not as bad for engine??
Registered User
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 1,450
From: LA, So Cal
Originally posted by 1985GN
thats funny i have no clue who derrick is and i dont even hang out at white castle. bring your sled out tonight if it dont rain its supposed to be a good night ill run you and show you my tail lights you had a chacne on route 37 the other day when i was toying with you. after i get done beating that cars *** NCam85 wants to run you on motor. oh by the wya make sure you have that bottle filled your gonna need it for me. see you tonight slow boy.....
thats funny i have no clue who derrick is and i dont even hang out at white castle. bring your sled out tonight if it dont rain its supposed to be a good night ill run you and show you my tail lights you had a chacne on route 37 the other day when i was toying with you. after i get done beating that cars *** NCam85 wants to run you on motor. oh by the wya make sure you have that bottle filled your gonna need it for me. see you tonight slow boy.....
Registered User
Joined: Jan 2003
Posts: 9
From: Jersey Shore, NJ
Originally posted by Hawk
sorry bout this guys, i'll take care of these lower level racing thugs later and then we can get back to talkin nitrous
sorry bout this guys, i'll take care of these lower level racing thugs later and then we can get back to talkin nitrous
But i can enlighten u on N20...
It is a great power adder to make power cheap...Kits are around 500-up for n20 and super chargers-turbo kits are 3500. and up...
Bottle fills do catch up on u fast with a price of 4.00lb...Hawk will tell u that i bet...
If u dont get too crazy with using it ull be ok...LIke spraying to go to the local store for milk...LOL
NOS company is the one of the best followed by NX and TNT wich i know some people that run TNT and a LS1 and a 4.6 Stang...I have heard of people havin problems with Nitrous Works Plates for LT1's...Leanin out or somin cant rember...
I have been spraying my s-10 for over 2yrs...Just make sure u chheck ur plugs and make sure u have the right jets in there...Lean is mean...
Registered User
Joined: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,151
From: Surprise, AZ
Well, if I had nitrous I am sure it would be worse because Iwould use it as much as a turbo charger gets used. I would probably hit it after every stop sign, and maybe even while backing out of parking spots
But really, I don't know much about either so forget I said anything/
But really, I don't know much about either so forget I said anything/
Registered User
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 11
From: seaside park
actually i have been busting hawks chops about running for fun thats why i jumped in this thread. hey at least he came out and ran the car when i asked to run he ran me and Nick the other night. Hawk now that you know the time and place we all meet up i hope to see that car out with full bottle...lol
Registered User
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 908
Where are you guys getting that boost is a constant thing? It's not at all that way, unless you put some stupid-sized pullies on the SC. Under regular, light thorottle driving conditions, you won't see boost from either setup under 2K rpms. You have to spin the engine up pretty good to get it.
I can see your point of view about the added stress though, at least on the SC setup (from the harmonics of the belt/pulley). But a turbo doesn't boost AT ALL until you load the engine pretty good, so you're basically running NA until you FORCE the engine to turn the charger.
I know af a few GNs with close to 200K miles on the completely stock engine and still turning 11s like a cake walk. Most N2O setups I know of go through a rebuild or two before getting to that milege. N2O is harder on an engine, there's no two ways about it.
I want some vids of these races you guys are talking about
I can see your point of view about the added stress though, at least on the SC setup (from the harmonics of the belt/pulley). But a turbo doesn't boost AT ALL until you load the engine pretty good, so you're basically running NA until you FORCE the engine to turn the charger.
I know af a few GNs with close to 200K miles on the completely stock engine and still turning 11s like a cake walk. Most N2O setups I know of go through a rebuild or two before getting to that milege. N2O is harder on an engine, there's no two ways about it.
I want some vids of these races you guys are talking about
Registered User
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 11
From: seaside park
lol if your talking about my race with hawk not sure if you would see me in it sicne i was soooo far ahead, lol hes just lucky its a new engine and im still tuning it and running low boost.lol lol lol
Registered User
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 1,331
From: Huntington,WV
did you post this in the forced ind. section? if not give that a try and also ask how many guys running a s/c or turbo on a stock motor?(bottomend at least)If you will notice most of us over here run on stock bottomends with well over a 100k. I will let you be the jude after you get all the results back
Moderator
Joined: Dec 1969
Posts: 10,745
From: Buffalo, New York
This is one of the more ignorant threads I've seen in while, not sure why I'm getting involved except that I am bored. The question as asked, "which is harder on the engine, a trubo/sc, or nitrous? i'm talkin like a 100-150 shot", cannot be answered.
