redzed

1. The Town Car is being replaced by a stretched Ford 500...

Doesn't anyone remember the post-1988 FWD Lincoln Continental? Even after the last generation Continental gained the "detuned" V8, it was still a sales disaster. While I'm sure that a stretched 500 will be a better handling car than the Taurus based Continental, that isn't saying very much.

2. The Lincoln Zephyr is just a Mazda 6 derivative...

Has management already forgotten the failure of the Mondeo/Contour based Jaguar X-type? In the RWD dominated "near-luxury" segment, even an AWD car won't make it when it's based on a downmarket platform. Interestingly, the FWD/AWD X-type has bombed so badly that its successor will be RWD and won't even offer a sedan derivative. Which brings us to the next topic...

3. The Jaguar X-type replacement will be based on the RD-6 Concept, and will be a packaged just like a Mazda RX-8...

The RX-8 has received a very luke warm reception, not surprising since this poorly defined product was supposed to replace both the two-seat RX-7 and the deceased Miller-cycle Millenia. No word on whether Jaguar's own "RX-8" will be based on a shortened version of the S-type replacement or some other Ford group product. However, the X-type successor will have a roadster version as a SLK competitor.

4. The state of product planning at Jaguar appears to be in disarray to this outsider...

Only the VH-based XK replacement is a certainty. The S-type replacement will probably be based on the same alluminum body as the XJ, thus diverging from the Lincoln LS. In addition, Jaguar will dump the Duratec V6 in favor of Volvo's Inline-6. Packaging won't be at issue, since every post X-type Jaguar will have a longitudinal engine.

Still, I can see why there's confusion at Jaguar. The current alloy-bodied XJ was 4-5 years late to market, the current S-type was never a spectacular success and the X-type seems to be a flop.

5. Why do all three Aston Martins (V8 Vantage, DB-9 and Vanquish) all look just about exactly alike?

6. Is Land Rover's new LR3 (still a "Discovery" in Europe) just a rehash of the cancelled Jaguar X500 offroader?

guionM

Ford sees Cadillac and Chrysler abandoning a market that is still very viable. The "I'll-die-a-horrible-flaming-torturous-death-if-I-drive-RWD-at-the-first-sign-of-snow" crowd that still have a pathological fear of RWD in anything but clean dry roads. Those are the people who are lost now that the 300 is RWD & the people who are still making Cadillac's FWD DeVille the best selling Cadillac, despite the excellent CTS or the new STS. Notice, that "AWD" seems to be the phrase most used with these proposed new Lincolns.

This is a 180 degree turnaround from where Jac Nasser was taking Lincoln. Unfortunately, this was IMO probally the only area Nasser was 100% right on the money.

Former CEO Jac Nasser's main objective was to turn Lincoln into a world class auto line that featured RWD across the line. When Nasser was "retired" during Ford's meltdown, Lincoln entire product plan (which was very extensive) gutted & Mercury went on life support. The basic plan was to get the Ford division on solid ground & create versions of those vehicles for Mercury & Lincoln.

The car we know now as the Ford Five Hundred was initially visioned as a RWD car based on the new Mustang. Instead, Ford used an existing chassis from Volvo, and a RWD D2C based sedan was pushed back. How far back is the big question.

Ford is hellbent on keeping pace with what is a pretty brutal new vehicle introduction schedule over the next few years, which has already started. At the same time, Ford is even more hellbent on adding value and high style to their vehicles as well.

In order to pay for all this without resorting to the penny pinching in parts and service that got them into trouble in the 1st place, they are considering alot of things that IMHO they probally shouldn't, such as extended use of FWD chassis from Mazda & Volvo instead of extending the RWD D2C usage as was originally planned.

The interview from Autoweek is from Paul Mascarenas, who runs the medium and large front-drive and all-wheel-drive platform programs. He has a vested intrest in promoting FWD across the board since it IS his department. However, I'm sure there's a "large RWD" director who also has something to say before Product Chief, Philip Martens takes up the proposals with Bill Ford and the rest of Ford's Board of Directors later this year.

Personally I don't see the board going with RWD for the Town Car. I see next year's (2006) redesigned Town Car lingering around till next decade by which time, Ford will be less gunshy once GM & Chrysler have a horde of RWD vehicles.

