You think if i get a good set of ported AFRs 210's and a ported LT4 intake i can get away with a 4.10 or 4.30 and a hydraulic roller with a good valvetrain? I will have the weight down on the car not sure how low exactly but i will do a descent amount of weight reduction. Id like to be able to fget on the highway and be able to cruise at 65-70 without being at a totally rediculous RPM. Im not gonna be traveling the country in this car but id like to be able to get on the highway and drive an hour or two away if i want.

 

Working on the exhaust right now. It is mocked up and sitting in the car now. When I get some help and get all this done I need to mock it up and go back to the shop for final machine work. May be by summer if the weather holds out. It is raining and sleetin right now and to damn cold for me to work on it.No help either and it's hard to hold two pieces of 4" exhaust in location and mark it.

 

Don't think ya will make 10.5 with a hyd roller and a 383.If ya can turn it to 7000 and make the HP maybe. The heads will have to flow in excess of 310CFM at the piston-- not on the bench. A 4.10 ain't going to make it unless ya are putting 580-600 to the tire or at 3000lbs.With 450+ to the tire and then ya will need a 4.88+ gear. 3000lbs is tough to do unless it's a trailer queen.

Gear vendors works with the Turbo 350 if ya want to cruse

 

Hummmm i wanna be able to play with the local built up LS1's I know they have a advantage over LT1s with the 18 degree heads and the lighter block and all, but i like being the underdog and beating people with whats perceived as less of a motor.

Full heads and cam bolt on LS1s are hittin mid/low 10s on motor arent they?

 

LS1 heads are 15 degrees. The LS7 heads are 12. I saw the flow sheet for a set of stockers and they are around 360/225 @ 650.

I still hold out that a 383 is the way to go.

 

450rwhp seems to be the big wall people run into w/ LT1's ... atleast on stock heads (ported). 450rwhp for LS1 heads is cake from what I've heard. So if you want to make 450+rwhp you're going to need some expensive heads (LT4, AFR, Trickflow). Hopefully one day these head choices will get a LOT cheaper and us LT1 guys will have a cheap alternative to keep up with / beat LS1 guys...

 

I have no problem spending the $ on AFR's and good porting, im wondering about what else im gonna need in my combo to support them. The intake is my big worry right now honestly.

Oh and i plan on taking a sledgehammer to the 450RWHP wall if possible. Even thinking about 1st gen SBC heads being converted to reverse flow cooling. Brodix track 1 heads always seemed like a great head for the price.

 

http://web.camaross.com/forums/showt...hlight=top+end

600hp top end right there, course he wasnt using a hyd

Steve

 

Always that darn big $ intake. Whats the most power someone has made with an LT4 intake? I really dont want to spend that kind of cheese on just a intake manifold. Heck i could see spending a G total on an intake even but not 2500

 

It can be done with an LT4 Intake and some ported AFR's with a well thought out cam and a precision bottom end. But since you are planning to stick with an LT4 intake then I would suggest going the stroker route cuz those intakes arent made for high rpm.

Steve

 

Just my experience on the subject.

My ta 383 afr 210 vortec sq made over 600 rwhp with 11 pounds boost

My brother in laws ss 355 ati lt4 made over 600 rwhp with 15 pounds boost

I tuned and set both cars up.

Driving the two the camaro is almost like a bike with a flat low end and car wakes up at 4000.

The ta almost has a stock feel about it below 2500 tons more torque and the only time it doesn't have an advantage over the 355 is if we hit the cars from a roll reving over 4500.

My brother in law regrets his 355 decision and wishes he had built a 383.

The difference is even more pronounced at the track, I can walk the ta off the line at 1200 when traction is limited and still cut a 1.79 60 11.01 131mph while same day the ss will make 129 but only run 11.4 because lack of torque = big bog.

Both cars are essentially same eg sus, tire, trans only real diff is displacement.

John

 

Hell any swingin' d!ck can make power with artificial atmosphere, takes some thinkin' to do breathin' on your own. And uh..Pops is a thinker.

