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Michelin re-invents the wheel

Old Dec 4, 2008 | 01:57 PM
  #16  
Geoff Chadwick's Avatar
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Originally Posted by Angelis83LT
considering the weight savings vs the standard car if you were to get rid of all the drivetrain, you could probably make a car under a ton. rather than what we have now at 1.5 to 2 tons.
The drivetrain on a modern V8 car is sub 500lb for the engine and sub 100lb for the transmission. Axles and Differentials will add some more weight. A 4000lb G8 GXP is less than 20% drivetrain weight.

Realize that you'd then add the motors at each wheel (25lb each at the lightest!!) and run cables to each wheel (not small wire). You just forsake some of that weight savings. Then you need your battery pack. There is no weight savings. Electrics to this day are the heavier option.

4 cylinder cars will be lighter than an electric by far.

No, the only advantage to this is packaging. You'd only need to run one chassis node and a couple cables to each wheel. That simplifies chassis design dramatically.
Old Dec 4, 2008 | 03:32 PM
  #17  
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Originally Posted by Geoff Chadwick
The drivetrain on a modern V8 car is sub 500lb for the engine and sub 100lb for the transmission.
You've never shipped a T56, have you?
Old Dec 4, 2008 | 04:56 PM
  #18  
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Originally Posted by JakeRobb
You've never shipped a T56, have you?
I can second that he never has.
Old Dec 4, 2008 | 05:29 PM
  #19  
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i got a t56 shipped i think it was ~135lbs
Old Dec 4, 2008 | 06:21 PM
  #20  
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Originally Posted by Geoff Chadwick
The drivetrain on a modern V8 car is sub 500lb for the engine and sub 100lb for the transmission. Axles and Differentials will add some more weight. A 4000lb G8 GXP is less than 20% drivetrain weight.

Realize that you'd then add the motors at each wheel (25lb each at the lightest!!) and run cables to each wheel (not small wire). You just forsake some of that weight savings. Then you need your battery pack. There is no weight savings. Electrics to this day are the heavier option.

4 cylinder cars will be lighter than an electric by far.

No, the only advantage to this is packaging. You'd only need to run one chassis node and a couple cables to each wheel. That simplifies chassis design dramatically.
Look at the design of that car they have them in. the entire car chassis is redesigned in such a way that would save extreme amounts of weight in material alone just for the chassis because it could be made much smaller.
you are thinking just in weigh of the drivetrain. I am talking whole car design. there are significant design differences in how a car with those wheels would be built compared to how ours are built today, leading to a much lighter car.
Old Dec 4, 2008 | 09:12 PM
  #21  
Geoff Chadwick's Avatar
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Originally Posted by akafred
i got a t56 shipped i think it was ~135lbs
I could lift it off the ground and carry it around. It didnt feel over 100lb to me. Maybe going to the gym paid off.

you are thinking just in weigh of the drivetrain. I am talking whole car design. there are significant design differences in how a car with those wheels would be built compared to how ours are built today, leading to a much lighter car.
I am well aware of how something like that could be done - I've done some design work on something similar for a *tube chassis*. You could get something the size and weight of a Smart fourtwo to do that under 2000lb pretty easily (though you'd have to add weight to the chassis!). But to get a mid size or full size car? In order to maintain modern safety regs (ie crumple zones and crash protection) and some minimal level of comfort - I'd like to see you try to get it under 2000lb.

This idea has been around for a very long time, and there are many good reasons it took this long till someone even showed a concept of it, much less put it to production.
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