A buddy of mine has 20,000-25,000 dollars to make a completely stock 96 6spd formula into a 900-1000rwhp beast. I was wondering what motor setup would be the strongest setup to handle a shot somewhere in the 300-400 hp shot range. What would be the best block, CI, heads, cam, and rotating assembly, will be using a direct port N20 system. Any information i can pass on would be great let me know if someone out there has done somthing like this before this car will be shipped to UAE when it is done being built.

Thanks
Justin Falla

 

To make that kind of RWHP it will take a big inch motor with a blower and some nitrous at least. My dad built a motor last year to make 1100-1200 flywheel H.P. and he started with a 512ci BBC and with the help of a D3R Procharger and Brodix heads it made 1200h.p. on the dyno but that is less than 1000rwhp in a car with an auto tranny. He has a big task ahead of him for a SBC but it can be done and it won't be streetable. Goodluck

 

There are a couple of issues here. I am pretty familir with them, as last years combo was pretty similar to what your buddy has in mind and next years will be basically the same, though the projected hp is a little lower at ~900rwhp. Last year was a little under 800rwhp (wasn't dynoed in final configuration).

First of all, you need to specify if this car is going to be used on the street. Assuming it is, you need to realize that by far the most practical way to make it work will be a "dual power adder" setup similar to mine using both a blower and nitrous. Otherwise, you are talking about a 500rwhp motor with a 400hp nitrous shot or something like that. Some kind of sophisticated nitrous controller will be needed even for the track, but taming that much nitrous for the street will be difficult. I have used a 150 shot single stage nitrous system on top of a 600hp blower setup on the street, and it really isn't practical. When the nitrous hits it will break the tires loose at 85mph in 4th gear.

So, before going into great detail I'd like to know if he wants to consider a dual power adder setup or not.

Rich Krause

 

Yeah my friend that owns the shop was looking to see if someone out there has done somthing like this he wants to stay with the LT1 block he is willing to do whatever it takes for his customer to get atleast 900 rwhp he was thinking going with a stroker kit will full billet internals if needed to withstand the 400+ shot of N20. He would also like to know what would be the best set of heads and cam to compliment this setup. Please keep in mind this individual whoms car it is has the money to do whatever it takes to make this N20 motor make the power so please offer whatever you know works regaurdless of the number figure.

Thank you
Justin Falla

 

The guy wants to go only with one power adder and has decided on a fully built N20 motor he is looking for a high 9 sec street machine that can also put down the number at the track the car will always retain full slicks and skinnies on the street over in UAE the country he is from to keep the car planted on the ground as best as possible i figured that this setup would not be very streetable but you have to give the customer what he wants and thats what he asked for.

Justin Falla

 

IMHO,he would need a fair amount of compression,12-13:1,BIG solid roller,the AFR 215 raised runner heads with a sheetmetal intake.
Gopnna take a heckuva fuel system to make that all work,but im sure there are other oprions somewhere.

 

First things first. YOu can run high 9's all day with way less than 1000rwhp. There are several people on this very board that are running mid to low 9's with a 3400lb race weight and about 700rwhp.

So with that said, if I had a bone stock f-body had to start over. I would do the following.

Engine
High Compression 12:1-14:1 355-383ci Small Block Chevy
-there is over 50 years of development into the SBC, the LT1 was around for only 10% of that time. As a result you can make more power with a SBC and it can also be done far cheaper.

Power Adder
Direct Port Nitrous System
-NX makes the best stuff in my opinion

Driveline
Tranny
-TH350 or a TH400 with a trans-brake
Rear End
-12 bolt or a 9" 33 spline or stronger axles.
-Get a Locker or a Spool, if you plan to street drive it more get the Locker.


Suspension
Adjustable shocks and struts at all 4 corners
-HALS are my preference, ATCO's, Lakewood's, or something else may suit you better
-BMR is my preference on suspension components. You will need a D/S loop, sub frame connectors, torque arm, k-member, a-arms, rear sway bar.

There are of course other items, like the carb or the throttle body and fuel rails if you decide to go EFI. Either way there are several vehicles like this that are making a ton of power and are going low 9's high 8's.

From this point, strap in and hold on tight.

 

Agree, and a sophisticated engine management system to run it all if he is staying FI. The N2O will need to be a multistage port system. An Electromotive TEC3 might be the least expensive way to control everything if he is staying FI. Carb or FI?

Rich Krause

 

The request from him are:
- Built LT1 block N20 motor to with stand repeated shots of N20
- FI
- somewhere in the 9's or very very low10's
- And to be done with a 6spd T56 which we all think is stupid but thats what he wants i know if you wanna go that fast its just not practical.
- 9 inch rearend
- Full suspension with Hals
- So this leaves alot to the imagine for my friend with the shop i'm no expert by anymeans nor do i know what it takes to run that fast cause i sure as heck dont have the money for this.
-Also he said 20-25 thousand to spend on the full setup from stock 1996 hardtop 6 spd Formula to this beast 9 sec low low 10 sec car is it possible even with that amount of money? Remember he is paying for all his labor vs doing it himself as for my friends performance shop is doing it for him.

