Drivetrain Clutch, Torque Converter, Transmission, Driveline, Axles, Rear Ends

Is it possible to rebuild the Posi-unit on a stock 10-bolt 3.23?

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Old Apr 1, 2009 | 05:47 PM
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aifilaw's Avatar
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Is it possible to rebuild the Posi-unit on a stock 10-bolt 3.23?

Yes?
If so, where to get the parts and how much should they cost?
Or am I stuck and may as well get a new center section and slap it in for $600, since that appears to be about as cheap as they get.
Old Apr 1, 2009 | 06:18 PM
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Are you refering to the torsen units? If you destroy one of these, I'm not even sure if you can get it apart

A BUNCH of ppl swap their rear ends out for 12 bolts/9" replacements, so you shouldn't have a hard time finding a replacement carrier. Just check the for sale sections on this site and others for a used carrier.
Old Apr 2, 2009 | 11:46 AM
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Unfortunately I don't have the money to spend on a new 12-bolt unit or I certainly would. Because of the rear gears I'm running the glass 10-bolt has held up against 800+ ft lbs of torque launches by spinning, which is fine by me because the car is not built for off-the-line.
So it sounds like I'm either going to be out $500 on an Eaton center section for new clutches, or $2000+ for a complete 12-bolt conversion
Old Apr 2, 2009 | 08:07 PM
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Because of the rear gears I'm running the glass 10-bolt has held up against 800+ ft lbs of torque launches by spinning, which is fine by me because the car is not built for off-the-line.
So it sounds like I'm either going to be out $500 on an Eaton center section for new clutches, or $2000+ for a complete 12-bolt conversion
I didn't mean for you to get a 12 bolt, I meant that since people are replacing their 10 bolts with 12 bolts, theres a LOT of used 10 bolts out there. You can usually find an entire rear end assembly for under $200 depending on where you're at.

I'm forced to stick with the stock 10 bolt as well and mine puts down 1.4 60's on nitrous and 1.5's on motor. The gears hold up just fine, but I can only seem to find torsen carriers and the worm gears get chewed up pretty quick.
Old Apr 4, 2009 | 01:01 PM
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Go to ebay. There is a vendor that sells refurbed eaton posi units. I bought one last fall from him for much cheaper than buying a new one and they are rebuildable.
Old Apr 4, 2009 | 01:04 PM
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Originally Posted by aifilaw
I'm running the glass 10-bolt has held up against 800+ ft lbs of torque launches
What are you making 800ft lb of torque with anyways?
Old Apr 5, 2009 | 03:05 PM
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At my stall-slip speed which occurs at 3100 RPM the engine makes 415 ft lbs of torque. The converter has a multiplier of 2.3, subtract 10-15% for the drivetrain and the rear differential is seeing around 800 ft lbs of torque for a period of about half a second, or to be more precise 1-e^tx.
Old Apr 5, 2009 | 03:08 PM
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Sorry dude, but you sound like the Prius owners with their 290Lbs of torque from 800-1000rpms.
Old Apr 5, 2009 | 07:13 PM
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I could waste time responding justly, but I would guess it would fall on deaf ears.
If you don't understand physics, then don't talk.
If you do understand physics and want proof then have a dyno record a launch on the skids instead of gear-up runs beyond 2000 RPM.
Old Apr 5, 2009 | 07:43 PM
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You only have 800lbs for only 1/2 second in a 12 second race. The rest of the time is 415lbs or less. No one goes by that measurement of torque, so why are you? Again you are sounding JUST LIKE the Prius owners, "My car generates 800lbs for 1/2 in 1/4 run = My car generates 290lbs of torque at 800-1000rpms in a 5000rpm powerband".
Old Apr 5, 2009 | 09:09 PM
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Actually, the car generates far less than 400 ft lbs of torque for most of the race, since it does not reside at 3000 RPM the entire time.
The reason why having 800 ft lbs of torque being applied for half a second is that the differential has to be capable of handling that torsional force or it will break. Which is an precise example of why anything beyond a stock engine with an automatic at the dragstrip will disintegrate the "glass" 10-bolt.
Old Apr 6, 2009 | 06:09 AM
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It's nice to see someone who understands the principle of torque multiplication. Clearly many people don't understand the basic concepts of the forces acting on the various parts of the drivetrain. You are correct that the driveshaft will see 800 ft/lbs with your engine at launch. That is the whole point of a high stall torque ratio. Each axle though will only see 400 ft/lbs, since there are two (assuming the posi is not slipping).

In regards to your original question, no I don't think there are rebuild parts available for the conical type posi unit. I have searched far and wide in the past and came up short. Spider gear kits can be purchased for 7.5" open differentials, but not limited slip units. I believe the reason the parts are not available is because the friction material is bonded to the cone on each side gear. The Eaton plate-type posi unit is much stronger and less prone to slipping than the stock conical setup (and therefore it is more expensive).
Old Apr 6, 2009 | 03:56 PM
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that brief '800 ftlbs at max stall' is to the trans input shaft.you didn't include your 1st gear ratio,which is also a torque multiplier.then whatever figure you now end up,that's to the pinion.your 3.23s' mutiply that pinion torque by 3.23 to the carrier.
similar situations exist with M6s' less the torque multiplication of a convertor.
what carriers see is tremendous and our OEM rearends internals are subject to breakage.
Old Apr 6, 2009 | 04:44 PM
  #14  
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Its been a long time since I saw actual torque values from a manufacturer either.
old 12-bolt, 9" and 8-3/4 were all rated at 670 ft lbs. And historically (and unless colleges have continued their inept approach at everything) mechanical engineers should know to make the actual physical breaking point of any mechanical device of this type at 150%, therefore the actual breaking point of an old 12-Bolt was around 1000 ft lbs.
God bless the Dana 60, think that was rated around 1200.
No idea what the current 10-bolt is.
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