usatoday article
Registered User
Joined: Sep 1999
Posts: 1,873
From: South Jersey
You don't have to give the gov't more money. You could just drive less or drive a more efficient car. And say you aren't moving closer to work... well then if it bothered you - your NEXT car (be it next day or next 5 years) would be more efficent.
Tax breaks only reduce consumption on the new cars sold. More expensive fuel reduces consumption on ALL cars. And it doesn'tt do anything about the fact that now that I have an efficient car AND CHEAP GAS, I'll probably DRIVE MORE THAN BEFORE!
LOL, I'm still cracking up at the people saying only the tax would hurt the poor... raising CAFE would FORCE most of us into little ****boxes while the rich got big SUVs and luxury cars. Because they'd have to sell a vehicle mix to meet CAFE, cars would have to be priced accordingly... meaning I potentially couldn't afford a big SUV, even if I really needed it and could afford the gas!
Tax breaks only reduce consumption on the new cars sold. More expensive fuel reduces consumption on ALL cars. And it doesn'tt do anything about the fact that now that I have an efficient car AND CHEAP GAS, I'll probably DRIVE MORE THAN BEFORE!
LOL, I'm still cracking up at the people saying only the tax would hurt the poor... raising CAFE would FORCE most of us into little ****boxes while the rich got big SUVs and luxury cars. Because they'd have to sell a vehicle mix to meet CAFE, cars would have to be priced accordingly... meaning I potentially couldn't afford a big SUV, even if I really needed it and could afford the gas!
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Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 10,285
From: Albany, NY
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Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 13,713
From: The Golden State
I'm simply flabbergasted here. 
Tax breaks for buying a certain car in the face of out current deficits?
Bringing up Reagan's tax cuts, but yet ignoring that those tax cuts exploded the deficit something horrendous (wasn't "trickle down discredited long ago?).
Supporting CAFE when the last time CAFE was instituted performance cars dried up & everything went FWD?
Minimum wage people being hit hard by gas tax increases? How many minimum wage people drive long distances to work?
No one wants to pay additional money to ANYONE. But there seems to be a near paranoia to having a tax which you totally control because the money goes to the government.
No one says a peep when the oil industry raises prices, or the fact that we are making rich countries that wouldn't help us on the war on terror.
No one has proposed jacking fuel prices up to $4 per gallon, but 50 cents is completly reasonable. We'll STILL have the world's cheapest gas of any 1st world nation.
Also, no one has wondered why the auto industry has come out in favor of this?
This is absolutely amazing!
OK, someone come up with an alternative that doesn't create a recession by prompting the Feds to jack up rates, doesn't add to the deficit, and doesn't lay new regulations on the industry via CAFE which would take away efforts to give us the cars we want.
Com'mon. Anybody??
Tax breaks for buying a certain car in the face of out current deficits?
Bringing up Reagan's tax cuts, but yet ignoring that those tax cuts exploded the deficit something horrendous (wasn't "trickle down discredited long ago?).
Supporting CAFE when the last time CAFE was instituted performance cars dried up & everything went FWD?
Minimum wage people being hit hard by gas tax increases? How many minimum wage people drive long distances to work?
No one wants to pay additional money to ANYONE. But there seems to be a near paranoia to having a tax which you totally control because the money goes to the government.
No one says a peep when the oil industry raises prices, or the fact that we are making rich countries that wouldn't help us on the war on terror.
No one has proposed jacking fuel prices up to $4 per gallon, but 50 cents is completly reasonable. We'll STILL have the world's cheapest gas of any 1st world nation.
Also, no one has wondered why the auto industry has come out in favor of this?
This is absolutely amazing!
OK, someone come up with an alternative that doesn't create a recession by prompting the Feds to jack up rates, doesn't add to the deficit, and doesn't lay new regulations on the industry via CAFE which would take away efforts to give us the cars we want.
Com'mon. Anybody??
Last edited by guionM; Apr 12, 2004 at 03:10 PM.
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Joined: Jun 1999
Posts: 2,368
From: OR
Increase environmental awareness and educate the masses about the problems of consuming gasoline!! The more people are aware, the more responsible choices they'll make!
Alright alright, you got a point there.
Alright alright, you got a point there.
Originally posted by guionM
I'm simply flabbergasted here.
Tax breaks for buying a certain car in the face of out current deficits?
Bringing up Reagan's tax cuts, but yet ignoring that those tax cuts exploded the deficit something horrendous (wasn't "trickle down discredited long ago?).
Supporting CAFE when the last time CAFE was instituted performance cars dried up & everything went FWD?
Minimum wage people being hit hard by gas tax increases? How many minimum wage people drive long distances to work?
No one wants to pay additional money to ANYONE. But there seems to be a near paranoia to having a tax which you totally control because the money goes to the government.
No one says a peep when the oil industry raises prices, or the fact that we are making rich countries that wouldn't help us on the war on terror.
No one has proposed jacking fuel prices up to $4 per gallon, but 50 cents is completly reasonable. We'll STILL have the world's cheapest gas of any 1st world nation.
Also, no one has wondered why the auto industry has come out in favor of this?
This is absolutely amazing!
