just a thought
01-06-2004, 04:26 PM
#1
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Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: Pittsburgh Pa USA
Posts: 403
just a thought
Much has been debated about the models for the 5th Gen Camaro. It has also been been debated about a super camaro to take on the Cobra Mustang, and I like I think most of the board have shot down that idea because it isn't logical to think of a Camaro that expensive and outpowering a Corvette. I thought about it awhile, but maybe it is.
Think about it, the new Cobalt will have two SS options. Since the Camaro and Cavalier of the past traditionally take after each other, why not in the future?
I saw a post not too long ago about C6 models, and it mentioned something about a "Super Corvette". The reason GM wanted to do this, as it stated, was to take the market away from Ford and make the GT look silly for half the price. Now this isn't a huge market, so why bother? To snuff ford is the only real answer.
So this brings me to my line of thinking....
The models I'd have for the 5th Gen would be as follows:
Camaro (3.5L V-6)
Camaro RS (eaton supercharged 3.5L V-6 with some visual upgrades)
Camaro Z/28 (302 V-8, faster than a GT Mustang but goes back to a road racer idea)
Camaro SS (LS2 V-8, around 380 HP)
Camaro SS/ZL1 (LS3 V-8)
Now the SS/ZL1 I think should be what the cobra is today. A very limited production car. I believe it should have nothing in mind but straight line performance, and lots of it. I would price it just slightly higher than the base vette, and put it out in such limited numbers that it really doesn't take away the corvette's market. Also, since agility isn't in it's book, it wouldn't have the presitige of the Vette, so I don't think it'd hurt it in any manner. The sole idea of the Camaro would be to take away Ford's Glory, and let everyone know about it. With the Corvette stomping the Ford GT, and the Camaro smashing the Cobra, it'd certainly be an American Revolution. It'd also help get rid of the public misconception that haunted the 4th Gen that Mustangs were faster. I think that's key to a successful 5th Gen.
Those are just my thoughts. I could be wildly off, or just dreaming.
Think about it, the new Cobalt will have two SS options. Since the Camaro and Cavalier of the past traditionally take after each other, why not in the future?
I saw a post not too long ago about C6 models, and it mentioned something about a "Super Corvette". The reason GM wanted to do this, as it stated, was to take the market away from Ford and make the GT look silly for half the price. Now this isn't a huge market, so why bother? To snuff ford is the only real answer.
So this brings me to my line of thinking....
The models I'd have for the 5th Gen would be as follows:
Camaro (3.5L V-6)
Camaro RS (eaton supercharged 3.5L V-6 with some visual upgrades)
Camaro Z/28 (302 V-8, faster than a GT Mustang but goes back to a road racer idea)
Camaro SS (LS2 V-8, around 380 HP)
Camaro SS/ZL1 (LS3 V-8)
Now the SS/ZL1 I think should be what the cobra is today. A very limited production car. I believe it should have nothing in mind but straight line performance, and lots of it. I would price it just slightly higher than the base vette, and put it out in such limited numbers that it really doesn't take away the corvette's market. Also, since agility isn't in it's book, it wouldn't have the presitige of the Vette, so I don't think it'd hurt it in any manner. The sole idea of the Camaro would be to take away Ford's Glory, and let everyone know about it. With the Corvette stomping the Ford GT, and the Camaro smashing the Cobra, it'd certainly be an American Revolution. It'd also help get rid of the public misconception that haunted the 4th Gen that Mustangs were faster. I think that's key to a successful 5th Gen.
Those are just my thoughts. I could be wildly off, or just dreaming.
01-06-2004, 04:33 PM
#2
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Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Pewee Valley, KY
Posts: 4,600
Re: just a thought
Originally posted by CamaroRSguy
Much has been debated about the models for the 5th Gen Camaro. It has also been been debated about a super camaro to take on the Cobra Mustang, and I like I think most of the board have shot down that idea because it isn't logical to think of a Camaro that expensive and outpowering a Corvette. I thought about it awhile, but maybe it is.
Think about it, the new Cobalt will have two SS options. Since the Camaro and Cavalier of the past traditionally take after each other, why not in the future?
