If Pontiac is trying to become like BMW (good performance, subtle but clean looks), then WHY does it need boy racer scoops?!?!?!?!! Scoops would be targetting the WRONG BUYERS.

Answer me that please, and don't say because the GTO 40 years ago had it. Saying that avoids my question above.

 

agreed, the GTO dont need scoops. The days of hood scoops and wings for the GTO is over. Its time to play with the big boys, and scoops isnt what the GTO needs.

 

I concour, time have changed, while scoops may work well with older cars, but the newer cars have different lines and they no longer flow and are not neccesary. This car was designed without scoops, any aftermarket attempt to put them on seems out of place and disrupts the flow of the car.

Thats my $0.02

Chris

 

Look, Pontiac is not BMW, will never be BMW, will never be looked at like BMW, will never be thought of as another BMW, ever. BMW is not exciting, it's boring. The GTO was never a boring car, it was an aggressive car, a musclecar. If they want a BMW-like musclecar instead of a Pontiac GTO American musclecar, then TAKE OFF the name GTO. As it is now, the car lacks image and aggression, it's unimpressive. It's just a plain car with V8/RWD that looks like every other V6/FWD Pontiac out there and is difficult to even tell them apart.

When I was looking at a few GTO's a few months ago at a dealer, all the interested customers were in their 40's, and they all wished it had scoops and even said that they might wait until next year for them and the dual side outlets. (and whatever else, grill, bumpers, etc.) So much for it not appealing to the projected market by having what a GTO IS supposed to HAVE, it's a part of the look/name. There's a reason why the car is getting all this stuff in 05. I mean really, everyone went crazy because it had no scoops, now some people are trying to say different. Most people want the scoops, it should have them. If it's still gonna be an issue, make them optional to solve it.

 

Hmmmm..........

 

A stripe something like in this picture would also be nice as an option. That one is a little wierd though, solid black with silver outlining or the reverse would be nice. http://www.norcal-ls1.com/multimedia...t=1&thecat=500

 

Yup. What he said (more or less).

This debate about scoops, styling, and the name...
It's like Vu-Ja-De all over again. But I agree with IZ28, if they wanted a "new modern" image for the car, they should have given it a "new modern" NAME too, not pimped an old legendary one to generate showroom buzz.

Anyways - I nominate this agrument for the "longest running indesolvable internet argument" award.

 

I disagree, I nominate the " SS vs. Z28 as top model" for the award.

 

No, I think its time American style came around again... As an 18 year old... Im honestly sick of all this Euro crap (and by that I mean things like Euro tailights, which look horrible)

We need to be leaders, not followers

 

Ok, Ill point out the oh-so-popular Trans Am Ram Air hood. Keep the scoops for the young kids, let the GTO get something else that changes the appearance. They could make the car look 100x more agressive without scoops.

 

What do scoops have to do with age? If you think that only young people want this kind of styling you are way off. Most people (for example) who bought those Ram Air and SS cars were way more up there than you might think. Hoods with something on them are cool, not dull like flat hoods. They are looked at as a show of power and style, something aggressive that every other car on the road doesn't have. Many people buy a car like this for that purpose, to have something cooler and different than everyone else.

I agree, aggressive American styling needs to take the lead instead of looking to boring cars from other countrys. Cars like WRX's have scoops (wonder where they got that idea from?) but the GTO shouldn't?!?! OK there......

 

I feel like that one was solved. *Waiting for more information on that all-powerful 5th Gen Z28 we heard about a few months ago*

 

IZ28, I'm going to repeat my previous question really slowly. Read my question very carefully and please give me your best response.

*ahem*

We know the following facts
-GM wishes to make Pontiac a BMW fighter. By BMW fighter, they mean a sporty brand with luxury.
-The TARGET MARKET FOR SUCH A VEHICLE is interested in semi agressive styling with subtlety.

-The E46 M3 is a prime example of this. Here are some reference photos for your viewing pleasure.
Front
Back

Note that the car has a lower stance, larger wheels, dual exhaust outlets, and a subtle, yet semi agressive body kit. It is a balance of not only performance looks, but the normal 3 series looks. It is a 3 series, but then again it has a slightly more agressive look to it.

-GM wishes to create a similar car to this. They import the Monaro as a GTO. The GTO has subtle looks to it with performance. The stance of the GTO has a subtle, muscular look to it. It also is luxurious. So far, so good.

-Hood scoops are usually meant for a younger audience. The average buying age for a WRX as you mentioned I would imagine is much less than that of the M3. Cars designed for the older buyer do not have this feature. Therefore, the older TARGET AUDIENCE does NOT WANT scoops. They are considered gaudy and boy-racerish by this TARGET AUDIENCE.

Therefore, if GM wishes to TARGET THIS AUDIENCE that wants SUBTLE LOOKS AND CURVES, why should GM add HOOD SCOOPS TO IT?

Let me repeat that question. If GM wishes to TARGET THIS AUDIENCE, why should they ADD FEATURES that would make it NOT TARGET THIS AUDIENCE?


Here is what I am NOT ASKING about, or for an opinion about:

-I am not asking if you think the GTO 40 years ago looked aggressive or not. That was 40 years ago in a time era.
-I am not asking about the history of the GTO. That information is irrelevant to this question.
-I am not asking if you like the looks of the car. I don't care and it is not relevant to this question.
-I am not asking if you think BMW is exciting. That is irrelevant to my question.
-I am not asking about your cruise-in nights or what you saw at one dealership. That is irrelevant to my question.
-I am not asking about your assumption of what all 40 year old people want. You cannot speak for all of them in one all encompassing statement.
-I am not asking what your friends think about the car. Their opinions do not matter for this question.
-I am not asking about your opinion on the looks of the car. You fantasize third gen Camaros. You are definetely not the target audience.

Here is what I AM ASKING:

I am only asking why GM should add a feature to a car that does not attract and may deter its target audience. This is purely from a business standpoint.


Please IZ28, take a crack at this question. Also, please formulate your answer so that it does not include anything from my list of things I do not want to hear above. Injecting anything from that list would be neglecting my question.

Thank you.

 

I think if you re-read my posts, I have already answered your questions. But, I will say one thing again. Pontiac will never be a BMW competitor, who will ever think of Pontiac and BMW in the same sentence? If they wanted a car to compete with them on that level, they should not have called this car GTO. The name GTO is all about something different.

Scoops DO NOT make the buying audience of this car NOT WANT it. Where are you getting this from? Have you gone to any dealers and talked to people interested in the car? Have you been to GTO sites? Talked to enthusiatsts at shows? Random people that like musclecars at all? I know I have. What about all the 4th Gen SS and WS6 owners that are in the same buying group? Did scoops make them not buy? If you are in the market for a GTO, a musclecar, RWD, V8, 360HP, dual resonated exhaust, etc., are you really a person asking for subtle?? I think not. (there is no choice right now) They are looking for a GTO, and scoops are a part of the name and image. Do you think they haven't seen real GTO's before? Do you really think a hood scoop will stop people from wanting this car LOL? Exactly the opposite will happen, especially since all I hear from the buying audience that you mention is the lack of scoops and aggressiveness. Everything about the originals is what makes people want them. Why should the GTO's name and history be changed? Why should something it's associated with be taken away? I can't see why, especially when people want the scoops and a more muscular image. Like I said, make them optional if people can't decide, I'll bet on more buyers choosing the scoops than not. This car needs appeal, it's really lacking it right now and so are US cars in general.

 

Well, somebody felt it could be compared to a Mercedes. Maybe a beemer isn't too much of a stretch from that?