Threxx

I guess your family will be riding bikes because every manufacturer under the sun has had some significant proven safety issues found in its products.

Remember Ford fuel tanks exploding when they got rear ended? What about Chevy Aveo wheels literally falling off the car at highway speeds? Just a couple examples off the top of my head but we could go on for quite a while.

Interestingly the only one that has directly affected a member my immediate family is when my father in completely lost his power brakes in his early 00s Tahoe doing 70 down the highway. Guess I shouldn't have bought my Saturn after that happened.

Darth Xed

I can understand recalls and problems, to a degree they are all but unavoidable.

It's the way Toyota has handled the entire situation, and continues to grasp at straws to try and fix the issue that is the problem in my book.

Marc 85Z28

Did either of those problems affect the ENTIRE PRODUCT LINEUP FROM THE MANUFACTURER?

Darth Xed

Ya, that too.

Z28Wilson

Every manufacturer has its problems. Looking past the fact that all their vehicles look, feel and drive with all the spirit of a Maytag washing machine, my real beef with Toyota is the way in which they handle their issues. It's been obvious for a LONG time now that this acceleration thing has been a problem, yet they clearly dragged their feet on it. There is a very thick air of arrogance surrounding that company, be it "driver error" in the acceleration thing or "poor maintenance" with the 4-cylinder engine sludge issue, or just about anything else that has come up with their vehicles over the last decade or so.

El Duce

Well it's 2 days later and I still haven't seen a thread on it.

Really? Can't be as bad as things GM has done to discredit those who questioned their products.

Threxx

You guys really think that Ford and GM have never tried to shift blame on a recall or avoid one entirely?

I'm not sure how a widespread recall to adjust floormats is worse than a narrower recall to keep fuel tanks from exploding or wheels from falling off at highway speeds.

I'm not trying to say Toyota is blameless here. I'm trying to say that the very same things you find fault in Toyota for, your own home team companies have been just as guilty of through the years.

I think a lot of this boils down to confirmation bias.

El Duce

You take your objective views and GET OUT OF THIS THREAD!!!

Darth Xed

Probably not. Feel free to show me what you are talking about.

If you post a link about GM saying their dash board on their 1999 Cavalier is cuttign edge, then save it, because a crappy dash material does not equal the problems Toyota is having.

El Duce

Unsafe at Any Speed. You seriously don't know about that whole fiasco? GM was taking some pages out of the mafia playbook.

Darth Xed

OK, you got me.

Got anything else that might apply to the period of time I've been alive?

Darth Xed

And before this goes too much further off track from what I actually stated in the beginning...

Why on earth would I buy a Camry today when I can go buy an Accord, or Malibu, or Sonota, or Fusion, or whatever....and not have to deal with any of this?

Z28Wilson

Oh please. MANY people have questioned Ralph Nader's motives behind that infamous book. And in subsequent investigations performed by both public and private entities it was found that Corvair was no more dangerous than other vehicles of the time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chevrolet_Corvair#Response

I'm not saying that Corvair was an outstanding car and that there weren't some valid questions about some aspects of its design. But the key point is that many of its "questionable" design characteristics could be found in other vehicles of the period.

Threxx

If you, like I, believe that the EUC unintended acceleration thing is 99.999% myth perpetuated by one or two potentially real incidents combined with the other mass majority of issues caused by people with sticking floor mats (an easy to overcome issue), then that would mean little to no 'strike' against the Camry when considering it against its competitors.

From that point I'd just compare them on their merits. And on that note I don't find the current Camry to be very compelling. So no, I wouldn't buy a Camry. But not because I think there's any chance it's going to force me down the highway at 120 mph... because I just don't think it stacks up well against its competitors in most ways, except predicted durability, where Camry has historically done very well compared to most other cars in this class.

Darth Xed

And to go this route, you have to believe Toyota has dealt with this issue this long, and continues to do so recalling more and more models & model years of their cars, over and over again, replacing parts here and there, apparently not really knowing the real cause (since they keep coming with more 'fixes'....) and not really have a significant lingering problem.

And on top of that, you need to forget or just not care about the way they've handled the entire situation aside from fixes or lack-there-of.

This is where we differ. Fair enough.



If I had been in the market for a Camry (or any other vehicle from Toyota), I would pick what I had listed as number 2 on my list of choices, even if the Camry was my favorite, because there is no reason to deal with it..... there are just too many choices out there to lock myself into buying a vehicle from them.....IMO, of course.


It's like having to jump into a pool of water, and getting to chose which I want to jump into out of like 20 choices.... and one pool has a greater chance of having acid or something in the pool that can hurt or kill me than the other pools, and I say, awww, WTF, I'll take the one with the greater chance of acid... jsut because that's me!!