I have seen just as good of results with guys running smaller cams (xe224/230, cc305) than a cc306 or a gm847. The bigger ones usually have more peak hp, but dyno numbers don't mean everything. Get Bret to grind you a custom cam for stock heads.

 

As for the 'ASA' cam; ASA term means little to me. ASA, LCA (LSA), or going back to the 50s/60s, 'full' or '3/4 race'. These terms mean virtually nothin' to me. Identify the 4 open/close points, and the others cam features/numbers automatically fall into place without any misleadings. Let's discuss the 4 open/close points (@ designated lift point) of that ASA cam. Got those?

 

I would speak to Mr. Bauer inregards to a cam. He is always in "CAM HEAVEN", and is extremely knowledgable. He ground my cam..

 

ASA cam usually refers to the GMPP cam used in the LS1 "ASA" crate engine for the ASA Racing organization. The cam specs are often quoted as 226/236 @ .050, .525/.525 (with 1.7 RR) on a 110. That should be enough info to calculate the open/close points.

 

Not without an intake CL. As you know Jon, there is more than one (actually numerous) way(s) to get a 110º LCA with the same duration specs.

 

I was referring to Lobe Separation Angle of 110 degrees. Sorry if I was confusing. The LSA is ground into the cam for single cam pushrod engines, of course.

Because the ASA cam, as purchased, is for an LS1, you could choose lobes of similar lift and duration (as white93lt1 suggested in the original post) and grind them on an LT1 core. Right?

For grins, start with it "straight up" or 110 ICL. You can pick other ICLs by advancing or retarding and when you decide what works best, you could have the cam made with that advance and install it straight up. That would be my preference.

Here's a much more thorough explanation.

http://www.compcams.com/Technical/TimingTutorial/

 

LCA stands for lobe centerline angle. It is the same as (what is more commonly used on THIS forum anyway) LSA.Yes, that would be a given.Pick other ICLs? Jon, that would the whole point of noting the I/E O/C points, or as previously requested, at least the ICL. Without that data, any discussion on this cam is pointless, as THAT is what makes or breaks ANY cam. Without pinning down those specs, any discussion regarding the original post (included above), is meaningless. The original question may as well have been... "How will a 239º/251º duration cam (on a 110º LSA) perform in my car? How many O/C combinations can we come up with, and still be at the same noted specs? Or for those that believe DCR calcs are valid, how many different DCR scenarios could we come up with, and still use the same above specs?

"How would the grind of the ASA cam perform in my car?"
Maybe you can, but without the specs I requested above, I am unable to answer that question.

 

Arnie your right ICL with a LSA gives you what you need to know for a cam... I don't see the point of getting all wiggy about it all.

Bret

 

I question whether too many people on this board would be able to speak academically on the subject with even that much data arnie. They are minor points and in my opinion are almost as useless as knowing the @.050 duration figures. What do you know of the mean inlet velocity during the inlet valve opening period and how that is effected by juggling our numbers around.

What about the average flow coefficient of the inlet valve?

Isn't camshaft selection all about maximizing volumetric efficiency? Yet we would rather talk about basic textbook cam events and nothing of mach indexes?

How deep do you really want to go with this?

If Jon isn't, then I am most definitely your huckleberry.

Take care,
Chuck

 

since it was mentioned, what the hell is a 3/4 cam anyway?

i had a guy at work ask me if i had a 3/4 cam in my car the other day and i was like WTF is that..so i told him yeah too spare the conversation time with him

 

Ok, I'm really confused here. The few books that I've read about N2O say that a wide LSA is best for N2O. Isn't a wide LSA a higher number like 114 vs 106?

Sorry about butting in this thread, but I'd like to know.

 

Good to see you around Chuck.

What have you seen in terms of correllation between Mach Index and large cam durations? Is this where the motors that can make high VE with Mach Indexes of over .55 come into play? Or is the fact that the Mach Index is not a dynamic variable a problem here?

Bret

 

Wide is a higher number, you are right.

Problem is you still have to get N2O into the cylinders to start with and this also depends on the amount of N2O you have, I would say that as you add N2O you will widen the LSA but I still don't think it goes as much as people expect.

Bret

 

Those of us that can recall some auto parts catalogs from the 50s/60s containing cams, can possibly remember terminology used by those that actually thot they were knowledgeable in regards to the cams they sold. After that terminology finally died a well deserved death, in the mid/late 60s, identifying cams by duration, but WITHOUT identifying the lift at which duration started/terminated, became the norm. For either point in time, it became futile to attempt to educate such proponents of these methods of cam identification. Ignorance can be bliss.

"what the hell is a 3/4 cam anyway?" Ironically, that was part of my sarcastic comeback to guys on the phone. Is it missing some lobes or what? Was the guy at work, an oldtimer?

To answer your question; 'full race' inplied a 'wild' cam that would generate a very rough idling engine, and presumeably allow high RPM operation. A '3/4 race' cam was a cam that generated a rougher idle that OEM, allowing higher RPM operation, and more power/torque output, yet be reasonably streetable. An example, via comparison of a 3/4 race, and ignoring any carb/EFI influences, could possibly be a 230º duration cam @ .05 lift, in a 350. Anyway, this is about the extent of my recollection. HTH.

 

Didn't realize I was getting 'all wiggy' about it, whatever the word may mean. I edited my response/post about 3 times to not make it appear I was displaying disrespect, yet hopefully get my point across.

Chuck, not possible to get to second base, if you do not touch first beforehand. If those that understand the folly of describing cam characteristics without including I/E O/C, fail to attempt any clarification given an opportunity, are they part of the problem, or part of the solution?A little... but confident, compared to your backround/experience in research/development, not nearly as much as you, Chuck. Of note, you would identify with this first through a physics equation, where I would relate more from along the line of torque curve generated. More of a layman’s line of thinking. VE? Unquestionably, as that is bottom line, is it not? Mach indexes... How many that field race cars, actually understand this? Those that do, are they assured of being in a winner's circle? Is THIS forum/group ready for that in depth study, if forum can not get beyond LCA?You are huh? A challenge this is? As for your use of the term 'huckleberry'… a little taunt, Chuck? That is how I interpreted your post. With due respect Chuck, I'd like to believe, you were not posting just to pound your chest, with that huckleberry comment. You feel I was ‘picking on Jon, do ya?