Most definitely. One of the most expensive ones too. But that's mostly because of the polyol ester base oil they use, which is expensive to make.

 

where does teh schaeffers stuff stack up patman?Ive been using 15w40 of that stuff, you recomended it actually

 

So guys where would the cheapest place to pick this stuff up? I see it for sale on the net all the time but is their any auto chain store that sells redline?

 

Schaeffers stuff is good, I have been using their 10w30 for a while, and tried their 5w30 last interval. It's just not quite thick enough for best results in the LT1. Their 15w40 should work out very well for you though. It's actually got cold specs that would qualify it as 10w40, but they keep it rated at 15w40 since that particular viscosity is popular in the trucking and farming industry.

 

This is just another CLEAR example of someone who reads too much internet crap without ANY firsthand knowledge.

First off, if you knew ANYTHING about real racing, you would know that Royal Purple is the standard that most all teams use. Yes, thats right... when you see them pouring oil out of their multi-million dollar Pennsoil Sponsored team it RP in those bottles.

Secondly, Mobil1 is absolute junk. Anyone who has ever done ANY racing whether it be endurance or sprints, drag or boats can tell you that Mobil1 is the best marketing hype since Y2K crash of the world. I have personally tested it but do not take my word for it. Use the references from BMW and the millions of dollars in replaced engines that Mobil1 cost them on the M3s. Every car made within the production release that came with a factory fill of Mobil1 in 2001 had its engine recalled noting oil related bearing failure.

Another test of Mobil1 is its absolute inability to withstand high temps and pressures. This was done using a Dodge Neon that we used to road race. In the DOHC engine, the cam followers are a roller rocker that tips the valve dependant upon the hydraulic lash adjuster's ability to pump up pressure against the follower and the cam. With Mobil1 15W50 the engine would only last about 30 minutes on a 1.8 mile road track in the Texas heat before a complete thermal failure of the oil's ability to maintain pressures. This hydraulic instability leads to rocker are breakage if allowed to continue to run. By the time you get to the paddock area, the engine would have to idle for 45 minutes just to get the oil cool enough to stabilize. When running a stock class, Oil consideration is of utmost importance. Using RP R41 which is a 10W40 based oil we could run endurance events with no loss of power or fear of breakdown. A lighter yet more stable fluid.

Another test we conducted was in our 1997 Dodge Viper. This car came from the factory with Mobil1 10W30. Our first day tests with this oil showed overheating within one test session of 30 minutes. Oil temperatures were over 260 degrees and would not show pressure at idle. It took a half an hour of cool down just to show 5-8 psi at idle and 45 psi hot at 3000 rpm. When using the RP R21 oil which is a 5W30 oil we dropped oil temps below our water temps of 200 degrees. Our oil temperature kept the water cooler by removing more heat than that of the Mobil1 causing more heat.

Here is another example that sold me... In 1996, my ITE Camaro lost the oil pump shaft with four laps to go. I finished the race with no oil pressure but saw only a small increase in water temps. I continued the race and finished in first place. I later tore the engine down to investigate why the pump failed. It was a shaft defect caused by a score when the part was machined. Over time the part began to crack until it eventually failed. When inspecting the bearings which had been ceramic coated prior to assembly, they were untouched nor hurt by the lack of pressurized oil. The splash oil and residual was sufficient enough.

Lately I have used RP in everything I own. I just bought a 1995 Z28 convertible. I switched out all the fluids and noted a gain of 2 mpg on my daily 150 mile commute. I was having tranny shifting problems which now are non-existant.

Another car I have put it in is my Brother's Evolution8. With the swapping of the transmission and transaxle fluids this car went from a poorly shifting car to one that can put the power down. A dramatic difference for racing but also one that made more power to the wheels. An interesting note here was that with the Apexi AVC-R we can map the boost tables and fields. With the RP R11 in the engine, we can see full 1.62 bar at 1000 rpm sooner which directly translates to a fatter torque curve and faster times.