Pop's and his "help", hey I gotta hold down a management job, get to it when I can. Don't help much when there is 9 hours of warm weather a day, and sleepin' takes up 5 of them.

Bret we are gettin' closer....hell I been sayin' that for 2 years..and to think all this started with a 3.750 stroke crank in my daily driver 3 YEARS ago..but hey it's all been paid for out of our pockets and worked on in spare time.

Hell the car ran 8.0@90 MPH(1.95 60 ft) in the 1/8 mile through 1 5/8 shorty headers, full exhaust, totally stock suspension on drag radials@3760lbs with a mailorder tune..a 355 with stock crank, rods, ported heads and a 224/228 114 cam. Was making(I guess) 380 ish RWHP, I was accused MANY times of having a 383 sooooo....we took it apart to make it a 383..and look at us now ..but it has been fun...everyone should be able to build at least ONE car with their Dad..it is a cool experience..the knowledge transfer has been great.

Pops is full of it...knowledge I mean


Well back on topic...I liked my little 355 that was in the car before we took it apart, for what was in the car, I dont think it would have been any faster with a 383, A 383 has to be a DEDICATED 383 from the get go. You dont go Marlin fishing with a cane pole, why put 355 stuff on top of a 383? Just aint gonna work.

"MOST" of the head porters associated with this board, thier top teer stuff LE3 etc is marginal for a GOOD running 383...a GOOD running 383 should put down 450 to the tires through a 6 speed, why don't they? Skimping....plain and simple....people buy what they can afford and then spend a FORTUNE trying to either run the number they want, or put down the number on the rollers they want AFTER they bought what they could afford when the initial build was done.

SAVE UP AND BUY THE GOOD ****, you will be MUCH happier in the end.

Why has it taken me a RACERDUDE 3 years so far to build this car? See the above statement....like Pops says "It only costs a quarter more to go first class" We all got more time than money. Well me anyway



David

 

Also have to think about the amount of money/time/effort put into LS1's and the fact that so many companies have jumped on board with them (aftermarket heads, cams, tuning utilities... the list goes on). I'd venture to guess that the LS1 aftermarket is as big or bigger than the LT1 aftermarket... and we're talking about half the life span of the motor! (LT1 has been around a good while longer...). Yet again, we run into the mere fact that it looks as though its a "money thing" for why we don't see power levels that of LS1's.

Yet again, I say until those head manufacturers (you know who you are, AFR, Trickflow etc.) get their head prices down, the LT1 market may very well continue to shrink.

Sad but True.

Just my $0.02

Oh yea, and props to exhaust/header manufacturers like Pacesetter etc. who continue to improve on their LT1 header designs! One day (i hope) the LT1 aftermarket will be as cheap/cheaper than the SBC!

 

Bret, Thanks for the mention a few posts back... Anyway, I just want to say to the originator of this thread (been so many pages I forgot...) not to get so caught up in rwhp #s...I know he said that he wants to run with everything out there, etc...but, and I also think racerdude said it a while ago, its ALL about the ENTIRE combination. I don't care if you have 500rwhp I will flat out embarrass you (not singling anyone out here...) out of the hole if you can't put it down. I can't tell you how many cars I've raced at the track with LOTS more hp and no way in hell to get it to the ground. Take the time to put together a well functioning suspension for your goals for the car. Fortify everything with good parts and get the advice of those who have "been there, done that" and then build your power...

I'm making some small changes this year and should see low 11s in sleeper trim and maybe a 10 in racecar mode with stock castings and a small cam that gets 21 mpg on the highway...or I may just throw in a bigger Joe O. cam and really make it interesting...

--Alan

 

The title was 355 vs 383, I realize anyone can make power with artificial atmoshere thats why I see so many 600 rwhp cars that idle like a stock car make 18 pounds vac at idle and pass a semiannual emmision test.

When you are building a engine, unless it's a budget build with a stock crank, heads there is no disadvantage to more cubes. How does the saying go " no replacement for displacement ".

Another fact is almost all our cars spend all their time on the street, no prepped track no 6000 rpm dump off a light. Most of the time the only way you can play without getting arrested is from a roll and that's when you'll wish you built a stroker.

John