Bad Mods

This section is devoted to mods, in great part. I rarely see a discussion of mods (some quite common) that actually make the car slower or reduce power, or badly affect driveability or comfort, or are a very bad value. I suggest we start a hall of shame for "bad" mods, which I think could be very helpful.

Who wants to kick it off?

my list would have aftermarket filters such as K&N and Holley and Amsoil..

also on my list would be MAF for people who are not highly modded and not using custom programming or tuning..

any mod that is advertised on tv... like that propeller in your intake..

hehe

I'd second the aftermarket MAF thing. For the money spent, I'd want proven gains and not the crapshoot you get from fiddling with the stock unit.

As much as wish they did, it's reported that shorty headers don't provide noticable gains. The same with aftermarket replacement y-pipes.

As far as aftermarket washable filters go, they're not going to give you horsepower. If you've got a CAI/FTRA setup (as I do), the filter gets dirty quickly, so it's nice to just wash instead of buying a new filter.

You newer LS1's are just jealous that us 98's actually see GAINS from MAF ends/MAF :D My car ran VERY rich when stock and the MAF ends helped lean it out a lot.I gained .1-.2 CONSISTANTLY with MAF ends over stock in the 1/8th mile.But then again,we're jealous of your LS6 intake :(
Kevin

Originally posted by nikkev
You newer LS1's are just jealous that us 98's actually see GAINS from MAF ends/MAF :D My car ran VERY rich when stock and the MAF ends helped lean it out a lot.I gained .1-.2 CONSISTANTLY with MAF ends over stock in the 1/8th mile.But then again,we're jealous of your LS6 intake :(
Kevin
actually a friend of mine got a GMAF for his 98 Z and it went to crap when he installed it..

Hpp3 for manuals

Originally posted by psychocabbage
actually a friend of mine got a GMAF for his 98 Z and it went to crap when he installed it..

Yeah,I've heard a lot of crap about the GMAF.The only one I would buy is the SLP.
Kevin

I agree on the MAF. The only one I haven't heard complaints about is the Pace recalibrated LS6 MAF otherwise on a relatively stock car they're a waste. Same goes for a throttle body. Those are needed for big mods. HPP3 is a waste on M6's for sure & not that great for A4's either; get LS1 edit. Throttle body bypass is another worthless mod, that granted is easy & cheap but doesn't do anything.

hhhmmm, nobody has mentioned the tornado. Guess it would suck in our cars.

Originally posted by psychocabbage


any mod that is advertised on tv... like that propeller in your intake..

hehe [/B]
it was posted

got a k&N, but i didn't buy it for the power, got it b/c it reusable, maybe thats why i luagh when people have the k&N sticker on their window.

yup tornado......
and i agree with u guys being jealous of our 98s:D

I never thought of the filter as actually being a mod by its self... Its more like a must that the factory should do. The filter has almost no affect unless you change the lid with it.

Originally posted by SunsetWS6
...Same goes for a throttle body...

Not so bad if you port/polish yourself along with shaving the bump stop. A couple of free ponies and an afternoon of entertainment is hardly a bad mod.

Now, paying someone to do it is borderline IMHO. The BBK throttle body is a complete waste of $400 from what I hear.

Originally posted by 35thanniv.SS
I never thought of the filter as actually being a mod by its self... Its more like a must that the factory should do. The filter has almost no affect unless you change the lid with it.

dyno runs a week ago say otherwise..

Originally posted by 35thanniv.SS
I never thought of the filter as actually being a mod by its self... Its more like a must that the factory should do. The filter has almost no affect unless you change the lid with it.
i agree but getting one that alows air to flow better is sorta a mod:D

I'm not jealous of anybodies 98-99. In fact I wanted a 2002, which is why I sold my 99.

2002 has:
no EGR.
LS6 intake.
5 more rwhp.
radio controls on steering wheel.


Useless mods:
HPP3 on M6's, aftermarket MAFs & Throttle bodies(do it yourself) power pulleys, SLP bellows, SLP air temp tricker, cutout(lost 2rwhp on dyno)

SS1LE02 Love the sig, ASR is my foot. My ASR is broken and my foot isnt fixing the problem.

Originally posted by SS1LE02

radio controls on steering wheel.




my 99 has these....wierd:confused:

I may get flamed for this, but I've heard that stall converters are only good for 1/4 mile performance (or any off-the-line performance) but for normal city/daily driving, they're hard on the transmission and fuel mileage because it is allowing a lot more slippage than the stock converter??:think: I know that everybody who puts one in "loves them", but IMO it's probably 'cause the car is way "snappier" off the line, but can everyone honestly say that they're nice to drive around in the city (revving higher than normal on average?).