I am not looking to start a flame war. But... when you make an erroneous statement like, I am going to challenge that. Especially since I have seen more engine failures and worse as a direct result of people believing Mobil1's hype and marketing.

In the long run you are right... Royal Purple IS in a League of its own. They OWN the domestic Industrial market in lubrications. Funny to see that when Chevron, Exxon/MOBIL, Shell, and other large companies use Royal Purple's parent company Synerlec for all their industrial lubricating needs... I would tend to believe they have a far superior product.

The truth is that I do not need those companies to show me what works best... I have proved it to myself in the performance I have seen with my own eyes. Below is a pic of our Viper running down a certain road of choice at a nice speed. Note the oil is cooler than the water temp. When running an all aluminum engine, your oil touches more area than the water cooling system. Oil is a greater importance and can be a larger contributor to cooling than you realize. It didn't take years of racing Porsches to figure this out.

I hope this sheds some light on which is better. As for Amsoil and Redline, I have used both. I steadily come back to RP each time for its amazing lubrication properties and cooling performance.

 

Nice post David. Thanks for the info. -AZ28

 

Sorry guys but what does RP stand for?

 

Rp is royal purple, I use mobil 1 in my motor and rp in my m6 I like them both and have never had any problems.

by the way if there is money to be made someone will do a "test" to prove anything.

 

I have to agree.... When I was crew chief for our Formula Renault racing team, everything was spec. You couldn't change a thing other than alignment, wing angles and had to meet a minimum weight. This leaves a couple areas to play with. Since the engines are all sealed from the factory and the computers are handed to you at the event, you cannot "Cheat" in the normal fashions. You have to test test test to find out what makes the most power, will save the parts, and what cools the best.

For us, RP was the best oil. In Florida we were racing at Sebring. The back part of the course was ulilizing the long straight and our speeds were as fast if not faster than any other car there. If only our 17 year old driver was up to the same speed as some of the Irish or French drivers who had come over here from the European Series, we could have won a few races.

On our datalogging systems, our oil temps were 30-40 degrees cooler than any other team using the factory spec oil. This also translated to a lower intake air temp which also lead to a better ignition table and rate of advance. All of you who know about programming will then agree that the computer will see these tables and adjust for more fuel. When running a spec series like this and you can yank anyone down the straights without effort it causes some eyes to be raised. We pointed to the oil and had it tested by the Renault engineers present. Since RP is a Texas based company and not mainstream International, the teams from Europe, which made up 90 percent of the field had never heard about it. Consequently, RP was banned from the first race to give the other teams enough time to purchase it for themselves. If we wanted to continue to use it, we would have to had donate enough for the other 20+ teams running the Winter Series.

 

Explain this to me then. If Royal Purple is such a great oil, why does it thin out so quickly in oil analysis? For example, in my wife's car, I tested the new oil to a viscosity of 11.4, then ran it for 2600 miles and it thinned out to 8.8 cst, which means that 5w30 went to a 5w20. Very disturbing for an oil that you call so top notch.

I'm not a big fan of Mobil 1, but it is better than RP. It does not thin out at all in normal intervals like RP does, and it shows better oil analysis results too.

I'm not some ignorant internet reader who's spouting out stuff without data to back it up. I've tested Royal Purple and Mobil 1 in my own vehicles and have seen the results first hand. And I've seen enough evidence of RP thinning out drastically in many other oil analysis reports for me to seriously doubt it's quality. Perhaps the RP racing oil that a lot of teams use is much better, but their 5w30 and 10w30 street oils flat out suck. You don't see Amsoil or Redline's 5w30 or 10w30 thinning out at all like Royal Purple does.

 

First tell me if you are using their regular 10W30 or their racing series lubricants. This will be a huge help in making a proper reply.

