Regular cab Silverado SS is a no go....
Registered User
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 329
From: Kansas City, MO
Originally posted by formula79
If the current Lightning has 385 HP then 395-400HP should be fine. I said that because it is known the new 6.0L will be in the 400HP range. If they want to match the to upcoming 500 HP Lighning they could use a varient of the new Z06 engine.....that is if Dave Hill doesn't use his death grip to stop it.
Again the price all depends. My G/F's AWD TB LS (1SC) MSRPed at $33K and she paid like $26K for it after rebates and all. Trailblazers can run up to $40,000 in options already so it is going to be tricky for GM to price this thing at $33,000...so what do they do?
Price it at $33,000 and sell it for that with no discount even though most any regular TB with just a basic option package stickers at that much and more.....but can be discounted much lower?
Or
Do you MSRP the thing at $41,000 (above all the other TB models) and let in incentives and dealer haggling take it to a realistic price?
That is GM's delema...offering rebates makes it look like the car can't sell...but if you sticker it at a realistic price with no rebates it makes the rest of the TB linup that has higher MSRP's (but rebates) look overpriced.
If the current Lightning has 385 HP then 395-400HP should be fine. I said that because it is known the new 6.0L will be in the 400HP range. If they want to match the to upcoming 500 HP Lighning they could use a varient of the new Z06 engine.....that is if Dave Hill doesn't use his death grip to stop it.
Again the price all depends. My G/F's AWD TB LS (1SC) MSRPed at $33K and she paid like $26K for it after rebates and all. Trailblazers can run up to $40,000 in options already so it is going to be tricky for GM to price this thing at $33,000...so what do they do?
Price it at $33,000 and sell it for that with no discount even though most any regular TB with just a basic option package stickers at that much and more.....but can be discounted much lower?
Or
Do you MSRP the thing at $41,000 (above all the other TB models) and let in incentives and dealer haggling take it to a realistic price?
That is GM's delema...offering rebates makes it look like the car can't sell...but if you sticker it at a realistic price with no rebates it makes the rest of the TB linup that has higher MSRP's (but rebates) look overpriced.
the lightning only sells 7500 units a year because they are limited to 7500 units a year. SVT DOES NOT MAKE ANYMORE THAN THIS. YOU CANNOT SELL WHAT YOU DONT MAKE. how hard of a concept is that? i think ford could have easily gotten away with selling the truck in the 35-40k range. because it delivers the performance one expects for that price. people pay 60k in some cases for a z06 because it offers exotic sports car performance for 40k less.
i myself have seen a few SS silverados roaming the streets here and myself would like to run one in my 91 L98 trans am. why? because i know the guy next to me just dopped 40k on a truck to run the same times as my 150k mile, 30 year old technology, 11 year old car that i bought for 3k. that shouldnt happen. the SS is much like the 35th anniv. SS camaro or the 50th anniv vette, or the colectors edition trans am. just an over hyped over priced, decent looking appearence package with a slight performance increase of some kind. not worth justifying the $35-40k price tag IMO.
Registered User
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 10,285
From: Albany, NY
Originally posted by 87camracer
the SS is much like the 35th anniv. SS camaro or the 50th anniv vette, or the colectors edition trans am. just an over hyped over priced, decent looking appearence package with a slight performance increase of some kind. not worth justifying the $35-40k price tag IMO.
the SS is much like the 35th anniv. SS camaro or the 50th anniv vette, or the colectors edition trans am. just an over hyped over priced, decent looking appearence package with a slight performance increase of some kind. not worth justifying the $35-40k price tag IMO.
lets look at the HP of other SS upgrades:
Camaro = 15HP
Impala = 40HP
Monte Carlo = 0HP
Silverado = 60HP
Registered User
Joined: Feb 2001
Posts: 329
From: Kansas City, MO
true but look at what i said. performance. not hp ratings or anything like that. it might have gotten more hp but the extra weight of the AWD system, rims, and all the other SS only appearence parts kinda negates that extra power.
Registered User
Joined: Jul 1999
Posts: 2,072
From: Lilburn, GA, USA
You know, there is a definate possibility that thier sources are wrong on the production of the short bed SS. You can never take a magazines "sources" as fact all the time. I am not going to hold my breath for the final word on the production of this vehicle, but I am not going to rule it out either.
Registered User
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 10,285
From: Albany, NY
Has anybody heard anything about GMC getting a performace truck?? Could this have anything with the lack of a short cab Chevy SS. Shouldn't a truck division have all the types of trucks that the competition has, they also could use a halo truck.
Registered User
Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 13,713
From: The Golden State
Originally posted by formula79
No I think YOU are trying to stir the pot with that one. It is a general statement...and true.
No I think YOU are trying to stir the pot with that one. It is a general statement...and true.
Perhaps you did mean it as a general statement, but some of the more interesting stuff I found out (such as Holden getting the go ahead to import a vehicle...the GTO..., the Monte Carlo SS getting a more powerful engine, the Solstice being pretty much a certainty, despite the corperate line that it's "not approved") all came from people actually working in some capacity on those vehicles, not from GM's media or a "higher up" who's not going to say something he doesn't wan't the public to know.
