It'll be interesting to see how the Mustang performs with this new engine. Someone posted that this engine has a larger bore than the current mod engines. Does that mean the engine has a larger bore spacing and is an inch (more or less) longer?

If they manage to keep the weight to 3600 with the 400hp, it will be a very quick Mustang!

 

It's just a # designating volume displaced and nothing more. It doesn't mean one engine is superior to the other...just that one engine displaces more or less than the other. And i think you'd agree that a 5L v8 displaces less than a 6.2L v8. That's a fact.

As for hp/lt, i agree that it's meaningless for the most part and only serves bragging purposes.

 

Probalbyt for the most part, but in the world of the average guy its a useful indicator of the engine's over all performance. If the MOD and LS are making nearly the same power at nearly the same engine speeds the smaller engine would certainly be breathing better.

In any event, I suspect based on something said here about driving a MOD car vs LS car. The Mustangs will no doubt come off as slower than a 400 (possibly)hp 3600 (possibly) lbs car should be. In short, because it will be a tricky car to drive by virtue of being down on torque compared to the Camaro or Challenger.

 

Wouldn't having a higher torque band make a car easier to launch?

Edit: Never actually tried to race anything more than on the street.

 

ProudPony, I've owned 2 sn95's (one them a T67 turbocharged 5.0L) and loved both. I understand Ford's strategy. I have owned mustangs much longer than i've owned camaro's and i was first a mustang guy before i became a camaro guy as well. I understand that Ford has a hierarchy, and that the GT is the "base" performance model. I also understand that Ford's formula has served them well and has allowed them to enjoy sales success unrivaled or unmatched by any other sports coupe on the market. None of that is news to me.

But from an enthusiast point of view (and i am a mustang guy as much as i am a camaro guy), how can i as an enthusiast be happy with 215-225hp (in 94-98) when the closest competition was offering 275+hp in the similarly priced z28 and 200hp in the v6 offering. In 98-02, Ford gave us a 260hp GT when a similarly priced z28 was making 320-340hp. Why should i as a mustang enthusiast have to pay extra $$ for a Cobra to get performance i can normally get out of a z28 costing much less?? And even then, the cobra fell a little short when compared to the Ls1 z28.

The GT's make up the bulk of v8 mustang sales and it is the model that most people associate with the "mustang" name and so it is the model that will get the most attention. It is also the model that i (and most others) can afford to buy. Yes, it's great that the GT500 now makes 540hp, but it comes at a price and all the other special edition while nice also came at a premium and in limited #'s. At the end of the day, the only models that i care about are the ones that i can afford. I'm much more impressed and excited with Ford offering me a 5.0L 400hp $29k GT than with them offering me a 550-750hp special edition costing 45-80k.

And it's not just the GT, look at the v6 mustang. 210hp??? My Fusion which is a family sedan with a smaller 3.0L v6 makes 221hp and your run of the mill mid-sized v6 family car today makes north of 240+. I don't know about you, but as an enthusiast that bothers me.

I just think Ford needs a strong powertrain foundation with their core models/trims and let the special editions add on to it from there. I like the camaro's lineup very much: a 305hp base v6, a 426hp Ls3 (400hp L99) for the SS. That's a good strong powertrain core. A special edition (if GM decides to go ahead with it) z28 will come in 500+.

There's always room for improvement and it appears that Ford's rectifying that with a lot of their new models. Long post, but i hope you understand where i'm coming from.

 

From a traction standpoint it might seem cool, but you just cant dump the clutch on a MOD car at idle and expect it to go some place in a hurry. Having to get the right spot for the traction available makes them tricky (and inconsistant) to drive.

 

In size, yes. In weight, no.

If you want to ignore the fact that a 5 liter engine putting out more power than a 5.7 or a 6.0, then I won't be the one to bust that bliss.

Competitive V8, huh?

Exactly how many "competitive" V8 Camaros and Firebirds has GM produced since 2002?????

Well, everything.

If you are prepared to say the 6.2 is no different than the 5.7 or the 5.3 LS engines, then I'm all ears for an explaination.

The ricer argument is about hp per displacement, usually attached to a small 4 banger putting out V6 numbers.

A 5 liter putting out more power than a 6.0 let alone a 5.7 or even a 5.3 is pretty big news, no matter how much you want to hide it.



I think you missed the 400 lbs/ft and 3500 pound part.

Last I checked, the Camaro SS' LS3 has 408.... and over 3850 pounds.

Somehow....wishful thinking..... just doesn't say enough here.

 

With similar weight/hp,

Camaro SS - 9.06lbs/hp
Mustang GT - 9 - 9.13 lbs/hp

it should be a drivers race.

 

If you drop the clutch at idle expecting to go somewhere in a hurry, you probably should stay the hell away from driving a manual...... you should be driving an automatic.

 

The 4th gens had many flaws and limitations, but the powertrain wasn't one of them. You of all people know why they ceased production in 2002 and the reasons that led up to it.

I'm talking powertrain here. This is a discussion and comparison about "engines", not the cars or overall sales. That isn't what i'm arguing. If your idea of the GT's 2v 4.6L being competitive is it being down 60-80 horses compared to the similarly priced z28 than i don't know what else to tell you.

 

We're a little premature I think? I doubt it'll be 400 lb ft and I doubt it'll be 3500 pounds.

It'll still be impressive.

 

A naturally aspirated 400hp 5.0L engine probably won't make 400 ft-lbs of torque without direct injection and probably variable valve timing and definitely premium gasoline.

Look at BMW's 4.8L V8. It makes 360hp and 360tq.
Ferrari's 4.3L V8 in the new California makes 460hp, but just under 360ft-lbs @5,000RPM.
The 4.7L Maserati version is making 400-433hp and again around 360ft-lbs.
Perhaps the most telling is the 5.5L Mercedes V8 which currently makes 382hp and 391 ft-lbs.

My guess is that the 400 horsepower number is just speculation. I could see a 360, 375hp, or maybe 380 horsepower number reaching production in a GT model Mustang. And even then, I would be VERY surprised to see over 360ft-lbs.

 

Yeah. Rumor last Spring on svtforums.com had 400hp/360tq. The 360 tq number is much more believable than 400. Even the new DI, dual VVT Jag 5.0 manages only 380tq to go with its 385hp. The Lexus 5.0 in the ISF makes 416/371 IIRC, but it's a DI, premium-only engine. Ford will be doing very well to hit 400/360.

It should still make for a very fun 12 second car!

I'd prefer the car with this 5.0 to the nose heavy GT500.

 

Packaging and complexity...that's what I was getting at. Don't have the numbers, but I'd be willing to be that the 4v mod motor is heavier than an LSx.


Good news for Ford fans for sure...not gonna deny that. But, let's wait for it to hit the market, shall we? Let's also consider torque, and 'power under the curve'....

 

Why the 4.6 3 valve is lighter than an LS1. Also remember that the current crop of LSx engines are larger displacement and more powerful, requiring tougher and heavier internal components.