Forced Induction Supercharger/Turbocharger

Forced Induction and the LT-1

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Old 02-08-2008, 06:29 PM
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Originally Posted by 97WS6Pilot
Shortblock: It is not necessary to spend $4000 on a shortblock. I recommend reusing the stock crank and rods. -20 cc forged "blower" pistons for a 355 can be had for around $400. So total for a 355 rebuild should be in the vicinity of $1500 with some quality machine work and assembly.

Heads: Ported LT1 heads need to be heavily ported in the chamber area to keep the compression down. Trickflows and AFR's have bigger combustion chambers and allow you to run more boost. I think cost vs performance the trickflows are the best compromise. The downfall to low compression is that the car will feel weak when not in boost (which is about 90% of the time). I recommend 9.0-9.5 for a street car and about 8.5 for a race car.

Cam: Get the cam that is right for you. Dont get into the bigger is better mentality. Decide if it is a Daily Driver or a Race Car. There is no such thing as a "blower cam" Almost all cams will work with a blower. Get the cam that works best for your style of driving. Choose your powerband. My choice for a fun street car is stump pulling low and midrange torque. This is where LT1's can crush LS1's.

Blower: Get the big blower and not the small one. Boost is addictive and sooner or later you will want to up boost level. Its better to have a big blower and a big blower pulley. A small blower and small pulley equals belt slip. Vortech YSi and Procharger F1A both make good choices. Both of these blowers have a more modern impellor and will make more power at the same boost level than the entry level blowers.

Pulleys: Make sure you spend time to line up all the pulleys. SDCE is good at this and also machining spacers for the crank pulley. This is tedious work but it will make your pulleys and blower last longer. Spend some money on the big block ati hub and balancer setup. Once you see that the hub only engages on the crankshaft about 1 inch then you will see that the stock hub or regular ati hub is a dangerous gamble.

Intercooler: Either do a big front mount or don't use an intercooler at all. The small twin intercooler and 3 core procharger and Vortech setups are very restrictive. You can fab up a front mount intercooler for half of the cost of a procharger or vortech setup. Whether you use an intercooler or not a Methanol Injection kit will improve both power and reliability. It is a must have in my book.

Bypass Valve: Get a quality mondo or ati race bypass valve. It will provide a smooth transition from vacuum to boost to prevent wheel spin. It will also last longer and not leak.

Computer and Tuning: This is the life of your engine and all the money you spent. I recommend the dynojet wideband commander be mounted in a guage pod so you can monitor your engine all the time. Tuning software is a must have so you can tweak the air fuel ratio and timing to make the engine run top notch. Also a boost referenced(msd btm etc.) ignition box will help to keep the timing correct at all throttle positions and rpms. It will also ensure a good strong spark at the upper rpms. You should tune for appoximately 11.5-12.0 AFR to keep the engine running strong and have good longevity.

Fuel Pump and Injectors: Dual Walbro and stock lines/rails/regulater is a simple cost effective solution for all but the wildest of setups. 60 pd mototron injectors have proven themselves to work well with the stock computer and will provide enough fuel for 95% of setups.

MAF or Speed Density: I recommend the MAF be used and placed on the pressure side. Easy to tune and can be compensated for when it maxes. The restriction is negligible if it is descreened. The Maf on the pressure side and the bypass dumping to atmosphere will help to cool the head unit and intake air. Speed Density is a constant battle to keep the AF ratio right with changing atmospheric condition.

Cost: Don't get into a bigger is better mentality. Do some research on setups that are powerful and reliable. Use the for sale section. Have a plan from start to finish and stick to it.

Results: Forced induction is the most gratifying thing I've done to my car. How else can you have 700 hp and be a daily driver? I can't wait to drive my car everyday it is so much fun to drive. Better than nitrous because its there all the time. I've got 30,000 miles on my car and its still amazes me how much power and torque it makes. It also doesn't require much maintenance now that all the bugs are worked out. Gas mileage is about 14 in the city and 25 on the highway which is only a little worse than stock numbers. Try getting that kind of mileage on a big heads and cam race car.