It's all a matter of reputation. I simply decide who's credible, and never rely on just one source for information on news I post.
Registered User
Joined: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,400
From: Michigan's left coast
Originally posted by guionM
It's all a matter of reputation. I simply decide who's credible, and never rely on just one source for information on news I post.
It's all a matter of reputation. I simply decide who's credible, and never rely on just one source for information on news I post.
Branden, I've got access to info you'd love to get your hands on, as does just about any other engineer working at the Tier 1 or OEM level.
Have fun standing on the outside looking in.
Registered User
Joined: Jan 1999
Posts: 1,547
From: Panhandle of West Virginia
Originally posted by guionM
I think the thing that has everyone's goat here is that the truck is AWD and costs within peeing distance of a Corvette!
A few words on Lightning. One of SVT's mantras is keeping production as limited as possible and profitable to keep their vehicles resale value up. Used Cobras cost more than used Camaro SS of the same year, even though both cost the same new.
SVT is a VERY profitable organization within Ford. Anyone who doubts it should actually take time to look into it themselves. There's a reason why Ford leaves SVT pretty much alone (ie: Team Corvette at GM). BTW, it's SVT that's limiting production, NOT the marketplace.
Why would anyone buy a Lightning when there's a perfectly good SS Silverado???
Consider this:
1. Lightning costs less, at $32,000. Yet it's entirely different than any other Ford Pickup, with it's own engine, & suspension as well as cosmetics. It is built in fairly limited numbers, and sold only through top notch Ford dealers, the only ones that allowed an SVT franchise.
If something goes wrong with your SVT vehicle, you won't have to put up with the BS other Ford buyers have to. You are given top treatment at the dealers, and your issues are answered directly by an SVT represenative, NOT the normal Ford customer relations people. Years down the road, your SVT keeps much of it's initial price because of it's unique equptment & it's limited numbers.
2. Silverado SS costs at least $8,000 more than Ford's hotrod truck. Yet, beyond the nosepiece and labels, it's just like any other Silverado 2500 extended cab pickup AWD truck, only lower. It's built for volume, and any Chevy dealer can sell them.
If something goes wrong, you go to your Chevy dealer & wait your turn with everyone else. You have a question or issue, it goes through the same channels as the guy who just bought a Cavalier. When it's time to sell your SS 4-6 years down the road, you find it's worth slightly more than a standard Silverado with the same options, but it's still worth less than the Lightning that's sold as soon as it hits the Autotrader, even though your Silverado SS cost more when it was new.
I think this pretty clearly frames the difference between the Lightning & the Silverado SS.
When the Ram SRT-10 comes out, it's going to be pretty indefendable, since it's going to cost almost $50,000, be about as fast as the $15,000 cheaper Lightning, be as rare as a dry winter in Seattle, and not likely to have the support network that measures up to SVT.
I think the thing that has everyone's goat here is that the truck is AWD and costs within peeing distance of a Corvette!
A few words on Lightning. One of SVT's mantras is keeping production as limited as possible and profitable to keep their vehicles resale value up. Used Cobras cost more than used Camaro SS of the same year, even though both cost the same new.
SVT is a VERY profitable organization within Ford. Anyone who doubts it should actually take time to look into it themselves. There's a reason why Ford leaves SVT pretty much alone (ie: Team Corvette at GM). BTW, it's SVT that's limiting production, NOT the marketplace.
Why would anyone buy a Lightning when there's a perfectly good SS Silverado???
Consider this:
1. Lightning costs less, at $32,000. Yet it's entirely different than any other Ford Pickup, with it's own engine, & suspension as well as cosmetics. It is built in fairly limited numbers, and sold only through top notch Ford dealers, the only ones that allowed an SVT franchise.
If something goes wrong with your SVT vehicle, you won't have to put up with the BS other Ford buyers have to. You are given top treatment at the dealers, and your issues are answered directly by an SVT represenative, NOT the normal Ford customer relations people. Years down the road, your SVT keeps much of it's initial price because of it's unique equptment & it's limited numbers.
2. Silverado SS costs at least $8,000 more than Ford's hotrod truck. Yet, beyond the nosepiece and labels, it's just like any other Silverado 2500 extended cab pickup AWD truck, only lower. It's built for volume, and any Chevy dealer can sell them.
If something goes wrong, you go to your Chevy dealer & wait your turn with everyone else. You have a question or issue, it goes through the same channels as the guy who just bought a Cavalier. When it's time to sell your SS 4-6 years down the road, you find it's worth slightly more than a standard Silverado with the same options, but it's still worth less than the Lightning that's sold as soon as it hits the Autotrader, even though your Silverado SS cost more when it was new.
I think this pretty clearly frames the difference between the Lightning & the Silverado SS.
