All the pro-IRS people here keep making the argument that Mustang gets away with live axle because "its the only game in town" or "its the only car in its segment" or "it has no competition".

I think this is a red herring.

Why?

Because there's plenty of competition for Mustang. They may not be cars that follow Mustang's exact formula (aka Pony Car) but there are other cars out there I'm certain Mustang buyers consider if not even test drive.

Sure your hard core enthusiasts are going to go buy a Mustang just because its a Mustang, but we had those buyers too. Just look at your more typical buyer though.

What makes any of you think they are not going to cross-shop a 350Z, G35, Monte Carlo, RX8, GTO, Ion Coupe, Accord V6 coupe, or even a BMW 3-series coupe? Certainly depends on if you're a V6 or GT buyer but I'd say every one of those cars is competition depending on the level of Mustang you're looking at, and I'm sure there are more.

Its a total fallacy to say the Mustang has NO competition, because people are constantly choosing among various vehicles that fit their needs and personal tastes. Yes I will conceed the Mustang is unique in its formulation right now but it is not unique in its utility, # of doors, # of tires, etc.

When somebody is just shopping for a "sporty coupe" I think all of the above cars are "in play". The fact remains that there are other cars out there with IRS that clearly are not winning over Mustang buyers in droves. Mustang just has the hot formula right now everybody wants, and the live axle is not the deal breaker for these people or they'd be out buying the other cars above.

Now....proceed to tell me why I'm wrong....

 

You aren't. A great majority of the members of this site have tunnel vision when it comes to Camaro vs. Mustang. They ain't the only boys on the block.

 

Damn straight, bro.

 

the 350z, G35, monte, rx8, gto, bmw are too much money and the ion and accord are too ugly.

 

In generality, yes, but in specifics it's not that clear cut.

I know from experience that most people shopping a 350Z or G35 do not consider a Mustang. It's too 'low brow'

Same with the ION, SRT-4 and Cobalt SS. It's not their culture. The classification 'sport coupes' opens opens alot of apples to oranges to pears comparos.

So, I think you're kinda right.

 

The 350z and the Monte are too much money vs a Mustang GT? I don't know about that.

And and as the the low-brow...the New mustang has busted all the mulletbarriers out there. The car is cool and retro and therefore gotta have, so hip yuppies aren't going to get laughed at in the parking garage for driving an '05 Mustang like they would have been for driving an '04 Mustang.

Matt Drudge is driving an '05 GT now...

So, I think all those cars are in play right now. Maybe when the coolness wears off things will change, but for now I think its a mistake to assume there's no competition and that could lead to faulty conclusions about what a future pony car needs to be.

 

Just b/c car are crossshoped doesn't mean they are direct competition. I cross shopped a Colorado Z71 and GTO.

Mustang GT is all about RWD, 300+toruqe, 4 seats, and $25K.

Monte = FWD
Accord = FWD
Ion/Cobalt = FWD
3 series coupe = more $$ less HP
GTO = more $$
G35 = more $$
RX8 = 159 torque too weak compared to a GT, too expensive compared to a base V6.

Now if someone is willing to buy a 300HP FWD Monte over a 300HP RWD Mustang then they are not going to care about IRS. The closest cars to a Mustang GT are the GTO and G35. Both cost a fair amount more. If the GTO and G35 were $26K in base trim then the Mustang would not be getting as good of press coverage as it is.

 

here in canada a 350z starts at like 46k and a monte ss at the dealer was MSRP at 43k and was rebated down to 31k. a mustang GT starts at 32k.

 

I won't disagree with you, but there is an element that won't consider a Mustang because it's domestic, it's old looking (retro is a fad or gimmick in their eyes, and a damned expensive one), unsophistacate, and just isn't one their radar, mullet busting or not.

Is this the same Matt Drudge that posts news headlines without checking sources and something like 80% of what he posts turns out to be rumors or speculation?

 

Coming from a person that has owned a 4th gen Z28, Mustang Cobra with IRS and a 350Z, I also have driven e46 M3's, RX-8's, S2000's, AMG CLK 55's, 911's, Z06's, G35's, M5's (yes a high performance coupe (Camaro) will be compared to all of the cars I just mentioned) all with IRS. I am no expert but I think I've had enough experience to know that an IRS is not negotiable. It is required.

 

I think you guys are still missing the forest for the trees.

The whole point is that there's not 200,000 Mustang buyers out there saying "well I had to buy this car because its the only choice I have".

 

if you have 35k and want a cool looking car it is.

 

The mustang IRS was crap. A lot of the cobra guys switched to a solid axel anyway. Wheel hop was terrible. IRS is absolutely not required and only a hardcore road racer will notice the diffrence over a properly setup live axel. The new mustang proves that.

 

It's not their only choice as you mentioned. But the majority of people that buy the Mustang and F-bodies don't cross shop those other cars. Very few do. IMHO the only advantage the Mustang has is it's price. I know a Mustang GT will whip a G35 in a straight line but in the twisties a G35 will kill it. Plus there is a Mustang available for every one: an under $20k car to a $30K plus car all with different levels of equipment.

 

Well, perhaps, maybe we're looking at different forests. But, consider this: If you take projected Mustang sales, subtract what the F-twins used to sell at (keeping all things equal for simplicity), is the new 'Stang really a stellar sales success?

If we're throwing around the number 200k (which by itself is fantastic), subtract 70-80K for the last fews years of F-Body sales.

That would hypothetically have 'Stang sales around 120-130K a year. I don't remember exact numbers off top of my head, but from what I remember that isn't a phenomenal or even substantial increase in sales. So there is a fair amount of weight, IMO, to the arguement the mustang owns it's own market.

Thus my thesis arguement: Mustanmg sells phenomenolly because it's all alone in a market segment: $25-$28K V8 RWD coupes.