I saw a post not too long ago about C6 models, and it mentioned something about a "Super Corvette". The reason GM wanted to do this, as it stated, was to take the market away from Ford and make the GT look silly for half the price. Now this isn't a huge market, so why bother? To snuff ford is the only real answer.
So this brings me to my line of thinking....
The models I'd have for the 5th Gen would be as follows:
Camaro (3.5L V-6)
Camaro RS (eaton supercharged 3.5L V-6 with some visual upgrades)
Camaro Z/28 (302 V-8, faster than a GT Mustang but goes back to a road racer idea)
Camaro SS (LS2 V-8, around 380 HP)
Camaro SS/ZL1 (LS3 V-8)
Now the SS/ZL1 I think should be what the cobra is today. A very limited production car. I believe it should have nothing in mind but straight line performance, and lots of it. I would price it just slightly higher than the base vette, and put it out in such limited numbers that it really doesn't take away the corvette's market. Also, since agility isn't in it's book, it wouldn't have the presitige of the Vette, so I don't think it'd hurt it in any manner. The sole idea of the Camaro would be to take away Ford's Glory, and let everyone know about it. With the Corvette stomping the Ford GT, and the Camaro smashing the Cobra, it'd certainly be an American Revolution. It'd also help get rid of the public misconception that haunted the 4th Gen that Mustangs were faster. I think that's key to a successful 5th Gen.
Those are just my thoughts. I could be wildly off, or just dreaming.
Much has been debated about the models for the 5th Gen Camaro. It has also been been debated about a super camaro to take on the Cobra Mustang, and I like I think most of the board have shot down that idea because it isn't logical to think of a Camaro that expensive and outpowering a Corvette. I thought about it awhile, but maybe it is.
Think about it, the new Cobalt will have two SS options. Since the Camaro and Cavalier of the past traditionally take after each other, why not in the future?
I saw a post not too long ago about C6 models, and it mentioned something about a "Super Corvette". The reason GM wanted to do this, as it stated, was to take the market away from Ford and make the GT look silly for half the price. Now this isn't a huge market, so why bother? To snuff ford is the only real answer.
So this brings me to my line of thinking....
The models I'd have for the 5th Gen would be as follows:
Camaro (3.5L V-6)
Camaro RS (eaton supercharged 3.5L V-6 with some visual upgrades)
Camaro Z/28 (302 V-8, faster than a GT Mustang but goes back to a road racer idea)
Camaro SS (LS2 V-8, around 380 HP)
Camaro SS/ZL1 (LS3 V-8)
Now the SS/ZL1 I think should be what the cobra is today. A very limited production car. I believe it should have nothing in mind but straight line performance, and lots of it. I would price it just slightly higher than the base vette, and put it out in such limited numbers that it really doesn't take away the corvette's market. Also, since agility isn't in it's book, it wouldn't have the presitige of the Vette, so I don't think it'd hurt it in any manner. The sole idea of the Camaro would be to take away Ford's Glory, and let everyone know about it. With the Corvette stomping the Ford GT, and the Camaro smashing the Cobra, it'd certainly be an American Revolution. It'd also help get rid of the public misconception that haunted the 4th Gen that Mustangs were faster. I think that's key to a successful 5th Gen.
Those are just my thoughts. I could be wildly off, or just dreaming.
01-06-2004, 04:50 PM
#3
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Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: Sarasota FL
Posts: 3,375
Re: Re: just a thought
Originally posted by 91_z28_4me
1st things first while we pretty much all agree that a mid level V8 or high output v6 would be cool it ain't going to happen. If we have anything it will be a v6 and v8. The only possibility is a Z06 type Z28 which while not a bad thing would probably not make it passed the bean counters.
1st things first while we pretty much all agree that a mid level V8 or high output v6 would be cool it ain't going to happen. If we have anything it will be a v6 and v8. The only possibility is a Z06 type Z28 which while not a bad thing would probably not make it passed the bean counters.