When the Ram SRT-10 comes out, it's going to be pretty indefendable, since it's going to cost almost $50,000, be about as fast as the $15,000 cheaper Lightning, be as rare as a dry winter in Seattle, and not likely to have the support network that measures up to SVT.
ownage
Registered User
Joined: Jan 1999
Posts: 1,547
From: Panhandle of West Virginia
Originally posted by Jackass
Wasn't this what the camaro was supposed to do?
Wasn't this what the camaro was supposed to do?
Registered User
Joined: Jan 1999
Posts: 1,547
From: Panhandle of West Virginia
Originally posted by guess who
Jesus this is the best reading Ive seen on this site in a while,Keep it up!
Im a bit shocked though,Nobody has mentioned that for a truck to be bad@$$ you have to make a showing on the TV show TRUCKS.Stacey loves the Lightning.
Jesus this is the best reading Ive seen on this site in a while,Keep it up!
Im a bit shocked though,Nobody has mentioned that for a truck to be bad@$$ you have to make a showing on the TV show TRUCKS.Stacey loves the Lightning.
Registered User
Joined: Jan 1999
Posts: 1,547
From: Panhandle of West Virginia
Originally posted by 87camracer
i myself have seen a few SS silverados roaming the streets here and myself would like to run one in my 91 L98 trans am. why? because i know the guy next to me just dopped 40k on a truck to run the same times as my 150k mile, 30 year old technology, 11 year old car that i bought for 3k.
i myself have seen a few SS silverados roaming the streets here and myself would like to run one in my 91 L98 trans am. why? because i know the guy next to me just dopped 40k on a truck to run the same times as my 150k mile, 30 year old technology, 11 year old car that i bought for 3k.
Registered User
Joined: Jan 1999
Posts: 1,547
From: Panhandle of West Virginia
Originally posted by Eric Bryant
As opposed to simply posting whatever carefully-metered information GM will give out to you in return for kissing their collective corporate posterior?
Branden, I've got access to info you'd love to get your hands on, as does just about any other engineer working at the Tier 1 or OEM level.
Have fun standing on the outside looking in.
As opposed to simply posting whatever carefully-metered information GM will give out to you in return for kissing their collective corporate posterior?
Branden, I've got access to info you'd love to get your hands on, as does just about any other engineer working at the Tier 1 or OEM level.
Have fun standing on the outside looking in.
Thread Starter
Registered User
Joined: Nov 2000
Posts: 16,176
From: Chicagoland IL
I realize that the Silverado SS is not designed to be a direct competitor to Lightning.....but.
If you take per unit profit AND PR wow factor....I'd bet Ford get's more benifit out of 7500 Lightnings per year than Chevy gets out of even 20,000 Silverado SS's per year.
If you take per unit profit AND PR wow factor....I'd bet Ford get's more benifit out of 7500 Lightnings per year than Chevy gets out of even 20,000 Silverado SS's per year.
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Joined: Mar 2001
Posts: 1,313
I just read an MT mag which featured a Regular Cab Hemi Ram against the SS. The Hemi Ram may be the SS true competitor. The lightning and the Harely weren't even in the comparo (seeing as how both are significantly faster).
Dodge offers a Ram Hemi with stock 20" rims and it's almost as fast as the SS and it's A LOT cheaper. Those looking for a regular cab RWD SS are better off buying the much cheaper reg Cab RWD
Performance #'s from MT test.
Test--------------------SS------------------Hemi
0-60-------------------6.6-----------------6.8
1/4------------14.99@89.05---------15.1@89.06
Slalom----------61.3mph--------------62.3mph
Skidpad-------------.77g's--------------.80g's
60-0 Braking-------119'-----------------132'
Difference? The Regular cab Hemi is $10,000-12,000 cheaper and the SS is Gm's performance truck while the Hemi Ram is just a regular Dodge offering. Even with 4x4 and 4 doors, i'm sure the Hemi is still a lot cheaper than $40,000.
For a 40,000 truck, the SS isn't that impressive (exceptions being the 345hp 6.0 and AWD). You're better off buying a cheaper regular Cab or Crew cab Hemi Ram for a lot less.
Dodge offers a Ram Hemi with stock 20" rims and it's almost as fast as the SS and it's A LOT cheaper. Those looking for a regular cab RWD SS are better off buying the much cheaper reg Cab RWD
Performance #'s from MT test.
Test--------------------SS------------------Hemi
0-60-------------------6.6-----------------6.8
1/4------------14.99@89.05---------15.1@89.06
Slalom----------61.3mph--------------62.3mph
Skidpad-------------.77g's--------------.80g's
60-0 Braking-------119'-----------------132'
Difference? The Regular cab Hemi is $10,000-12,000 cheaper and the SS is Gm's performance truck while the Hemi Ram is just a regular Dodge offering. Even with 4x4 and 4 doors, i'm sure the Hemi is still a lot cheaper than $40,000.
For a 40,000 truck, the SS isn't that impressive (exceptions being the 345hp 6.0 and AWD). You're better off buying a cheaper regular Cab or Crew cab Hemi Ram for a lot less.