 

everyones got some good ideas here.

i would have to agree with RSKRAUSE though on fact that a huge hit of n2o on the street is VERY impratical. if its strictly a track car, thats a whole different story altogether. but if he plans on running on the street at all, thats not going to work very well. a better option would be like has been suggested, and run a dual power adder, OR somthing nobodies mentioned yet, this-

you know they do make SCs/Turbos that can make the kind of power its sounds like your looking for. i mean, your not going to go out and buy a 2-4k entry level blower and get it, but it can be done. you build a 383/396 stroker, with low compression, and add oh..say 20+lbs of boost, and your talking SERIOUS hp. thats only a thought.

if your guy is dead set on a n2o set up, your looking at ALOT of electronics and n2o managment. youll almost HAVE to run a dual stage set up even to hook at the track. only cars ive seen handle a 300+ shot all at one time (even if the motor can take it) is a tubbing out pro street car. theres NO WAY hes gonna get traction with a 10in tire car unless it dual stage.

last few things, first- if the guys paying for parts AND labor, thats gonna be all motor right there. theres no way he gonna have any left over for suspension/tranny/rear/chassis/etc unless your brother cuts him a helluva deal on the labor. second- like has been said, you can run 9s/10s with ALOT less hp than what he is talking about. if hes looking at 900+rw, he better be ready to go some 8s at least.



jon

 

I think of anyone here I probably have the most comparable setup to what he's wanting. I'll just list a few of my thoughts from what has been said.

Wanna stay in that Budget? Find a car thats already built (as stated by someone else above. Even if its not EXACTLY what he wants. My personal Firehawk can be bought for Under $15k, and I could Throw about another $5-6k at it and be running Low 10s, maybe squeek out a 9 if I was lucky (6 speed being the factor here). You have to consider here. Thing is, You're buying mods for pennies on the dollar when you buy a turnkey car. I'm not saying it can't be done for $25k, but to do it with all the RIGHT parts? Probably not. And having someone else doing the labor won't help matters in the budget department.

-Why a 400hp Nitrous system when he only needs to go 9.90's? As Nick said it should be achievable with much less then 9-1000rwhp.

-Heres my breakdown of parts that would work perfectly, and not be utter and complete overkill (Some may think these parts are overkill, if you wanna open your check book more, let me know we can get much more expensive):

Callies Dragon Slayer Crank
Oliver Billet Rods
Good N20 Piston, Bill Miller, Venolia, CP, Dimaond all come to mind
AFR 210 would be cost effective for the $$, costs alot less then the 215 in the scheme of things.
Solid Roller cam in the 24x/25x 112LS range.
A Single Stage Fogger
FAST EFI System (Bank 2 Bank will suffice)

Unless he plans on spending about $2k on the fuel system it'd be best to use a dedicated fuel cell.

Thats just a super basic rundown on the engine hard parts.

My Personal Engine will probably make around 700fwhp on motor, and close in on 1050-1100fwhp on the Nitrous. This is with a cam that is completely unstreetable (Think of a large SBC cam, This ones probabaly bigger LOL). For you naysayers out there. I am doing this without a fogger, and using just a two spray bar plate system (Class rules). All this in a 3100-3200lb car.

If he REALLY wants 900rwhp I can be of more help, but 900rwhp with cost close to 20-25k by itself. Then you need to build a car around the motor. Feel free to email me, as I have more to add.

Kurtis Tamez

 

On the street, you're right no way its gonna happen. On the track....... I dunno. Take a look at NMCA Traction Advantage. A Single Stage Fogger is allowed. These guys are using all of 300hp, and are running as fast as mid 8s. On Drag Radials and stock style suspension. Course its gonna take some tricky work with some electronics (No Nitrous COntrollers! Yuck!), and some suspension tuning.

Its not all about the tire size in a drag car. Sure fat tires help. But why do that? Anyone can go fast in a big tire car.

 

3 of our Impala Club guys are running LT1s in the 900 crank HP range.

A 383, 396 and 409. The 383 has a turbo, the 396 and 409 use N2O. They all run their 4400lb cars around 136mph.

John dynoed 517 wheel hp on motor in his 409 LT1. With his TH400 and big stall, he has around 20% loss, so we estimate 650 at the crank. He also run a 250/300 shot.

He drove his car from Georgia to Florida, had it it tuned at Cal Hartline's place and drove back to Georgia!!!!

Jorge dynoed around 490 NA wheel HP on his 396, and also has a 250/300 shot.

Dale, I'm not 100% sure, but I think his turbo car put out around 730+ wheel HP on his 383 LT1. He runs 10.1 on a 3.08 rear gear!!!!!! He shifts to 3rd near the traps. That's almost like a Powerglide

 

Combination Motorsports has an Impala SS with 735HP and 800+ ft lbs of TQ to rear wheels with a supercharged nitrous injected BeaSStie.

There's dyno movies out there for it doing the pull.

Mike