FWIW, a transmission shop near me (who installed the shift kit in my '81 Z28) will not install converters into people's cars if they're a stall converter because they get too many complaints afterward that they're not pleasant to drive around. They will order and sell you the converter, but it's your responsibilty to install it. There's gotta be some truth to that:o.

As far as other bad mods??:confused: I'd have to say stickers:p!!!

Chevies didn't get them until 2000 I believe.

I'll have to second stickers:eek:

now that you mentioned stickers...

there's some guy around miami who truned a v6 camaro (thank god he didn't do it to a z28 or ss) into a rice-mobile. he turned that camaro into a civic practically. he has that big ass useless metal wing... altezas, some UGLY ASS body kit, the slp quad pipe, stickers up the wazzooo (i think i saw neon lights IN and UNDER his car... not 100% sure though where the lights were, i was so digusted i was too busy :barf: to remember )... i mean, damn... it's bad enough they do it to cars like civics and stuff.... but when you do it to a camaro, your asking to get smacked. if i ever saw this kid on the street, i'd smack him because i think his mother forgot to, lol

How many regular filters would you have to buy to equal the cost of a K&N Filter?

What about the K&N cleaning/oiling kit?



Originally posted by redz_02
got a k&N, but i didn't buy it for the power, got it b/c it reusable, maybe thats why i luagh when people have the k&N sticker on their window.

Drilled brake rotors :bs:

sugar in the gas tank!! :D :rolleyes:


jk


well if we're talkin appearance mods along with performance mods then:

neons under the car = gay

Originally posted by robvas
How many regular filters would you have to buy to equal the cost of a K&N Filter?

What about the K&N cleaning/oiling kit?

Tyburn was running a special on the whisper lid with the K&N, got it for 30 bucks, in a package. Cleaning kit, i had from my mustang. I have used the same kit 3 times, and it still has some juice left. U don't have to clean it till 50,000 miles, or so it says in the instructions. Usualy clean mine every 20,000-25,000, free ram-air mod kinda gets it dirtier quicker. Last time i remember u are suposed to change a paper filter every 15,000. What else could i have wasted my money on, the 50 $ hose called the slp bellows, that has to be the most expensive hose i have ever seen.

I would have to say any mufflers. if you dont have long tubes, then you dont need mufflers; just get rid of them...my dynomax mufflers way about 65 pounds each and i just bolt them on for inspection. Also high flow cats...gutted cats dont do anything so high flow ones dont either. shorty headers also...maybe 6 or 8 ponies. Yes i have all of these mods, only because i have to get inspected. :mad:

I have seen camaros with fart cans as well... :confused:

also, when I bought my z it had pep boy futura tires...I picked up 9 tenths in my 0-60 alone when i switched to nittos...dont fool yourself, tires are important.

I would have to say any mufflers. if you dont have long tubes, then you dont need mufflers; just get rid of them...my dynomax mufflers way about 65 pounds each and i just bolt them on for inspection. Also high flow cats...gutted cats dont do anything so high flow ones dont either.

I gained 6RWHP by gutting my cats. For nothing this is a good mod

Whoops didn't need the top part of that quote. I'm just figuring out the quote option.

Originally posted by psychocabbage
my list would have aftermarket filters such as K&N and Holley and Amsoil..

also on my list would be MAF for people who are not highly modded and not using custom programming or tuning..

any mod that is advertised on tv... like that propeller in your intake..

hehe

i agree with that Tornado crap...
I agree with that MAF
but i do think the K/N and Holley are good for someone who doesnt want to mod their car and just to have it breathe better however this is a "bad mod" thread so technically they are HORRIBLE mods hehehe

tornado tops the list.....
id buy it and use it as a paperweight

i wouldn't even buy it for a paper weight, lol

-Porting the MAF
-MAF ends
-Afermarket MAF's
-Descreeing the MAF, although mine is currently descreened
-Tornado
-Pullies
-Shortie headers
-Expensive catbacks, even though I have Corsa, I just love the look and sound but it's not worth the money for the HP you get back:rolleyes:
-SLP bellows, no where near woth 50$! It only looks nicer
-Plug wires on the LS1, unless you are over 75K miles
-HPP3 on M6's
-JET stage 1 or 2 on M6, totally worthless....all I did was throw codes!
- IAT mod is :bs: IMO
-Removing the AIR system, no gains but cleans up the engine compartment
-TO be honest I didn't notice any gains from teh TB Bypass or FRA mod, but I am sure together with the lid and filter they all add up.
-Fuel Pressure regulator.....total :bs: even wrecked my friends fuel pump !!

Instead of buying an aftermarket muffler for that v8 rumble, all i did was do a cut-out. And i didn't buy one either, i made it, and it only cost me $5. Bought a 2 3/4 inch pipe welded a flange to it along with 2 bolts. Made 3 different size plates that can be changed easily and quickly when ever i feel like it. Sounds great. Turning it into an electric cut-out as we speak with parts from spare parts around the garage.

