Nothing beats the fuel efficiency of a car thats not running.

http://money.cnn.com/2005/05/16/Auto...uter/index.htm

Prius hybrids dogged by software

Report: Internal computer woes reportedly cause autos to stall or shut down at highway speeds.

May 16, 2005: 9:23 AM EDT

NEW YORK (CNN/Money) - A software problem is causing some Toyota Prius gas-electric hybrid cars to stall or shut down while driving at highway speeds, according to a published report.

The Wall Street Journal reports that the problem involves Priuses from the 2004 model year and some early 2005 models.

The newspaper reports the National Highway Transportation Safety Administration has logged 13 reports of the engine shutdowns, while Edmunds.com, a popular vehicle-information and shopping site, has had 13 individuals post complaints in a Prius forum. Some of the cars that shut down had to be towed to the shop before they could be restarted.

The newspaper quotes an official from Toyota as saying the stalling problem is due to a software glitch in its sophisticated computer system.

The car has both a gasoline engine and an electric motor, which is set to provide it with power during certain driving conditions, particularly in city driving. The gasoline engine is supposed to be shut down or run at a very low level when the car is driving slowly or idling but provide most of the car's power when it is cruising at highway speeds.

The report said no injuries or fatalities have been linked to the problem, but it did not say whether there had been accidents due to the problem.

A NHTSA spokesman said the agency is monitoring the complaints, but no formal investigation has been initiated.

Toyota spokesman Sam Butto told the newspaper the auto manufacturer identified a "programming error" in the computer systems of 23,900 Prius cars last year and sent owners a service notice advising them to bring the cars into dealers for an hour-long software upgrade.

He couldn't say how many Prius owners got the upgrade and whether the latest problems involve buyers who never got the upgrade or if an altogether different glitch is shutting the car down

 

I hope Toyota put windows on those Prius computers.

 

Betcha won't hear about this one on the evening news

 

They didn't try hitting Ctrl-Alt-Del?!?

 

 

Just more proof that the unprofittable and overly complex hybrid technology is not going to revolutionize the automobile but will rather remain a niche for enviro-nuts and urbanists.

Lets see:

1. They don't get the mileage they claim if you run the heater or the A/C...who out there doesn't have to run either one or both most of the year?
2. They don't make a profit, and in fact Toyota loses $2K on each one
3. Small diesel outperform hybrids on highway MPG
4. Now this software bug..

The ONLY thing I see going for hybrids is the plug-in mod folks are doing with the upgrade batteries that gives them a 10 mile range for city commutes w/o running the gas engine at all..that is, assuming you don't need the A/C.

I guess that is fine as long as your coworkers don't mind working with someone that smells like an armpit all day because his quest to save the planet outweighs his belief in personal hygene.

Perhaps a hybrid owner wasn't much for bathing anyway, seeing as how he'd be into water conservation too.

 

I bet they won't issue a "recall".

 

I'm not advocating Hybrids, but 13 (or 26, if you add the reports together) out of many tens of thousands of cars isn't a very large number.

 

They didn't install SP2! It has a better firewall

 

Yet everyone treats Toyota like Gods for this terrible car

 

That goes for ANY car :blah: And besides, I among many other people don't use the A/C or heater more than a few times a year. I've only used my A/C once the whole year and a half I've owned my Z28.
Its a new technology! Give it a chance... I don't think 2 GHz processor chips were cheap a decade ago, now look at them.
Diesels have been around for many many decades longer than hybrids, yet hybrids are performing or outperforming deisel technology alreaddy...I think its time to give up the diesel argument. Especially with the Lithium technology just around the corner. At the present time, if you do a lot of highway driving then it would be cost effective for a consumer to pick up a diesel over a hybrid, just like it would be more cost effective for a consumer to buy a hybrid over a diesel if they do mainly city driving.
Dude, they've fixed the bug alreaddy...

 

I think they fix is to roll up (close) all the windows and then roll them back down (re-open).

 

I am not enamoured with the Prius's complexity and prefer the simplicty of Honda's Hybrid Setup - having driven and ridden in my friend's Hybrid Civic I can attest that it does get excellent gas milage (mid to high 40s were observed @ the several fill-ups I witnessed, according to his log-book). Plus it's funny when the ricers attempt to race him from a stop and he lays the smack down on their non-hybrid Civics that lack the Hybrid's additional near instant torque from the electric motors.

As for diesel... I think it now costs more in some areas than gasolene - source Patrick Bedards column in this month's car and driver where he discusses the diesel issue. Plus traditional diesel is still regarded as dirty wrt to the sooty particulates chucked out, though there is ongoing research which if given enough funding could change that perhaps. And these cleaner diesels would add more cost (at least initially). Bio-diesel sounds promising but how the hell do make enough of it to make it cheaper than gas? The so called 'green' diesel posted about in another thread today sounds very interesting too; but in the end, given the fact we are a capitalist society, it all comes down cost to the consumer. That said, I would definately bite if it offered a real, genuinely cleaner alternative to petroleum without too big a price premium.

Still, hybrids are relatively more expensive to produce than non-hybrid versions; I think they're a feel good stop-gap to be eventually replaced by non-hybrid solutions utilizing [future] cleaner fuels.

 

I still think that Biodiesel is a better solution then a complex Hybrid electric/gasoline setup.

 

True, but how many non-hybrid cars experience a 35% drop in MPG when the A/C is on? I can't name one. Maybe 2mpg at most, not 15-20.

Why should I give them a chance when PROVEN, RELIABLE alternatives (diesels) already exist, have all the kinks worked out, make a profit, are cheaper to build and to own,and GET BETTER MILEAGE?????

Yes, you just proved my point. Thanks!

I think the jury is still FARRRRRR from out on that, your personal conjecture aside.

Hopefully it will help, but lithium batteries aren't going to reduce costs or complexity or the inherit function of the system. You'll be able to run on battery longer, but when the gas motor kicks in the basic limitations of a gas IC engine still dominate, and then you turn the A/C on and lose all that efficiency.

I go back to one of my favorites, K.I.S.S. Why reinvent the wheel when the proven diesels already accomplish the same goal for a lot less cost and complexity? Diesels aren't eco-hip though, hybrids are. You won't catch Ed Begley Jr. driving a Golf TDI, but you will catch him driving a Prius. We all wan't to be hip like hollywood so hybrids are the "in" think regardless of whether they really deliver as promised. Its not so different from every other left-wing yuppie fad in that respect.

How much pollution and raw energy goes into building those batteries? Enough to make the efficiency of a hybrid vs. a diesel worth it over the 15 yr life of the car?

I know you're sold, you demonstrate that every time a hybrid thread comes up. I'm going to be a skeptic on hybrids until they provide evidence otherwise. The Segway was supposed to "revolutionize human transport" too and as of yet the only major sale they've made is to the post office.