01-06-2004, 04:53 PM
#4
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Join Date: Jun 2001
Location: Pewee Valley, KY
Posts: 4,600
Re: Re: Re: just a thought
Originally posted by Jason E
Wrong...others as well as myself have heard there WILL be a third engine, a V8 no less. Shame on more of you for not attending the F Body Gathering in Bowling Green
Wrong...others as well as myself have heard there WILL be a third engine, a V8 no less. Shame on more of you for not attending the F Body Gathering in Bowling Green
I hadn't heard anything about this, as I was one of the lazy SOB's not attending at bowling green, and I only live 1.5 hours away.
. Is there anything else those of you who did attend would like to share with the rest of the class???
01-06-2004, 05:13 PM
#5
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Join Date: Aug 2001
Location: Crystal Falls, MI USA
Posts: 764
Re: just a thought
Originally posted by CamaroRSguy
With the Corvette stomping the Ford GT, and the Camaro smashing the Cobra, it'd certainly be an American Revolution.
With the Corvette stomping the Ford GT, and the Camaro smashing the Cobra, it'd certainly be an American Revolution.
I mean, come on, GM has been doing that since time began.
01-06-2004, 06:06 PM
#6
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Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: cinci
Posts: 3,772
not sure what the ls3 (maybe the 5.3 variation on the ls platform?)
i wouldnt hold my breath on a 3.5L engine either, and certianly not one with a supercharger (the 3.9 will most likely go in)
the 302 could be done but doubt it will happen (why build a whole new engine for just the camaro?)
but here's where i think you could have something..
a zl1 camaro
harken back to 1969 when 69 zl1s were made, say we throw the z06 engine (ls7) in and that could blow away the cobra and with the corvette "super car" (would be nice to call it a zl1 too ala 1969 again) and have them both trash ford
i wouldnt hold my breath on a 3.5L engine either, and certianly not one with a supercharger (the 3.9 will most likely go in)
the 302 could be done but doubt it will happen (why build a whole new engine for just the camaro?)
but here's where i think you could have something..
a zl1 camaro
harken back to 1969 when 69 zl1s were made, say we throw the z06 engine (ls7) in and that could blow away the cobra and with the corvette "super car" (would be nice to call it a zl1 too ala 1969 again) and have them both trash ford
01-06-2004, 07:20 PM
#7
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Join Date: Feb 2002
Location: At car shows and cruise nights!
Posts: 3,647
Turning the Z28 back into a 302ci high HP, high revving road racer, is incredibly incredibly unlikely. Making it a Z06-like low production/limited content top model also kinda like it was way back is an idea that I hear is being considered. (which would be great and fitting of the name and its' history ) Making it a cheap, boring, out of character, bargain performance mid-model like the mid-later 4th Gen is I hope not even an option.
A 427 ZL1 or something like that would be fanatastic!
) Making it a cheap, boring, out of character, bargain performance mid-model like the mid-later 4th Gen is I hope not even an option.A 427 ZL1 or something like that would be fanatastic!
Last edited by IZ28; 01-06-2004 at 09:45 PM.
01-06-2004, 08:34 PM
#8
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Join Date: May 2003
Location: NW Burbs Chicago, IL USA
Posts: 218
I totally agree.
Chevrolet should start giving customers engine production options again. Having 2 engine options in the Camaro is a far cry from the past. I actually wouldn't mind seeing the I-5 from the Bel Air concept come into play here, either, provided that they put it into a sorta RS model that's in the middle of the V6 base and V8 Z28.
And when it comes to the Mustang Cobra, if the next Camaro SS doesn't get a horsepower/torque rating above and beyond I think it would be an insult. A nice limited engine option here would be a welcome addition, too. People buy Corvettes because they're Corvettes. They don't want Camaros because they're Camaros.
Chevrolet should start giving customers engine production options again. Having 2 engine options in the Camaro is a far cry from the past. I actually wouldn't mind seeing the I-5 from the Bel Air concept come into play here, either, provided that they put it into a sorta RS model that's in the middle of the V6 base and V8 Z28.
And when it comes to the Mustang Cobra, if the next Camaro SS doesn't get a horsepower/torque rating above and beyond I think it would be an insult. A nice limited engine option here would be a welcome addition, too. People buy Corvettes because they're Corvettes. They don't want Camaros because they're Camaros.
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