I dont know about you guys but i watched horsepower tv this weekend. For those of you who dont watch it they have a 98 ss with over 70k miles on it. They did a slp cold induction (lid too), larger throttlebody , flowmaster catback, and new spark plug wires. With all of this it dyno'd 306 to the wheels. After that they installed edelbrock short tube headers. With these it dynod 320 to the wheels. So i dont know where every1 has this information that shorttys give no perfmance gains . 14 rwhp is a decent amount to gain and remain smog legal. Can some1 explain the concept of shortys= no performance ?

 

They give you around 10-14 rwhp gain...compared to long tubes thats nothing. Most headers are smog legal , question is the relocation of the cats along w/ the visual inspection which in some states will fail w/ mids and LTs...for instance NJ shorties are the only legal headers

 

I know that there power gains are nothing compared to long tubes but ive read on here time and time again that people say shorties are worthless. Hell that made me even think that then i saw this show.

 

Many of the long tube setups go for the same amount as shorties. For people that use smog as an excuse, you could buy a electric cut out for about 1/4 of what shorties cost and see similar gains. 2001s and 2002s benefit even less from shorties. Although technically mids and long tubes aren't legal; you will likely pass smog if you have cats. I just think there are better ways the money used for shorties could be spent.

 

If you can get around emissions, why get 10-14 rwhp when you can get 20-25 rwhp from some LTs!

Many say shorties dont give gains, which is rediculous, most people just mean that they arent as good as LTs.

 

If it had been a 00-02 with the better manifolds the gains would have probably been around 5 hp less.

 

is it possible the car needed some extra time to "adjust" to the first round of mods? so that after the headers it was actually showing more power from them, but looking like it was from the headers?

who knows

i don't think they offer "no performance"...but not as much as ful long tubes

 

I have done alot of searching on this subject and this is what I found. those headers will give you about 7 rwhp and others with the 1 5/8 primarys. the bbk headers have 1 3/4 primarys and a guy on ls1.com had them installed and he even ported the openings on it to get even more gains out of them. he ended up with 10 hp and the same in tq gain all throughout the powerband, not just peak and this is without a tune. hp tv is full of ****. the episode before that header install they dynoed 317 but the next episode they said 306. so in reality they only gained 4hp out of the headers.

 

well, in MA and Cali which are 2 of the most strictest in the country if your car doesnt pass the visual and the smog your done. Most people dont know what the stock location is but if they jack your car up it isnt hard to figure out. LT's are good for low end tq which is where most race cams crap out since they make power in the upper power brand. Shorties work better in higher RPM's...so if you have a higher lift cam then technically shorties are better. And yes LT's are illegal unless they are on an Off road car which means strictly drag car

 

What????

 

i always like to remind people a FAIR comparison to long tubes should include y-pipe. LT's come with a y-pipe already. i called jba & edelbrock and both claimed 11hp (flywheel i'm sure) so shorties are worth 8 rwhp & a good y-pipe and high flow cats, another 7-8. granted thats 15 vs 20 plus for long tubes. shorties aren't cheap but don't tell me they are worthless. cats remain in stock location which is required by federal law!

 

lol or sumthin like that do a search this topic has come up more then once, shorties DO work better in upper RPMS then LT's...just do a search

 

huh? I thought long tubes cost you a bit of torque down low, but really kicked in up top.. Backpressure laws and whatnot... ?

 

Yup. LTs give you higher rpm power and you CAN lose a very minute amount of low end, but not anything significant enough to care.