There's ALOT of decisions scheduled over the next 6-12 months that will determine the direction of Ford for the next decade. Amoung them:

*Will Falcon be locked in as both right & left hand drive.
*Will the next Luxury Lincoln be a modified Panther chassis, or will it be a modified D2C.
*Will Town Car be based on an AWD version of the FiveHundred, or again continue on the Panther.
*Will the next LS be a version of the FiveHundred, or the D2C.
*Will Ford replace the Crown Victoria or Grand Marquis with a US version of the next Falcon.
*The final "hard points" or design of the next Thunderbird.

I can't say anything about Jaguar or Aston because they pretty much have their own autonomy within Ford beyond keeping the board informed, or the board assigning people to run those divisions.

In short, stay tuned, and let's see what Ford showcases this auto show season.

redzed

The failure of the current Lincoln Aviator (an Explorer with a Marauder motor), the Blackwood, the Marauder and the last-generation Cougar (originally supposed to be the Ford Probe, generation 3) should have warned Ford off further "badge engineered" Lincoln-Mercury products. As is, the product planning smacks of desperation.

Stealth 86 LSC

o.O this all sounds familiar... seems like me and redzed think alike.
even down to the 88 continental reference, in comparison with these 500 platformed TC rumors.
another thing, is FMC really going to sacrifice the HUGE profits they make on every panther sold by changing the formula on the model that I would assume brings in the most per sale?

redzed

The Five-Hundred smells like a Taurus replacement and the Freestyle looks like a Taurus wagon replacement (with a touch of Subaru Outback). Take away styling cripped from Audi, the platform borrowed from Volvo and the "crossover" hype. What's left? You've got a desperate FOMOCO that's hoping that consumers will believe that this thing is actually "upmarket," and won't hold out for Taurus levels of rebates.

The rumor of a Lincoln-badged Five-Hundred just goes to show that mood at Ford is something like "unreasoned euphoria." Will it all work? I mean, seriously, even Toyota didn't try to market a rebadged Avalon as a Lexus, and there must have been alot of temptation during the mid-90s "Yen Shock."

The Town Car is dying. Look around the better parts of South Florida, and the folks who are buying multi-million-dollar condos are driving cars in the Mercedes S-class league. Sure, Town Cars still cover the streets of Manhattan, but those cars are little more than "taxis." The future for the big Lincoln is in fleet service.

guesswhoo

All of the deaths listed above fell to the same fate the F-body did. LACK of advertising. And just to point out the Aviator is NOT a Marauder engine. And FYI the first 2 years of production the Cougar was a hit. It is a rapidly changing market it was in and Merc. did'nt update it quick enough and when they did it was'nt "enough" If they would of got to make the Couagr S (SVT Contour powered) it would of helped a boat load.

Stealth 86 LSC

and on that note, what of the success of the lincoln badged expedition that is the navigator? and is rebadging and modifying an explorer to make a lincoln any worse than rebadging and modifying a trailblazer to make a buick and a saab?
I actually do see a fair number of aviators on the road. some people love the luxury the navigator provides, but would like it in a slightly smaller package.
as far as mercury goes, yes, they are somewhat redundant nowadays. They lack the luxuries of a lincoln, and the pricing of a ford...the ultimate in mediocrity. They definitely need some kind of exciting product. maybe a cougar based off of d2c? hell, ANYTHING to make mercury have something special and all its own would go a long way towards helping them out.
now, back to lincoln... ALMOST all my questions were answered in PMs with guy.. ALMOST! still waiting for that response...

ProudPony

You are not far off.

Remember, Ford itself was in serious trouble after the Nasser-days. Explorer roll-overs, troubled Focus release, and numerous frivolous recalls for what are basically quality/safety concerns (Not issues related so much to fatalities) - these were all huge hits in the wallet. So first things first... get Ford healthy first, then worry about the other in-house brands.

