jrp4uc

With the future the Ecotec has for continued mass-production, I would think it'd help (and surely less weight).

You're saying the car doesn't have jokes associated with it now? At least they'd be different jokes...

That's what they said about "Ricer Boys" accepting Fords. The Focus has seemed to succeed in this market. The soon to be released turbo Dodge Neon will also be met with open arms. Either way, it should appeal to a broader audience than the current ho-hum V6 offering.

If GM can improve those cars by offering legitimate performance via turbo, etc then they should do it, and it wouldn't be so much of an issue or hole for the Camaro to fill. But something should be done to address the lackluster sales and interest in the Camaro's base model. If you can't steal sales from Mustang, you better find them somewhere else.

Darth Xed

True, but look at the cars you listed... Focus and Neon. Not Mustang or even Stratus Coupe! This is why I say Cavalier (and it's 2005 Delta replacement) would be best suited for this...

formula79

First off how does a a 4 banger hur the Camaro's image....I guess the V8's get more attention at the trailor parks??

Secondly Traction Contol also works by individually braking the rear wheel that is slipping...so unless Chrs96WS6 knows some trick about braking each wheel I am at a loss as to how ASR is a bad thing?

Also as for cutting the power...from a safty standpoint any wheel slip is bad...so GM idiot proofed the car by making it cut the power

Z284ever

I seem to find myself in the unusual position of agreeing with Branden.

I remember when Ford invited me to the pre-release ride and drive of the Lincoln LS. Everyone there seemed to be a car nut...so I assume they wanted the enthusiasts slant on their then upcoming car.

The first car I drove was an LS on an autocross course with the stability control ON. I swear, I thought I was Niki Lauda. Could there possibly be a driver as good as me? I could do no wrong.

Right after that I hopped into a BMW 528 without stability control. This thing handles like a UPS truck I thought. Just for the heck of it...I got into the same LS and switched the stability control OFF.

Guess what....I am no Niki Lauda.

Chris 96 WS6

Branden you need to go back and read my post again. I never said TC was a bad thing--that's flat out putting words in my mouth. In fact, I think its a good feature. However, I am disputing the implication that anyone who has it and doesn't use it is a fool, because a whole lot of cars don't have it at all. And if it truly is that essential of a safety device, GM is negligent not to include it in every car.

Darth Xed

Because you then have a 'muscle car' even in it's base form, it a damn 4-banger.

The trailer park comment is just dumb. One minute you defend F-Bodies, then you say stupid stuff like that.

redzed

This explains why so many Lincolns and Cadillacs are sold to retirees who live in gated "mobile home" communities. How can you beat the logic of a $40,000+ car sitting in the carport of a $25,000+ double-wide trailer?

redzed

I was in the back seat of an LS V8 on a truly insane drive up a winding hilly road during a nasty thunderstorm. The overenthusiastic driver was unaware the car even had stability control - he just thought the car had the best IRS setup in existence. I'm pretty sure if the stability control had been absent, or turned off, the idiot would have put us into a guard rail.

Isn't it funny how a cheap electronic handling aid can make such a difference in the way we perceive a car?

ProudPony

BINGO. This is what ponycar buyers want now - no doubt.
Screw the ricer-rods and wing-wars. People buying V6 ponycars want to look good, and show American pride, but won't likely race ANYTHING, EVER.

Base model/V6 buyers want to look sporty, and different, yet look AMERICAN, IMO. As for mods, they may or may not want to go fast(er). THIS is why there is a "Pony" model available starting this year for the V6 car only. It's a "looks" package for some additional eye candy, but the base car is just that - BASE. Go HERE and then flip to page 3 of the brochure (the convertible). Please, read the text at the bottom, and note the "Pony Up" in the headline. Unique polished 16" wheels, color-keyed letters on the rear fascia, and GT hoodscoop are just a little of what will set this model apart from any other Mustang... like it or not.

Also, the performance parts - for ANY model, base or top - are a definite clincher for many buyers. Chris 96 WS6, you are dead-on about the brochure and being able to go straight to the parts dept and order-up. But then take it one step further... Ford sends me an FRPP Catalog (or flier) every quarter, often with sales specials, coupons, or discounts on certain products. It used to be Ford's "Motorsport" catalog, but now it is FRPP.

I ALSO get quarterly catalogs for accessories and apparel (with things like floormats, sunscreens, trunkliners, seatcovers, shirts, jackets, watches, barstools, shotglasses, pen/pencil sets, etc. with Ford Mustang logos on them - all products licensed by Ford of course). I can order online, by phone, or at the dealer. The best dealers around here even keep some of the stuff in stock for immediate "cash and carry". HERE's a small sample of that catalog.

IMO, Camaro/Firebird will need something like these programs to keep their buyers enthralled with their purchase, even years after the sale. Ford has made everyone feel like their car was important, whether they buy a base V6, a GT, a Mach 1, or a Cobra. They all feel like they have something unique, and Ford helps them keep that feeling with this flood of support and literature, letting them...
1) make their car even more special in appearance or performance or...
2) involve their car in their work (business card holders, paperweights), play (golf, tennis, etc equip), dress (T-shirts, jackets, hats, watches, jewelry), finances (checks, credit cards), garage/shop (barstools, signs, clocks),not to mention home decorating (pitures, models, plates, glasses).

My point is, Ford makes the car "available to appear" in all aspects of your life, not just as a mode of transportation. IT WORKS TOO. Camaro could do well to come back with this kind of support accross the board.

redzed

Is the "fake hood scoop" clientelle the market that Chevrolet really wants to go after? I got to give Chevrolet credit for not pushing frivolous aftermarket accessories in their brochures. Camaro brochures have typically done a great job of pitching the car for enthusiasts. "Enthusiasts" are the people who matter, at least where I'm standing.

There again, the Camaro had a lock on the market for "hairspray queens" back in the 1980's. Unfortunately, I think they all went on to buy Mitsubishi Eclipses.

Chris 96 WS6

There are not enough enthusiast buyers out there to support a 100,000+ unit per year Camaro, you are going to have to broaden the appeal. If that means appeasing the fake hood scoop crowd, so be it, as long as we get our world-beating bang-for-the-buck V8 model.

RiceEating5.0

I thought the Legend was a v6.

This is how i picture it.

Base car - N/A v6
Lower trim v8- 4.8L v8
Mid trim v8 - 5.3L v8
Higher trim v8 - 6.0L v8

The 4.8 can be omitted and the lineup could have something like a 3.5L v6, 5.3L v8, and 6.0L v8.

SNEAKY NEIL

I think he meant the Vigor.

Chris 96 WS6

Yeah, I meant the Vigor....don't see very many around, I don't think it lasted over 3 years or so.

Chuck!

A dealer V6 supercharger and V8 heads/cam/intake package would be a sweet *** idea. Just no I4 please