I had always thought that was a relatively easy mod good for a few ponies - of course, at the expense of your accesories turning slightly slower @ idle.

I had MAF ends on the SS, but took them off during an experimentation phase & still have the factory ones on.

Semmed like the WOT 70 mph shift was harder w/o the ends than with. :confused:

SOTP tells me that my HPP3 does better than factory programming - can't say I have time slipped w/ & w/o as my sig in the time was with it installed.

Of course, it was also probably w/ the MAF ends on as well.

I think it is far better to buy MAF ends aftermarket for $ 100.00 and have the option of switching back to factory as opposed to porting them, but that's my opinion.

Later !


Britt

HPP3 costs me .6-.7 sec in the 1/4mi whenever the temp is above 75*F or I don't let the car cool down at least 15 min between runs. Running 100 octace reduces it to "only" .3 sec. Worst part is I bought the car not knowing it had it, and not having the programmer to change it back to stock. $90 to have a shop set the timing back with LS1 edit.

Originally posted by NEWBIE T/A


Semmed like the WOT 70 mph shift was harder w/o the ends than with. :confused:

Britt

Although I'm not exactly sure how it's all tied together, the 4L60E tranny uses input from the MAF to determine shift firmness. If you port or use aftermarket ends (just talking ENDS or PORTED) it lets more unmetered air in and to the computer appears to be under a lighter load resulting in a softer shift.

I don't think it'll adversely affect M6 cars though.

I just went back to my stock MAF ends and noticed a significant change in shift firmness...Anyone want to buy some ported MAF ends??

Originally posted by nikkev
You newer LS1's are just jealous that us 98's actually see GAINS from MAF ends/MAF :D My car ran VERY rich when stock and the MAF ends helped lean it out a lot.I gained .1-.2 CONSISTANTLY with MAF ends over stock in the 1/8th mile.But then again,we're jealous of your LS6 intake :(
Kevin

i have a friend with a 98 he bought new.. Added a MAF and has had problems ever since..

fake side exhaust I saw on a TA..

:lol: :lol: :lol: TORNADO :lol: :lol: :lol:

are all bellows bad mods or jus the slp ones. I JUST bought one off ebay, it has no restrictions, just one big rubber piece connecting throttle body and MAF. It was a pain in the A** to put in IMO for less than 5hp.
My Airbox got completely taken apart to get this thing in. Do the Lids fit better not having the resignators? My airbox doesn't fit very well anymore. I think with the bellow not bending as much its putting more of a bind on the airbox by pushing it away.
This thread was a great idea. Wish someone had thought of it b4 i bought the bellow. Oh yeah and I paid only paid $20 for my bellow, so at least I didn't get totally ripped.

Funny how most of these wasted mods you guys mentioned you have on your cars listed in your sigs.;)

Originally posted by blacknight
Funny how most of these wasted mods you guys mentioned you have on your cars listed in your sigs.;)

Well at least that's first hand experience rather than random speculating. :)

Come on theres got to be more out there.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by FastrDamnit!
[B]Although I'm not exactly sure how it's all tied together, the 4L60E tranny uses input from the MAF to determine shift firmness. If you port or use aftermarket ends (just talking ENDS or PORTED) it lets more unmetered air in and to the computer appears to be under a lighter load resulting in a softer shift.

I think your mistaking the Throttle body for what controls the 4l60e its the relationship with the tps sensor.

Originally posted by SS1LE02
I'm not jealous of anybodies 98-99. In fact I wanted a 2002, which is why I sold my 99.

2002 has:
no EGR.
LS6 intake.
5 more rwhp.
radio controls on steering wheel.




98 and 99
Counterpoint:

-Bigger injectors (98)
-relatively accurate temp guage (98)
-better looking stock rims
-no radio controls on wheel :bow:
-no stupid air tube on the air lid

;)

Originally posted by GoFast908Z
98 and 99
Counterpoint:

-Bigger injectors (98)
-relatively accurate temp guage (98)
-better looking stock rims
-no radio controls on wheel :bow:
-no stupid air tube on the air lid

;)

Er contrere.....

1) yeah
2) GM should've made all of them accurate damnit
3) I beg to differ :cool: ;)
4) I love my steering wheel controls, can keep my eyes on the road :)
5) SLP lid will take care of that :)

Here's another counterpoint:
-Bigger cam

didn't someone say certain types of headers installed too close to the oil filter can actually bake the filter? and in some cases make it hard to remove the filter and the drain plug?

SLPs shift improver module.any mod that affects AFR and tuning isnt done is a waste of money.you not getting the full benefit of the part.


pulleys have been proven to lower ETs on these cars so i dont see how theyre a waste of money.