Before answering, the conditions must be specified. Mainly, is the motor stock and what are the conditions of use? IOW, you can specify conditions which will lead to radically different answers. But I will make the following genralizations. Stock LT1 or LS1 cars are nor very tolerant of boost, yet they seem to hold up pretty well to judicious use of nitrous. OTOH, the motor could be built up for boost and be equally reliable with either. Large nitrous shots (>125-150hp) are hard on motors even if they are built for it. This is due to the way nitrous is typically activated. Bringing in a large nitrous shot, especially at low rpm, causes a marked sudden rise in cylinder pressure. Here's a formula to estimate brake mean effective pressure (BMEP), which is the pressure on the piston needed to produce a given amount of hp:
BMEP = ( HP*13000 ) / ( L*RPM ). As you can see from the formula, the effect of hp on BMEP is that it is inversely proportional to rpm.
Example: if you had a 5L motor making 200 hp at 2,000rpm the BMEP would be 260psi. Add a 200hp nitrous shot and the motor now makes 400hp at 2,000rpm and the BMEP doubles to 520psi. If the motor makes 300hp at 6,000rpm unboosted and we add enough boost to get 500hp, the BMEP is now 216psi. So, bringing in nitrous at low rpm causes a large rise in BMEP, as well as in peak pressures. Of course, the low rpm torque advantage is why nitrous produces greater ET reductions/hp added than a blower and why blower cars seem slower than they should be for the peak hp gained.
Of course, you can use a progressive nitrous controller or various other methods to prevent excessive BMEP. But I am just trying to illustrate that it's pointless to generalize about the question. You need to specify what you are talking about to get a rational answer.
Rich Krause
Before answering, the conditions must be specified. Mainly, is the motor stock and what are the conditions of use? IOW, you can specify conditions which will lead to radically different answers. But I will make the following genralizations. Stock LT1 or LS1 cars are nor very tolerant of boost, yet they seem to hold up pretty well to judicious use of nitrous. OTOH, the motor could be built up for boost and be equally reliable with either. Large nitrous shots (>125-150hp) are hard on motors even if they are built for it. This is due to the way nitrous is typically activated. Bringing in a large nitrous shot, especially at low rpm, causes a marked sudden rise in cylinder pressure. Here's a formula to estimate brake mean effective pressure (BMEP), which is the pressure on the piston needed to produce a given amount of hp:
BMEP = ( HP*13000 ) / ( L*RPM ). As you can see from the formula, the effect of hp on BMEP is that it is inversely proportional to rpm.
Example: if you had a 5L motor making 200 hp at 2,000rpm the BMEP would be 260psi. Add a 200hp nitrous shot and the motor now makes 400hp at 2,000rpm and the BMEP doubles to 520psi. If the motor makes 300hp at 6,000rpm unboosted and we add enough boost to get 500hp, the BMEP is now 216psi. So, bringing in nitrous at low rpm causes a large rise in BMEP, as well as in peak pressures. Of course, the low rpm torque advantage is why nitrous produces greater ET reductions/hp added than a blower and why blower cars seem slower than they should be for the peak hp gained.
Of course, you can use a progressive nitrous controller or various other methods to prevent excessive BMEP. But I am just trying to illustrate that it's pointless to generalize about the question. You need to specify what you are talking about to get a rational answer.
Rich Krause
Registered User
Joined: Mar 2000
Posts: 1,319
From: Jackson, NJ, USA
Originally posted by rskrause
This is one of the more ignorant threads I've seen in while, not sure why I'm getting involved except that I am bored. The question as asked, "which is harder on the engine, a trubo/sc, or nitrous? i'm talkin like a 100-150 shot", cannot be answered.
Rich Krause
This is one of the more ignorant threads I've seen in while, not sure why I'm getting involved except that I am bored. The question as asked, "which is harder on the engine, a trubo/sc, or nitrous? i'm talkin like a 100-150 shot", cannot be answered.
Rich Krause
i just answered it on the first page,
. And it can be answered in a generalized case if you look at OVERALL effect of the power adders and how people are using them. And yes, assume 100% stock engine and street use. Basically, go see how many blower guys have to open up their engine and see busted up pistons compared to a guys running a 100 shot. And the cylinder presssure issue, true for your stats but damn if anyone sprays below 3000rpms anyway(it's their own fault), and the blower is always has the increased cylinder pressure. Average it out. And 1985GN, thanks for calling me out at when i had like 0.5lb of juice. Bet you felt tough beating me NA with street tires with your 11 second GN on slicks. I'll bring the slicks and the big daddy shot next time, then we'll see wuts up thug