Thanks CZ28 members for all the help.

Steve
wow awesome post. i am def nominating this for post of the year.

great job!
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Old 02-12-2008, 12:39 AM
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i have gotten but not yet put on edelbrock performer heads 54cc, edelbrock intake manifold, comp cams, pacesetter long tube headers, y pipe with flowmaster cat back. with all that and a new bottom end from eagle is there any way to tell how much power it will have NA since i now know i cant supercharge it with the heads i got.
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Old 02-12-2008, 10:39 AM
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Originally Posted by ascastil
i have gotten but not yet put on edelbrock performer heads 54cc, edelbrock intake manifold, comp cams, pacesetter long tube headers, y pipe with flowmaster cat back. with all that and a new bottom end from eagle is there any way to tell how much power it will have NA since i now know i cant supercharge it with the heads i got.
get some dished pistons, and you can supercharge it
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Old 05-04-2008, 03:21 PM
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Wow. Just saw this and just in time too. I was sitting here lamenting the (seeming) fact that there isn't a LT1 Targeted boost reference on the boards. Every place I look it's for LS1's 99% of the time and when you do see something, it's like you mentioned. IE:"How much boost can I run on my stock motor". Great Idea to have a more focused arena where we can talk and share ideas/experiences. You can look at my signature to see my Turbo buildup references. I wanted room to grow so I went a little more expensive on my crank, rods and pistons than I might have needed to for my somewhat modest goals of 600 RWHP. I just knew that the 'conventional wisdom' has been that the stock crank/rods are safe up to 500 crank HP.
Wish list for this forum Thread:
1. All inclusive parts list for a turbo setup.
2. All inclusive parts list for Vortech, etc setup.
3. Mounting diagrams of BOV, WasteGates, Boost controllers(where and why).
4. Sources for parts and supplies
5. Dyno sheets, video links of our progress at the tracks.
6. Boosted cars owners configurations and honest feedback (ie: what worked, what didn't)
7. Vender reviews on whom you purchased from and how good/bad the experience was.
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Old 05-04-2008, 05:35 PM
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I'll start off with my list and update the notations as I get things going.
  1. Turbo Model: TC76 w/MPS Wheel
  2. Waste Gate: Turbosmart 38mm
  3. Hotside: Realquicks Log Manifolds
  4. Intercooler: OBX 3" Aluminum front mount
  5. Injectors: 60# MotoTrons
  6. Cold Side Piping/couplers: CX Racing Kit
  7. Blow Off Valve: Tial 50mm 7lb spring
  8. Cam: Custom Bret Bauer Turbo Cam kit
  9. PCM Tuning: Custom PCM4Less Turbo LT1 Edit
  10. TB Elbow: Vortech Aluminum
  11. Turbo Inlet to air filter Elbow: Cobra 90 degree
  12. A/F Wide Band Monitor: PLX SM-AFR w/Gauge


Last edited by DirtyDaveW; 09-12-2008 at 05:29 PM. Reason: new items to add...
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Old 05-17-2008, 10:16 AM
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I had a question about how to find a fuel pressure regulator that can be boost referenced. I know that there are some that are vacuum referenced, would this turn to the same thing when positive manifold pressure was applied?
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Old 05-17-2008, 10:47 AM
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The stock FP regulator is vacuum/boost referenced. Works fine for most applications.

Rich
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Old 09-12-2008, 03:42 PM
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Any word on bov and wastegate placement? I'd liketo see a write up on that, and the pros & cons of each location. Also how about choosing proper spring size for the wastegate, and even more importantly, matching your turbo to your convertor (auto cars)
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Old 09-12-2008, 05:17 PM
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BOV = From what I've been able to gather, you want it BEFORE the MAF if you're running a MAF. This is because you don't want to discharge 'Air' for which your MAF has measured and commanded fuel. Next, you want the BOV a 'sufficient' distance from the MAF so that it doesn't cause too much turbulence.

