I am just getting ideas from those that actually play with this stuff. Whats the biggest cam you could go with a stock stall and still be in the "efficiant" ball park range? Hey, if it is nothing bigger than stock, thats fine, just say so, so, fire away, thanks.

P.S. Duration and lift numbers appreciated, not that lift should matter tho............... right, lol???

 

I'm guessing this in on something besides what you have in your sig.
Do a converter before cam. Its the easiest mod that'll drop your ET .5 sec.

Since you're worried about efficiency, get the gt2-3 from LPE. You can get the specs from here:
http://www.lingenfelter.com/store/ls1-gt2-3kit.html

 

yea the question is why dont u want a stall?? Ive had aftermarket tq converter on 2 cars and each became loads more fun after the install. does not make it less driveable as long as you dont go overkill on the stall. For a cammed LS1, 3400 would be nice, for a mid to small cam... And i can gaurantee it'll be driveable but when u hit it, hold on...

 

Sure, a stall would be great, meybe, but, my first thought is "why" do I even need a stall in the first place when I do not play ricky racer all the time? My 6-speed does not have a stall converter and I like it just fine. I never dump the clutch, so a stall would be basically doing the same thing, which I would never need 90% of the time. Thus, leaves me to the question at hand for scientific purposes and research.

 

I think you need to do some more "research" on what a stall actually does.

 

if you dont play ricky racer, then why would you spend money on a cam and such in the first place?? Seems like you do want to go fast, and quite honestly a stall/cam package would get you there best. Stalls are bada$$ man, and all I'm saying is that if you get a cam, you benefit HUGE from a stall. Again, why buy a new cam if you "do not play ricky racer" all the time.

 

I thought stalls only helped launch and off-line performance. If thats so, then I can understand why he doesnt want one, he doesnt race, he just wants a very beefy cam with manners that work with the factory stall.

Or maybe I dont know what I'm talking about at all..?

 

The major problem with a stock stall in a cam'd car is more focused around idle. You face transitional and "cruise control" issues. When I say transitional, what I'm getting at is an aftermarket cam needs to idle at higher rpms. If you want to know why stock stalls are recommended for cam'd cars, go start up your car, bring the revs up and hold 'em at 900, and then put the car in gear. Once you hear the "bang" through the drivetrain, I think you'll get it. You might also have some cruise control effects because the stock stall is rather "tight." My looser, aftermarket stall will push the car on a flat surface about the same at 800rpm as the stock stall did at 500rpm. That looseness also eliminates the "bang" issue above.

Aside from that, you can run a stock stall. You won't get the most optimal performance being outside most cams' performance rpms. But, it won't be undriveable. I can drive my 232/238 cam down to 1200rpm if I wanted to (good tune).

 

An aftermarket stall would give you better 1/4 ETs than a cam with no stall.

If you're still going that route, then an LS1 Hotcam, 2002+ LS6 cam, etc.

Mike

 

If it did it wouldn't need a clutch.

A "stall" doesn't do the same thing as dumping your clutch. I agree, you need to research what a converter will do for you.

Ever notice how your M6 pulls harder than an A4? The converter makes a bigger difference in this area than gears will. Want your A4 to be as fun to drive as your M6? Get a converter. Do you ever downshift in traffic around town to pass someone? Guess what....a converter will help this too. Do you ever get on your gas pedal or just put around? If the answer is yes to getting on your gas pedal then you will feel a bigger difference with a converter than a cam.

I've talked to and have known a lot of A4 guys. In retrospect they have all said that they would have gotten a converter earlier in the mod stage had they known the difference it makes. But its your car. If you want to cam it and still leave much on the table then thats your choice.

The GT2-3 is basicly a pumped up LS6 cam. I've got a friend running it with ported LS1 heads making 400 whp with a stock idle. Makes for a great sleeper.

