Ok I'm sick of this I beat 2 of these Beemers & yes they had the E46 engine in them, why do they do 13's? Exactly what Draco said, their 1st/2nd gear prolly gets them real real good 60'foot times, trust me, when I raced them, there was no way they would pull on me, the first one I raced we went almost to about 200kms/h.

 

There is ZERO torque compared to our cars....

 

Well, the M5 I raced probably did a 12.8-9 run when it beat me. Torque or no torque, that's fast. Though, the M5 is not the same as the M3, and in previous years has been faster than the M3 (from what I've seen). Good for a 4-door family sedan that weighs 4000 pounds.

 

Hitting 12's in an M5 is a very rare event. I've never even heard of it happening. I've seen a few come to mission last year and the fastest went 13.6

 

they put out decent tourque. tourque by itself is meaningless anyhow. the combination of torque and gearing is what makes a car feel tourquey. The M3 may have less engine torque then an f-body, but it has short gearing and a high redline. What that means is that the force applied to the ground is similiar, or even greater, to what an LT1 will put down.

Let's do some calculations to prove this.

Stock LT1 = 300 rwtq, 2.78 first gear, 3.42 final drive, = approx 2900lb/ft of force at the wheels

M3 = 240 rwtq, 4.23 first gear, 3.61 final drive = approx 3700 lb/ft of force at the wheels.

So assuming both wheels/tires are the same size, and the cars weigh the same, the M3 is capable of putting more force to the ground in 1st then a LT1 can thanks to its gearing. This also assumes both tq curves are relatively flat (they are).

The moral of this story is that first gear on an M3 will pull alot harder then first in an LT1 - in fact roughly 30% harder. First gear will get to about 40 mph compared to about 46 mph in an LT1.

 

Sure you've raced a couple, but what are the chances that M3 drivers know how to drive?????????
If we are ignoring driver error they are probably faster then an LT1.

 

Thats a nice little story!!!!
I think there are other factors influencing the outcome. 30% seems a bit much, but thats the right idea.
The best way i look at it is. Ask someone who has driven both. Thats why I value Andy's opinion.

 

2001 BMW M3:

0-60: 4.7 Seconds
1/4: 13.4 @ 106 mph

The main reason for the lightning throttle response is the use of 6 individual throttle bodies - with one TB per cylinder, throttle response will be second to none.

1998 Camaro Z28:

0-60: 5.2 Seconds
1/4: 13.8 @ 104 mph

***The same driver(s) tested both vehicles***

 

I think that is a large part of it. 98% of BMW drivers are NOT true race enthusiasts... though many may htink they are. However, there is that other 2% that buy BMWs who know their cars and that is why they get either an M5 or M3.

I have seen a handful of M5's do sub-13 at SIR. 4 out of the 9 I've seen. But these have been very hardcore racers.

The guy I encountered seemed to have a good handle on his car. I won't go into details, but when we linked up, he did a few vehicular demonstrations that would put most hard core drivers to shame!

 

Another thing to consider it, who would rev their 70k+ car to 8k rpm to fully benefit from the gearing? We might, but the typical BMW owner won't.

 

The only problem I have with that is that unless they have a timeslip to go with their driving experience, I can't have much faith in the opinion. No disrespect meant, but SOTP meters are very subjective. And they suck

I drove with a work associate who has a stock LT1 (pure stock), and in it, that car seemed very strong to me when I tried it - as strong as my car. I didn't believe him when he said he was stock and figured he was pulling my leg so as to catch me off guard and race me (and I think it was the torque of the car that fooled me). When we raced, we went to 110 or so and I had him by 12 or so lengths. A pure thrashing. That's when I apologized for not believing he was stock.

 

first gear ratio in a 94-up six speed in an LT1 is 2.66:1 not 2.78:1

Most beamer drivers are spoiled chinese kids whose parents bought the cars and can't drive worth **** or stuck up old farts that just buy it for the "status".

I have no doubt that a M3 or M5 with a good driver would eat my 14 second LT1

 

Now let's have a reality check here on the subject. I don't think we have any stock f-body's on here do we? We don't buy our cars to keep them stock. Should we worry? I think not.

 

yeah but last time I checked an LT1 with ram-air runs 13.8@102-103mph, now remember you can't launch it aswell.

 

2002 BMW M3 *vs* 00 WS6 Trans Am

0 - 60 in 4.7 *vs* 5.0

1/4 m in 13. 2 @ 107 mph *vs* 13.5 @ 107

This is just a car stats figure but Ive heard these m3's can really move . Something to do with the optional transmission or the way they can change gears without a clutch too I know Im not looking foreward to running one yet with just my mods