OK, someone come up with an alternative that doesn't create a recession by prompting the Feds to jack up rates, doesn't add to the deficit, and doesn't lay new regulations on the industry via CAFE which would take away efforts to give us the cars we want.
Com'mon. Anybody??
I'm simply flabbergasted here.
Tax breaks for buying a certain car in the face of out current deficits?
Bringing up Reagan's tax cuts, but yet ignoring that those tax cuts exploded the deficit something horrendous (wasn't "trickle down discredited long ago?).
Supporting CAFE when the last time CAFE was instituted performance cars dried up & everything went FWD?
Minimum wage people being hit hard by gas tax increases? How many minimum wage people drive long distances to work?
No one wants to pay additional money to ANYONE. But there seems to be a near paranoia to having a tax which you totally control because the money goes to the government.
No one says a peep when the oil industry raises prices, or the fact that we are making rich countries that wouldn't help us on the war on terror.
No one has proposed jacking fuel prices up to $4 per gallon, but 50 cents is completly reasonable. We'll STILL have the world's cheapest gas of any 1st world nation.
Also, no one has wondered why the auto industry has come out in favor of this?
This is absolutely amazing!
OK, someone come up with an alternative that doesn't create a recession by prompting the Feds to jack up rates, doesn't add to the deficit, and doesn't lay new regulations on the industry via CAFE which would take away efforts to give us the cars we want.
Com'mon. Anybody??
Registered User
Joined: Nov 1999
Posts: 2,801
From: Nashville, TN
I would much rather run the deficit up some more, banking on our growing and innovative economy to help grow treasury revenues out of the deficit, than slap on new taxes that place significant hardship on either the individual consumer or the auto industry, because either ultimately costs jobs.
I'm sure with a copy of the federal budget and a free weekend I could find more than enough pork to cut to "pay" for any such cuts.
Just look at all the pork the Senate is trying to put into the Highway Reauthorization bill. I am keeping a close eye on it because my job deals directly with funds put into the public transporation component of the bill.
I'm sure with a copy of the federal budget and a free weekend I could find more than enough pork to cut to "pay" for any such cuts.
Just look at all the pork the Senate is trying to put into the Highway Reauthorization bill. I am keeping a close eye on it because my job deals directly with funds put into the public transporation component of the bill.
Registered User
Joined: Jul 2002
Posts: 2,472
From: South Bend, Indiana
Originally posted by guionM
OK, someone come up with an alternative that doesn't create a recession by prompting the Feds to jack up rates, doesn't add to the deficit, and doesn't lay new regulations on the industry via CAFE which would take away efforts to give us the cars we want.
Com'mon. Anybody??
OK, someone come up with an alternative that doesn't create a recession by prompting the Feds to jack up rates, doesn't add to the deficit, and doesn't lay new regulations on the industry via CAFE which would take away efforts to give us the cars we want.
Com'mon. Anybody??
Raise CAFE for trucks, SUVs and vans. Not on cars, their ahead of the game right now. SUV's are what set behind the efforts to conserve fuel.
Registered User
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 10,285
From: Albany, NY
Originally posted by guionM
OK, someone come up with an alternative that doesn't create a recession by prompting the Feds to jack up rates, doesn't add to the deficit, and doesn't lay new regulations on the industry via CAFE which would take away efforts to give us the cars we want.
Com'mon. Anybody??
OK, someone come up with an alternative that doesn't create a recession by prompting the Feds to jack up rates, doesn't add to the deficit, and doesn't lay new regulations on the industry via CAFE which would take away efforts to give us the cars we want.
Com'mon. Anybody??
- $2500 tax credit/rebate to those that buy new cars that get over 50mpg and over 35mpg for SUV/truck.
- 3/10th’ or less tax on gas to pay for the tax credit (I havn't run the #'s yet but that is an educated guess based on 1 million high mpg cars a year) 5’/g = $8.15 Billion/yr.
- Raise CAFE on light trucks up 1.5mpg over the next 5 years. (if 20% of new H2s came with the Diesel the avg. for H2s would go up about 1.5mpg)
- LS2 & LS7 cars exempt from CAFE (ok... it will never happen, but it is my version of pork
)For long term, more $$$ needs to be invested in Hydrogen fuel cell reseach. NASA will be doing a lot of high tech fuel research for the Mars and Moon missions that should help all of us.
Last edited by Z28x; Apr 13, 2004 at 11:55 AM.
Registered User
Joined: Nov 1999
Posts: 2,801
From: Nashville, TN
Sounds reasonable to me Z. a 10cent tax increase on gas phased in over, say 3 years, wouln't have much of an effect on the economy IMO.
Some interesting reading here:
http://www.wri.org/climate/jm_oil_000.html
the author suggests:
Some interesting reading here:
http://www.wri.org/climate/jm_oil_000.html
the author suggests:
The imminent move from oil to replacement energy sources will occur over a just a few decades, and determined efforts to make the transition as painless as possible should begin now. Perhaps most critical is the need to make energy prices -- especially those of fossil fuels -- reflect the full social costs of their production and use. In practice, this can be most efficiently achieved through pollution-, security-, and carbon (global warming) taxes. New taxes such as these should be offset by reducing taxes on income or savings or by reducing social-security or health-care taxes.
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