Originally posted by SpecForceZ28
Er contrere.....

Here's another counterpoint:
-Bigger cam

Actually,the 98-00's had the bigger cams.That's why we see more gains from a LS6 intake.The cam was reduced for 01/02 using the truck cam to compensate for no EGR valve.I "think" that's correct.

ALTEZZAS

Originally posted by camaro322hp
ALTEZZAS


You sir have selected the worst mod ever.

....Not an LS1 owner, but how about an "Airfoil". Along with, clear lights, 20"+ rims, aluminum wings, a lid....oops!

Originally posted by N2OpwrdTA
....Not an LS1 owner, but how about an "Airfoil". Along with, clear lights, 20"+ rims, aluminum wings, a lid....oops!

I beg to differ, I think Chuckys95 19" & 20" IForged wheels look GREAT! Thats what i'm saving up for now!!:thumb:

K&N filter: No gain on dyno, lousy fitment and debris got past it to my throttle body.
TB Bypass: No gain on dyno, but didn't cost squat.
SLP Loudmouth: Good mod on stock cars, but once you get long-tubes, you will end up selling it.
MAC cats that come with their headers: For the love of god, throw these directly into the trash. Use your factory ones if you need cats.
Cross-drilled rotors: Look great, no performance gain.

The ASP pulley is a great mod, especially for the price. I don't see how you guys can slag it? Many users average 8-10rwhp and .1 with this mod, not to mention how much quicker the engine revs to redline. I installed it with some other mods, so can't give an exact gain, but SOTP is there and I wouldn't take it off to sell it!

K&N Filter: Only use since I have the FTRA, otherwise I'd use AC/Delco.
FRA & FRA2: Removing radiator baffling was a waste of time. I think it allows more high-pressure air into the engine bay at high speed, making the hood flutter.
Non-stock TB: No gain for me.
ASP Crank pulley: No gain for me.
MAF: Tried de-screened, and ported ends. Went back to stock.
TB Bypass: No gain, but makes it easier to remove TB.
Slotted rotors: Overrated.
Shock Tower brace: No perceivable gain.
IAT Timing Tricker: Made things worse more often than it helped
Poly Tranny mount: I've tried three versions on two different cars. Too much vibration.

I was just wondering why everyone says hpp3 is bad specifically for m6? what about diablo predator?

Originally posted by JeffHooke
I was just wondering why everyone says hpp3 is bad specifically for m6? what about diablo predator?
HPP3 is more featured towards automatics. Predator has more features for M6. About the only thing we can utilize from the HPP3 is changing tire size/speedometer, and changing speed limiter and rev limiter. Everyone has said that the programming the HPP3 is not that great. I like to play things safe, so anytime somebody says they had gains and a large group of people said things got worse, I'm not going to try it. And if there's a dispute on something and you really want to get it, look at the stats of the person, see if they're a member and how long they have been and see how many posts they've made. Usually the people that know stuff argue when they see BS. Thats what I'm doing. I hope to get the predator soon, cause I hit my 120 too quick. :cool:

Wow.....A 14second LS1. Didn't know those existed! I think you need driving school, NOT the predator.

yeah, i'm pretty slow, u gona teach me? :cry:

not unless you are in PA.

what's the elevation in Ok city? that could easily cost a couple tenths...

anyway...

i always thought the "bellows" replaced the air silencer crap in front of the maf...not between the maf and tb like someone suggested...
and anyway..how on earth would either of those ways help hp? isn't htat like saying you are gaining hp from different exhuast tips?

and pulleys...i seemed to notice a nice hi rpm gain. and didn't LS1 speed just dyno the ASP and get 8hp/8lbs of torque? i'd say it was not "worthless"...maybe a bit expensive....$250 by the time you buy belts.

Originally posted by teke184
what's the elevation in Ok city? that could easily cost a couple tenths...

anyway...

i always thought the "bellows" replaced the air silencer crap in front of the maf...not between the maf and tb like someone suggested...
and anyway..how on earth would either of those ways help hp? isn't htat like saying you are gaining hp from different exhuast tips?

and pulleys...i seemed to notice a nice hi rpm gain. and didn't LS1 speed just dyno the ASP and get 8hp/8lbs of torque? i'd say it was not "worthless"...maybe a bit expensive....$250 by the time you buy belts.

this is what i got, don't think its really a bad mod for the price, just maybe a bad performance mod. Friends say it sounds diff.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=38634&item=2428776540
Also,
1300ft above sea level, i don't know what the temp was that night, but it was in the middle of the summer, so pretty hot, even at night. If I still have the car in the winter, I will run again. (I'm thinking of getting an SS)

N2OpwrdLT1: too bad thats too far of a drive, but "I'm getting betta"