This is what makes me not trust engine builders. This is why I do my own work. I just dont trust people.

 

So, I went into the machinist today and he basically started blaming me for everything. He said that I didn't check the lash after initial break-in and if I had, then I would have caught the problem before the bearings came out. BEEP that (I can't use asterisks anymore...)!!! So, when I asked him why these pieces of BEEP found their way into the motor, he said that's because it's what I wanted. Somehow, I requested comp cams springs, lifters, pushrods, camshaft and then pro-form rockers. I guess that makes sense, considering I'm a BEEP retard!

So, how do I go about this. The guy says I can tear the motor apart, but if I did and didn't find anything, I would feel silly. Better safe than sorry, I say. He went on telling me that the needle bearings would fall down onto the head and stay. "They aint going anywhere". Well, I shined a light down the pushrod openings into the lifter valley and not only did I find a couple of needle bearings, but I also found one of the races sitting there.

Still, he says he has no liability and all I say is heresay. He gave me a 12 mos warranty, but it only covers the machine work. He's willing "to go to bat" for me and fight with the rocker manufacturer and get my money back on the arms and see if they'll cover any of my labor. I had a local shop write me up a reciept for the estimated cost and it's about $1,000. It's not worth it to me, though. I'm into this motor over $7,000 at the moment. I want it to survive!

 

yup same here. ill let em prep my block but i assemble everything so when it blows it was my own fault.

and dude weather or not you adjusted the valves is not your problem... the parts he sold you are defective no matter how you look at it. its not up to you to "catch" his mistakes... Take the help he offers on trying to get the rocker company to cover the labor. if they wont make him do it. dont just threaten claims court, Actually follow through! people can threaten all day long, but untill someone actually does something about it he will continue on his immoral ways... and when you take him to court make sure you have him cover your atourney fee's as well.

 

You don't need a lawyer for small claims even.

The rocker company wararnty will say they are not liable for any other damages just the failure of the rocker arm. They all read that way even comp cams. You will get nothing there.

The needle bearings are not going to just hang out in the engine and do nothing. I have personally seen engines get destroyed by them. I think if you do a search on here about it, you will even find threads of people talking about it.

Read his warranty that he gave you. His comment about heresay is quite interesting seeing as everything he says is the same. Where you can get him though is if you were to pull the pan off the motor and find other things which do not jive with the receipt. Regaurdless they all need to be found and removed from the engine. Depending on what his warrnty said, I would take him to small claims over his refusal to make good on it and take the estimate from the other shop to back up the amount you filed for. Also file with the BBB if he's a member.

After all that he probably won't talk to you so I would say if he brushes you off again just go to the courthouse and file small claims. He will get a little out of shape when the sherrif dept shows up and serves him the papers. Let the judge decide if he has any liability. Save your time if his warranty specificly says he is only liable for the machine work because he is covered then. A 12 month warranty on machine work only is something you might as well wipe with though so basicly no warranty at all.

His comment about not checking lash after break-in is retarded. It will not cause a rocker arm bearing to fail. If it did solid lifer cams would kill rockers not lifters. That is total nonsense, and he's just pulling stuff out of his ***.

 

x3, they can do my machine work, but thats it.

 

How much did he charge you for the rockers? Since the builder was the one that assembled the motor then he is on the hook for any thing he did wrong which includes checking bearing clearances, ring gaps ect. Did you give him a list of what you wanted in this motor? He should have shown you all the parts he was going to install.

 

He charged me $289.96 for the rockers. $100 more than what the pro-form go for on Summit and about the price of a set of pro-magnums. I never gave him a list because in the beginning I was going to assemble the motor. I even bought some expensive tools to do so. But, then as I was doing research on setting up the motor, I started getting nervous about the pushrod length. It doesn't help that this guy was in my ear talking about how expensive it is to get things wrong and I should really consider letting him put it together. So, I did.

 

First question. How does he know it's what you requested? Was there any written "list" from you on what to use? It seems to me that if he is a comp cams distributor and you requested some parts from a different company that they never used before, they would have raised some sort of stink in the beginning. No?

Second, referring to your statement "He said that I didn't check the lash after initial break-in and if I had, then I would have caught the problem before the bearings came out." Was there any instructions from them to do so? Should they have not offered to have you bring it back for inspection of the oil quality and any needed inspection/adjustment in the first place?

Third, was there any written receipt from this joker? Is there any warranty on the receipt? While I have a hard time understanding how they claim the warranty is only for "machine work" and not the parts they purchased and used in the build. I do not agree with the fact that they are not warrantying their assembly labor. It's an arguable stretch that they have no control over parts quality (still BS). But they certainly have control over the build it self just as they are responsible for the machine work.

Last, I fail to understand how you could feel comfortable doing rings or bearing clearances but be hesitant on something as mundane as push rod length. However, be that as it may. I see no need to make this harder than it is.

Pull the intake, rockers, push rods and lifters. Retrieve all the "bearings" you can from the top. Then flood the heads and lifter valley with oil to rinse everything else into the pan. Now remove the pan and inspect it. Once you have everything you can find. Check the rockers to see that you have all the bearings. The ones that are missing any bearings compared to one that has them all, will confirm you have retrieved them all. It's not hard to determine if you got them all!!!!!

Let's not forget that you mentioned they convinced you to let them do the build. That goes a long way to getting some satisfaction from this. Although at this point, I wouldn't trust them to be able to punch a hole in a wet paper bag.

 

At this point I would get another estimate on making this right from another builder and remind him how expensive it is when he got things wrong. Unless he is willing to make every thing right then take your new estimate along with all your pictures and sue his *** off in small claims and like the others have said, make a complaint with the BBB and the BAR.

 

it seems to be that the biggest problem you are having is the rockers. You need to find on the receipt or written proff that you requested pro-mags. Next you would need to detemrine whether he charged you for pro-mags or for these blue things. It seems to be that there was a mistake (albeit one made on purpose), but either way your argument will not hold up. You will need him to go to the manufacturer of the blue things with him and have him say he is a professional engine builder and installed them properly. Without them you will be unable to collect money. Without him the blue thing company will say "well, they must have been installed improperly, not our problem". I am sorry but being realistic here, you really have no true case against your builder. Its not "his" fault they were defective (even though you did not get what you asked for).

 

$289.96 For those poc rockers. $285.95 for comp cams pro mags.$269.95 for comp gold. $ 279.95 for trick flow. $239.95 for Harland sharp. Summit catalog price.

 

Maybe they changed but those look a bit different than the ProForms I have laying around. Used them for a couple years on a milder setup without issue.

 

Oh yeah, forgot to add that those rockers aren't from Proform either. Look at the picture. Proforms have an external grip ring on the trunion.




For those that don't know, the top is SA and the bottom is NSA

Since the trunions in your parts are not clipped, it wouldn't have mattered if you checked them in 400 miles after break in or not, they will continue to do that for as long as you own them. They are cheap POS. The shop was trying to save money and still charge you the higher amount. This would lead me to believe that EVERYTHING inside is the same way. No?