Got this off of LS1GTO:

__________________

 

Pretty much how I have felt about the new GTO all along.

*pats self on back*

 

I just posted this in another thread. Your beat me to it Z284ever!

 

Thats good news. Maybe the 2009 GTO will be shown at the 2007 NAIAS

 

Know what scares me guys?
There is all this hype about cars that are coming in 2008, 2009, and 2010... big HP, new technology, heck maybe they will have 32" rims by then with 24" rotors and pads the size of a magazine cover. ALL the manufacturers... Ford, GM, Dodge, all of them are saying that "XXXX is coming... in Y years".

In that amount of time, ANYTHING is possible. Just look what has happened in the last year... shoot, SIX MONTHS for that matter. Katrina and Rita knocked gas up to record highs, and we are still recovering. Insurance rates are being studied RIGHT NOW from the fallout of those storms, and the recent surge in high-performance cars is getting noticed too. (My godfather is a 30-year vet at Nationwide, and he tells me nightmarish things are happening right now. "Got a Hemi?" may soon be followed by "Gotta second mortgage?")

Along the lines of a new GTO, an even faster Vette (on top of what's already out?!?!), Camaro coming back, the GT500, the Mach 1, the BOSS 302, the Challenger, the Charger SRT, and a bookoo more... is there REALLY going to be a market for these types of cars? Gas-guzzlers (well, compared to 45 mpg grocery-getters they are), expensive to operate (tires, pads, oil/lube, etc), high-maintenance, etc., etc... just how many people are going to be there with cash in hand in 4-5 years for these cars? I know WE probably will - guys like us in this forum - but I think the average buying public will wander away from the retro/musclecar fad when gas hits $5/gallon and your monthly insurance premium costs more than the car payment. Really, as soon as hybrids become more readily available, and the Jonses' at the Country Club get one - it will be come the "new thing". The yuppies that are now buying 300C and Chargers because they are "the rage" will be trading them in on hybrids and bio-fuel-powered yuppie-mobiles. Mark my words.

I'm glad Lutz has sparked an interest in keeping GTO around - we know he loves the car because he is the one who fought so hard to get it in the first place. I guess I'm just getting really tired of the 4-year-away rhetoric that I keep hearing so much of lately... things are changing fast in this modern world, yet car design and production seem to be the exception to that rule. Why can't they come out now to meet the current market? Why must they go on "hiatus" at all if there is a market?
Me no understandy..

 

2 tidbits about this I like, aside from a new GTO being confirmed...

1) Notice the '09 debut? I guarantee this is when our 5th gen will debut as well, as they'll be sister cars. I doubt Chevy will pull the Camaro that far ahead of the GTO...
2) Its confirmed that I will FINALLY get my Grand Prix replacement I've been crying for since the first time I sat in a 2004 model back in May 2003. I am 98% confident GTO will have a 4 door sibling, and that will be my GP replacement. And again, if anyone from GM is listening...

If you call it a G8 instead of a Grand Prix, you'll have an angry 2001 Grand Prix owner storming Renaissance Center...

 

I'm very glad to see Lutz confirming this. I will be in line for a GTO.

As for muscle cars being a 'fad', well that's pretty ridiculous - just look at the continuous success of the Mustang for example. HYBRIDS are more likely to be the fad, once people start realizing how much a replacement battery pack costs and once they do the math on the true (paltry) economic benefits of the hybrid vehicle. Just look at the demographics - a lot of the baby-boom generation was weaned and raised on RWD V8's and they will be a ready-made market for all these cars. Sorry Japan Inc... you are not invited

 

Great News, I just read the article in my Plain Dealer. I have always been a Pontiac fan at heart and can't wait to see what the designers can do for the new GTO!! Make it sleek and modern, and hopefully they just improve upon an already great interior. I wish it was 2008 already!!

 

I wouldn't call 30mpg out of a 5.3L DoD Camaro a Gas Guzzler. Remember 50%+ of the new vehicles sold are trucks, and not many trucks get over 25mpg hwy even. Plus GM has there 2 stage hybrid V8 powertrain that the Tahoe and Escalade are getting. How cool would it be to have a 403HP 6.2L Camaro that gets 35mpg

If bio-diesel becomes the rage, what is stopping GM from putting a V6 Duramax in a GTO? 450tq Bio-diesel GTO works for me.

 

I'm with Guy.

I don't see the performance car market "pie" getting as big as it needs to be to support all the vehicles coming down the pipe.

 

Guy didn't post it. ProudPony did.


