up. You cant throw out exagerated somewhat unsupported posts and be upset when someone challenges them. As for my signature

"The true test of self-confidence is the courage to be open—to welcome change and new ideas regardless of their source. Self-confident people aren't afraid to have their views challenged. They relish the intellectual combat that enriches ideas"

That quote is from Jack Welch. In my opinon you threw it out there comparing people to the Chineese govt and the like. Your posts are full of exagerations like this. Im challenging and debating you with the same passion you are throwing out. Think Im wrong? show us. Back it up, defend your position with examples not exagerations. Others here have challenged my ideas all the time and have been right. Im not perfect. Think that makes me arrogant? sorry...