Waste Gate = TurboSmart has a write up in a .pdf format that details optimal, sub optimal and poor configurations.
Here's a pic snip from the Turbosmart installation .pdf


On the BOV springs settings, most manufacturers have specific springs based on engine vacuum. My car has -15 psi (vacuum) at idle and -20psi when closing the throttle during driving, so Tial recommends the 7lb spring. With the 11lb spring that came in my Tial 50mm, the thing never opened. With the 7lb spring, it relieves the closed throttle pressure just as it should.


Originally Posted by IROCThisZ28ForLife
Any word on bov and wastegate placement? I'd liketo see a write up on that, and the pros & cons of each location. Also how about choosing proper spring size for the wastegate, and even more importantly, matching your turbo to your convertor (auto cars)

Last edited by DirtyDaveW; 09-12-2008 at 05:25 PM.
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Old 09-13-2008, 07:39 AM
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Question

What about matching stall speed to your application? Do you always go higher than what your blower boost at (mostly turbo related), so you launch at full boost? What if its a street car, you can't be blowing your tires every stop, so do you go lower as to not be in boost?
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Old 01-01-2009, 01:22 PM
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Originally Posted by DirtyDaveW
BOV = From what I've been able to gather, you want it BEFORE the MAF if you're running a MAF. This is because you don't want to discharge 'Air' for which your MAF has measured and commanded fuel. Next, you want the BOV a 'sufficient' distance from the MAF so that it doesn't cause too much turbulence.

Waste Gate = TurboSmart has a write up in a .pdf format that details optimal, sub optimal and poor configurations.
Here's a pic snip from the Turbosmart installation .pdf


On the BOV springs settings, most manufacturers have specific springs based on engine vacuum. My car has -15 psi (vacuum) at idle and -20psi when closing the throttle during driving, so Tial recommends the 7lb spring. With the 11lb spring that came in my Tial 50mm, the thing never opened. With the 7lb spring, it relieves the closed throttle pressure just as it should.
[/IMG]
Thanks for the info on the wastegate springs, it is something I have been looking for in regards to my setup.
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Old 02-01-2009, 10:22 AM
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Id like to hear about stall speeds too as stated above and maybe something on correct trim, A/R, Intake Inducer/Exducer and Exhaust Inducer/Exducer Sizes. Thatd help alot.
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Old 03-08-2009, 12:03 PM
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What spark plugs to use and what gap they should be at for turbo and supercharged set-ups should be up on here too if anyone would care to add their $0.02.

Myles
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Old 03-08-2009, 10:37 PM
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I use Autolite 104's gapped to .035 for my turbo setup (no alcohol, no methanol, no water injection) I run 93 pump gas from the grocery store, no additives. Runs great, no detonation and plugs look clean as can be.



Originally Posted by Myzz96Z28
What spark plugs to use and what gap they should be at for turbo and supercharged set-ups should be up on here too if anyone would care to add their $0.02.

Myles
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Old 03-23-2009, 08:36 PM
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Hello all,

I just saw the thread and had to post....

I have a 1995 pontiac formula 355 ci with a ati p600b.

I just wanted to thank all of the members on the forum.

Rskrause has been a huge help so thank you...

My car has taken me years to get it slowly to where it is now. A link below to youtube....

http://www.youtube.com/results?searc...pig+p600b&aq=f

The person posting is PAC1085, if the link doesn't work search The Pig P600b on youtube...

I may eventually want to get some info on what gains id get with a better set of heads. The castings are stock..other than the upgraded parts....

I have a dyno sheet if anyone is curious about what it put down.....I may need to update the sig..in that the exhaust is now a pacesetter set of headers 1 3/4 primaries no cats...to a slp loudmouth exhaust.

Again, thanks for all the help with my car...woudn't of gotten anywhere near this on my own heh


Steve
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