They're both front engine rear drive v8s at close to the same size. I know that aluminum costs more but is lighter than steel. You don't need to work every little detail to understand that there are offsets that high end cars have to the higher level of equipment.

 

Doubt that. My 17 year old 5 series has real chunks of wood. Wood, stain, finish. That's it.

It looks better than the old one, but it still doesn't do anything for me. The interior is amazing. I think stitching that matched the leather on the dash would quiet it down properly.

 

Pretty much all luxury car manufacturers have moved to a process where they use a thin layer of real wood over a backed and reinforced structure. So it's nice, real, highly polished wood, but it's usually under a centimeter thick. The backing they use makes it feel solid though. Net result is lower weight, lower cost, far lower chance of warping in the future, and consumers that are non the wiser.

In some cases they still use a 'whole' piece of wood, but that's generally when it's not really all that thick in the first place.

 

Makes sense. Given Euro CO2 limits, I expect the luxury makers (especially sporty luxury) to be very weight conscious.

 

My guess would be that they are wood veneers, more like a couple of millimeters thick. A centimeter would be very generous (as far as the actual wood goes; the whole wood + backing structure might be that size).

 

Gone throgh this thread. Touch on a few points.

1. NO, luxo stuff isn't heavy..... What "Luxo stuff" are you talking about? Leather? Padded dash? Better ***** on the stereo? Sorry, there isn't anything near 700 pounds of "better materials in that BMW.

2. NO, it isn't "fit and finish".... It doesn't take any more weight to make a gap line up perfectly, and better gloss og the plastics, leather, and paint doesn't add ounces, let alone 700 pounds.

3. It not just luxury car buyers who don't give a crap about weight, it's 99.9999% of Camaro buyers as well. The only people who really give that much of a damn about weight are the weight hawks on an enthusiast site. It would be worthless to say that GM is even bigger on keeping weight down then these guys....after all, GM engineers are simply only trying to get as much fuel economy out of the cars they make as possible, and weight is only an important way of doing this.

Guys, this Camaro-is-heavy issue hass gotten old and irrelevent.

The car gets great fuel economy, handles well, and is both quick and fast.

If you want a 3500 pound Camaro, then get ready for a V6 Camaro with 3rd gen brakes and a live axle.

If you still feel that there is such thing as a 500+ horsepower capable chassis that wears multi piston 14" brakes, has IRS, has a drivetrain that easily handles that power not only without grenading but has litigation preventing the safety margins, and carries 275 tires on 20" rims that weighs less than the Camaro, then by all means post it.

The bottom line here (and I know some here would rather swallow razor blades than admit it) but GM actually did a great job in keeping a car with the equptment and features like the 5th gen Camaro has, as low in weight as it is.

Every other car on the planet weighs more..... A LOT more.


FWIW,
sure a IRS, RWD, BMW 3 series weighs about 3500 pounds.....

..... but that 3 series has only 6 cylinders and is also smaller than a (3100 pound) Chevy Cruze too!

Go look it up.

 

I dunno... the wood in my 99 GS400 was, depending on the piece, between 0.5 and 1 cm thick in my estimation. Knocking on it and pushing on it there's no way you could tell it wasn't a solid chunk of wood... it felt and sounded very thick.

First of all, the difference being discussed here is 400 pounds.

Second of all, yes lux stuff weighs more. More sound deadening (including things like thicker/multi-ply glass), more padded materials, more electronic gizmos and power motors and just features in general, heavier duty hinges, switches and clips, more cosmetic trim pieces, possibly beefier sheet metal, sometimes more complex engines and/or chassis (The 650i's DOHC TT V8 will weigh more, for example), bigger wheels/tires, transmissions with more gears, reinforcements and complexities in the drivetrain to reduce noise and vibration, etc. And then don't forget compound weight... the weight that is added because you've added weight. Things like beefier brakes and suspension components to support the additional weight... those things weigh more in and of themselves.


Example:
I remember reading once that the Lexus GX470 had a total of 70 additional pounds of sound deadening material in it that the 4runner (its mechanical TWIN, built side by side in the same plant) did not have.

And speaking of the 4runner and GX470, a topic I'm very familiar with since I have a 4runner. They truly are mechanical and electrical twins in almost all ways when similarly equipped. And yet a 4WD V8 2005 4runner's curb weight is 370 pounds less than a 4WD V8 2005 GX470.

Yes, most people don't care about car weight just like most people don't care about the intricacies of what the chef does to cook their meal. But they don't care about it because they don't understand it. What they do understand is whether or not they enjoy driving the car, or eating the meal.

 

Excellent example.

FWIW, I just parked my Vette next to a new Camaro earlier this week and that's one big b*tch. I never appreciated how big they were before.