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The scariest part about today's announcements is not the death of Pontiac...

Old Apr 27, 2009 | 09:03 AM
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The scariest part about today's announcements is not the death of Pontiac...

It's that GM wants the government to take 50% of GM's common stock shares.
Old Apr 27, 2009 | 09:08 AM
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Originally Posted by Z284ever
It's that GM wants the government to take 50% of GM's common stock shares.
Wow, interesting. (I haven't taken the time yet to read the announcements, so this is news to me.)

I guess I don't find it particularly scary. The government would eat that cost in bankruptcy too. Also, it's only fair that the government gets some equity in exchange for all of the money they've poured into GM recently. This seems like nothing more than a semantic detail to me.

Why do you find it scary?
Old Apr 27, 2009 | 09:12 AM
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I'd prefer Bob Lutz doing product development rather than Barney Frank.
Old Apr 27, 2009 | 09:16 AM
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Originally Posted by Z284ever
I'd prefer Bob Lutz doing product development rather than Barney Frank.
Me too. What does that have to do with common stock?
Old Apr 27, 2009 | 09:19 AM
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UAW gets 39% ownership, so 89% ownership between the federal government and UAW/VEBA. I guess we now know who will be running GM when they emerge from bankruptcy.
Old Apr 27, 2009 | 09:25 AM
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Originally Posted by Wikipedia
Holders of common stock are able to influence the corporation through votes on establishing corporate objectives and policy, stock splits, and electing the company's board of directors.
They don't get to run the company. They do get a big vote in who does run the company.

The stuff we've seen from the government (specifically, those viability documents that came out a few weeks ago) indicates that they really do have a pretty good idea of what it's going to take for GM to be successful. I'm comfortable with those same people choosing someone to put in charge.

I can't say I feel the same way about the UAW. That scares me. Then again, maybe it's exactly this sort of stake in GM that the UAW needs in order to set their priorities straight. Now if GM fails, they won't just lose their jobs, but all of their money too.
Old Apr 27, 2009 | 09:26 AM
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The government will not be running GM. This kind of debt for equity swap happens all the time. The new company will get on its feet, sell new stock, and pay the government back. Do you think the government wants to get the taxpayers money back, or go into the car business?
Old Apr 27, 2009 | 09:30 AM
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the government wants nothing to do with the business. They will however, love the power and politics.

What better way to further agendas on global warming, hybrids, unions, universal healthcare, etc. with a controlling vote or a vote they can sell

to save GM a price must be paid. I'm getting the feeling i'm gonna hate the price that was payed.
Old Apr 27, 2009 | 09:34 AM
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Originally Posted by adam4356
the government wants nothing to do with the business. They will however, love the power and politics.

What better way to further agendas on global warming, hybrids, unions, universal healthcare, etc. With a controlling vote or a vote they can sell

to save gm a price must be paid. I'm getting the feeling i'm gonna hate the price that was payed.

bingo!!!!!!
Old Apr 27, 2009 | 11:11 AM
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Originally Posted by Z284ever
I'd prefer Bob Lutz doing product development rather than Barney Frank.
But Bob Lutz gave us a Zeta Camaro and what if I told you Barney Frank is on record saying the Camaro should be Mustang SN195 sized. Does that make you feel any different?

Old Apr 27, 2009 | 11:23 AM
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the camaro is heavier car that STILL gets better gas mileage, and the v6 is only 15 hp less than the top mustang GT v8. what does that tell you??
Old Apr 27, 2009 | 11:25 AM
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They don't get to run the company. They do get a big vote in who does run the company.
Semantics...
Old Apr 27, 2009 | 11:31 AM
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Originally Posted by Z284ever
I'd prefer Bob Lutz doing product development rather than Barney Frank.


Maybe Mr. Frank would encourage more rear drive?

Last edited by 1fastdog; Apr 27, 2009 at 11:33 AM.
Old Apr 27, 2009 | 11:45 AM
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Originally Posted by 1fastdog


Maybe Mr. Frank would encourage more rear drive?
That's just wrong....
Old Apr 27, 2009 | 12:00 PM
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Originally Posted by ad356
the camaro is heavier car that STILL gets better gas mileage, and the v6 is only 15 hp less than the top mustang GT v8. what does that tell you??
What it should tell you, is that Ford hasn't needed to worry about it for the past decade. What does that tell you?

What are the odds there will be a 6th gen Camaro if Obama and the UAW are running GM? GM is dead to me, thankfully I've enjoyed owning just as many Ford's as my seven F-bodies.....adios suckers.

LONG LIVE PONTIAC!!!

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