I also spoke with PatrickB@royalpurple.com and asked about the thinning you are suggesting. The difference with RP is that it finds the proper viscosity for your engine and changes its viscosity for the best protection. If it is thinning out then the tolerances needed to protect you engine in the best possible manner are requiring the oil to become thinner to get within those tolerances for best protection. RP then stays at such level to aid in protection for startup and not be much thicker as to not give initial protection.

Another point is that RP leaves a bonding agent inside the engine when it is used. This molecular bond is an internal coating that once used stays with the engine. Any subsequent SOAP test will be skewed by the fact you are still running on the RP Synerlec agent even if you have switched oils. So, if you ran RP and then put fresh Mobil1 in the engine, the Mobil1 will test higher than if you had never used RP and were just using Mobil1 straight.

I assume you have been conducting regular SOAP test of your engine..?

 

I'm not sure what a SOAP test is?

I'm currently running their 5w30 street oil in her car, but will be switching to their 10w30 next. I guess I should also let you know that I've been conversing with David Canitz of Royal Purple, one of their tech reps, and he actually sent me one free case of their 10w30, plus three oil analysis kits from the lab they use, in order to further investigate this thinning issue here. He did not mention that viscosity change explanation that Patrick said, and frankly that sounds kind of impossible to me, I can't see how an oil can "morph" itself into becoming the perfect oil for a given engine design. If it did, then it would remain at 11.4cst, since this viscosity level shows excellent results in other 1.6L Honda engines like my wife's. For example, my sister has the exact same car, and I've seen considerably better wear numbers in her car using the German made 0w30 Castrol Syntec, which finished up her interval at 11.5cst (starting point is usually around 11.6 to 11.8-so it did not change much at all in 5500miles)

So I do appreciate the fact that David from RP is trying to help me out here, but it's still very troublesome that this oil thins out so fast when other top notch synthetics do not exhibit such behavior at all. My wife's oil analysis results are not the only ones to show such a huge drop in viscosity with Royal Purple.

At the same time, her wear numbers haven't been terrible, but they certainly are not as spectacular as I expected.

I tend to be a little harsh on Royal Purple because of my own experiences with it here, but as mentioned, I'm still running the oil, and still do intend on running two more intervals with it at least.

By the way, that "bonding agent" you describe is simply molybdenum. Many oils use it now, due to the fact that it coats the parts allowing for reduced friction. It doesn't use all that much more than Mobil 1 though, my new oil sample of RP tested out with 110ppm of moly, Mobil 1 usually has about 80-90ppm. FWIW, Redline comes with 500-600ppm of moly, one of the highest amounts available in a motor oil.

 

SOAP is for: Spectrum Oil Analysis Program.

Thought you would know that... sorry. We do these on every routine or special inspection of the jet turbines i maintain. We also use this method for documenting history on every engine we work on or maintain.

 

I've never heard it called by that acronym, but yes, I've been doing used oil analysis on every interval with Royal Purple in her car so far, plus one previous interval with Mobil 1.

I'm actually surprised that with all the discussion of oil on this board, that there are very few people who do used oil analysis. You'd think more people would truly be interested in seeing for sure what their oil is doing, instead of just relying on the opinions of others to help them choose an oil.

Two good labs in the US would be Blackstone or Wearcheck, both of which offer reasonable pricing ($20 to start) and quick turnaround.

 

If you believe this statement:
"The difference with RP is that it finds the proper viscosity for your engine and changes its viscosity for the best protection. If it is thinning out then the tolerances needed to protect you engine in the best possible manner are requiring the oil to become thinner to get within those tolerances for best protection. RP then stays at such level to aid in protection for startup and not be much thicker as to not give initial protection. Another point is that RP leaves a bonding agent inside the engine when it is used. This molecular bond is an internal coating that once used stays with the engine". BS!!!
I have talked with a few independent oil testers over the years, and this is a first (the above statement). I have not heard of good (long run) results with Royal Purple, as I have heard with Redline or Amsoil, and neither have others who do the testing of this. I agree with Patman here.