That was the game plan, and it's working. The results are EXACTLY what redzed stated in the first post - Lincoln and Mercury were left to "exist as best they could" for a short while. The Marauder (though a GREAT idea) was not given a life to live because it brought so little to the survival of Ford. The Aviator came, went, and came back again. The Navigator was the FIRST luxury SUV on the market, and sold well out of the gate, but suffered (as the F-car did) from lack of advertising and company support for a while. And so forth... but while Lincoln and Mercury were "existing", Ford rolled out new Explorers, new Expeditions, new F-150s, new Focus, and new Mustangs - all of which are/will be hits, there is NO doubt. They also developed new cars and crossovers like the Freestar, Freestyle, and Five-Hundred.
So look where the emphasis went - into the main stream units that are the bread and butter of the mother company, not the also-ran cars of the wholly owned subsidiaries that contribute only 25-30% to the bottom line.

Now that Ford has revitalized the main cast, expect to see very different things from Linc/Merc divisions. I would bet on the Mercury you just described above Stealth 86 LSC. Also expect to see some unique Lincoln units too. Wouldn't an SVT Lincoln LS to go 1on1 with the CTSv be sweet?

Expect to see Lincoln set Caddy as it's benchmark target, with leaching market share from MB and Lexus. Luxury to the Nth degree with quality to boot and a little sportyness thrown in for youthful flavor.
Expect to see Mercury align itself with the likes of the G35, MB C-class, BMW 3-series type cars. A blend of luxury AND power AND sportiness with no extreme quantity of either of the 3, just a good balanced blend of them all.
These cars are coming.

Putting on some rose-colored glasses for a second, I am very disappointed that some of the good ideas from 3 years ago have been 86'ed. I think Mercury should have simply dropped the 4-cam 4.6 into the Marauder, and ADVERTISED it. The blown Cobra motor would be even more sweet, and it would only require bolting it in?!?! The concept of a 4-dr drop-top was unreal. I think it would have sold in decent low-volume quantity VERY well, especially in places like Florida and Cali where the baby-boomers could drop the top and cruise in pairs AND in back-seat comfort. Even develop a 2-dr Marauder - I say go for it. I'd like to see the Marauder have another go at it, I'd even consider one for a fair weather family truckster.

Lincoln should have kept the Blackwood - period. Where I live, I see $40-50k pickups all the time. Guys buy a $40k pickup (Ford Dodge or Chevy) and immediately go to a custom shop for grill bars, wheels, tires, graphics, sound systems, fiberglass hoods, rear wings, custom dual exhausts, you name it. The price of the Blackwood was steep, but what really killed it was (again) lack of advertising. Nobody knew it was even available. It should be revived for Lincoln on the new F-150 chassis, given the 3V-5.4 minimum with a blown 5.4 optional (aka the '03 Lightning) offered with an optional manual tranny, and put in an ad on the front of every newspaper in the country for a week.
And BTW, the teaque wood in the bed was BEAUTIFUL, but I wondered how it would survive if owned by a low-maintenace person.

So anyways, even as a Ford person, I am aware of the misgivings of Linc/Merc for the last few years, but I also know of a few things going on inside, and I think they will be pleasantly surprising. Give them 2-3 years, and they should be back strong. It's really not so different as the GM situation with Lutz coming in post-Zarella. Some things just take time to iron out.

Stealth 86 LSC

Given that the new continental (LS replacement) is supposedly on the D2C platform, that would mean that the upcoming cobras powerplant would tuck between those framerails nicely. THERES a SVT lincoln for ya

ProudPony

Fair enough!

I think the point you make best is that Ford (as does GM and DCX) has a lot of well-proven tools in place that could make some really nice rides - IF put together in the right packages and marketed properly.

Overall, the trend I see sticking out of the mud the most is that a single model car will NEVER sell at the volumes they used to back in the 60s and 70s. We will NEVER see 650k units of ONE model sold in one year again. Individuality, uniqueness, and specialty are what stirs the passion in buyers (and their wallets) these days. The successful carmakers of the future will figure out the most economical ways to offer unique vehicles at the price of a mass-produced unit. If Linc/Merc can be heavy in that equation based on Ford volume sales units, then they should do well. But if Ford misses the mark with uniqueness OR money, the gig is up. Reference our comments here on this board about the recent T-bird and Marauder iterations, and then what happened to sales.