 

ive ran a 236/242 on a 112lsa with 0.6" lift with a stock stall on an lt1. It was a bit sluggish under 2000rpm.Idle shoudl ahve been 900 but we set it to 850 to get some more lump.

Idle was fine, no drivetrain issues. It pulls the car a bit, but that was fine. Car was a tad sluggish under 2k rpm. After that, it felt like a 100 shot of nitrious kicked in

If you have street tires, its not too bad because they cant handle a whole lot of traction anyway.

If you dont care about quarter mile times and you want high end pull, i'd go with a 220ish cam on a 112. You will get decent mileage and a noticeable performance gain without losing anything off the line.

 

Hey, thanks for all the replies. Well, I don’t think hot rodders drive the way I do…now. I used to be in the car ***** to the wall all the time, pulling out all I had for the fastest ¼ mile. Now, this is the way I see it.


1) Yes, a converter is a slipping clutch to a A4 tranny. When I leave a light, I NEVER slip the clutch more than it needs to leave the light in a soft normal manner. Once the clutch is released, I may put along for e second or two and then ask for some horsepower. I have NEVER launched off the line hard with my clutch. I am not saying I would not do it on an A4 though. What I AM making a point about is the fact that I don’t need a high stall converter for ET’s and line launching.

2) converter efficiency is also a concern. A 3000 stall converter is not as efficient as the stock stalls. It allows the engine to spin more and actually lose coupling ability, and that equals horsepower planted to the wheels. You don’t really think about that as you have a cam that makes 10 extra horses, but, you lose 5 in slipping, so, that’s a sloppy efficiency rating. Now, depending on the cam you have, you just might have to make a trade. (all guesstimates are those of the author and are not based on actual HP #’s )

3) Idling…… Well, depending on what cam I get, of course, can make my idle change. Now, a nasty converter will surge the car as opposed to a stock cam. A stock converter is rated at 1800(?) but flashes at 1200 I believe??? Now, if memory serves me, wouldn’t a cam and header change up the flash point on the converter? To a point of course. So, when I find out which cams works with a stock stall, I can then decide if that’s enough for my goal or need more.

Yea, I know there is no free rides. Some sacrifices have to be made for others, but, the more info I gather, the better educated judgment I can make for myself as to what will meet my goals.

 

1. Its more than just a slipping clutch action. You'll feel it and use it more than just off the line. Does slipping your cluth make you accelerate harder? A converter will because it has a torque multiplication effect much like using numericly higher ratio gears. Do you only feel higher gears at launch? NO, but you do feel them more the slower you are moving because the mechanical advantage is greater.

2. A converter will lose you some HP, but it'll more than make up for it in how it makes your car run. If your worried about efficiency then why are you looking at a cam? An aftermarket cam very likely won't be as efficient as stock either.

3. LPE GT2-3 unless you want some lope, but that requires less LSA and thus less efficiency.

 

get a mid 220s cam with steep lobes and high lift. You'll have a mean idle that wont be too harsh, cam surge should be easy to program out, you'll have enough off the line punch to spin the tires and you will pull well past 6000 rpms.

You should be able to hit 180+mph, something a high stall or gears will prevent you from doing

 

I am not saying I will NEVER use a higher stall converter. I am merely asking what cam I can use, the biggest cam I can use along with the stock converter, that’s it, nothing else. Once I have everyone’s opinion, I will go from there as the options "I" want to go with. As far as efficiency, there are cams, so I have heard, that tuned correctly, will net you the same mileage as stock, idle like stock and be very streetable. So, choosing the right converter for me it’s not so much about mpg (well, it is just a little), but, harness that 5-10 unnoticeable inefficient horse power and get the best of both worlds? Who would not want to do that?

My theories and the real life world might not play fair together, but, wouldn’t it be nice to have ALL the info you need and make an educated guess on what would work for you? Ask questions, get answers. Might not like the answers, but, at least you have them. I still have not heard any good unbiased answers other than "get a converter". Okay, thats a lie for sure, lol.