I don't think the muscle cars will be a fad. Who is to say they are saturating the market past the point that the market can hold? When was the last time we had this many cars of this kind to choose from? For the people that don't want the muscle cars, there are a slew of other more economical cars out there for purchase. All I see is increasing market diversity. I am not usually the overwhelming optimist, but I am not ready to be the harbinger of doom for the new age of muscle cars yet. History doesn't always repeat, and circumstances aren't exactly the same.

One thing I did take notice in the article was the mention of the blue devil. How many months ago was it when we were discussing it on these boards, and many of the members were so sure there was never going to be a higher performing Vette? I can even recall many of the members who felt that way. It is looking more and more likely with every new piece of information we get (official or leaked) that something is coming in regards to the Vette.

It is good to know the GTO is not being forgotten after only 3 years. Pulling Pontiacs halo car is pretty much the polar opposite of the proverbial good idea.

 

Well, you are on the Future Vehicle forum....and development of new architectures for these cars takes time....

As far as doom-and-gloom for performance cars go, I think it could end up being much like what we saw after 1970. Those automakers who are A) well prepared and B) determined to keep performance alive will still build the kinds of things we want. Chrysler couldn't keep their muscle cars going, and today the Hemi is still the leading V8 gas guzzler around, it seems like it can only be offered in 2-ton plus vehicles, and still is not offered with a stick. Mustang, the F-bodies and Corvette survived because Ford and GM were willing to let those cars see their way through the "dark years" of performance in the realization that one day technology would allow them to be quicker than ever before, even with the new challenges posed by gasoline prices, insurance, and emissions. I can only hope they stand just as defiant if the you-know-what hits the fan.

 

I think we were lucky in alot of respects to seeing these cars still around, especially the Mustang and the Camaro. The Camaro was supposed to be nixed in the 70s, but looks like lucked turned out in our favor. If the Mustang had gone the way of FWD, I would find it highly unlikely to believe it would be in the market today. Look where the Probe got. There was even some talk many years ago about the viability of the Vette, but I doubt that was as much of a "close call" as the other two.

 

Hope it looks cool this time.

 

Lutz wants a new GTO?

Well DUH!



I've been saying this since I started following Holden's work on Zeta a long time ago. Bob Lutz has made no secret he wants the GTO to continue. He's even already stated what design direction the new GTO will go....by name I might add. Ed Welburn has also hinted GTO's direction by talking about Pontiac in general! I've also been saying Holden has a replacement Monaro and GTO drawn up for awhile.

About the only thing that hasn't happened is that GM hasn't collectively tracked people down and slammed them on the head with a baseball bat saying "We are going to make a new GTO". Geeez!




Decisions on cars DO NOT change week to week with every new rumor from every self adsorbed or out of the loop employee. A one year delay in a car scheduled for 2008 does not mean the car is moved 3 years into the next decade

I started realizing some of these so-called GM employees were full of s*it when they started telling me that certain cars weren't going to be out till after 2010 at the earliest when at the time I actually knew where these cars were in development via Holden. So I started doubting their input on the rest of the RWD program.

I may occasionally get things wrong with GM-NA (due to wrong insight or too many people who supposedly "know what's going on). But Holden is a different story. Holden is doing most of the work on the RWD program, NOT GM-NA. GM-NA is pretty taxed out (which FBodfather alluded to in no fewer than 2 posts).



Finally, for the love of GOD, this chassis has a high priority with GM. These cars are needed yesterday because they are going to be the structure for at least 3 sedans GM needs, and at least 2 coupes.

ALOT of red tape, and time consuming corners are being cut with these cars. They are NOT going to take 5 more years to get to market. They are NOT going to have the normal lengthy development time. And the idea that GM still has no clue as to what these cars are going to be powered by, or that the Camaro development started after the concept debuted is ludicrious.

GM KNOWS what engines they are going to put in these things. It's already part of the plan.


Forgive me if it sounds like I'm ranting, but it's good to finally vent. I've been biting my tounge quite a bit the past 6 months or so at every new rumor that's cropped up here and elsewhere. It's good that BL finally cleared the air.



Like I've been saying:

RWD coupes: Projected production at the end of calendar 2007 or early 2008.

RWD sedans...including Pontiac...expect calendar 2008 & 2009.

(There is an allowence for last minute issues, which is why the 2008CY/2009MY target)

For the base engine, look at what VE will use. The mid engine is a no brainer. the top engine and horsepower is going to be a trade secret till they come out. That's someone else's spotlight to say if they ever want to.



That's the best information you are going to get without anyone burning bridges.

Again, unless you know someone actually with their hands on a project, Bob Lutz is the best source of leaks if you follow everything he says and keep it in context (and don't overreact when he speaks from the cuff).


I don't think I need any "winkys" needed here, no "winky club" membership is required to read this, and I don't believe I have to worry about this post being deleted.