I wouldn't disagree, but I still fail to see your point. Throw some arbitrary profit limit on my business - I don't care what business it is - and watch how hard it is for me to recover after a period of downturn for whatever I produce. Yes, there have been downturns in the oil market as well, believe it or not.

The simple fact of the matter is what you're talking about is a form of Socialism. Setting an arbitrary profit "cap" on any company leads to all kinds of dangerous notions as well. For example, exactly how motivated am I to keep pumping crude out of the ground above and beyond my $1B/year profit limit? Not very. And ya thought gas prices were bad now....

 

ProudPony

Where's Rothschilds from that famous list you provided? They have enough wealth to wipe out America's national debt alone (from what I've read). And yes, Rothschilds was into oil as well.

As you say, the wealth is well hidden and/or distributed among the 'family' and their countries of residency (wherever that happens to be at the actual time ).

 

My basic point is this... oil companies/industry are doing it 'easy'. Name another industry that is doing it as easy? There isn't one.

I dare say the oil companies take a lot of heat on behalf of feds all over the world. As ProudPony pointed out to the plain naive out there (I'm one of them) the governments have a vested interest in oil. So, too, the banks/financial entities. Is there any other powerful entity that doesn't have a vested interest in oil?

When you look at things this way, oil is easy money to those that deal in it... but not so for others. Does that sound like an ideal world to you? It plainly doesn't to me. It's a 'monopoly' that's being exploited by the powerful to protect the status quo.

 

It's "easy" only as they are using the exact same techniques and pumping the same volume (or roughly the same) while turning a bigger profit because the stuff they provide has risen in value. They do however face obstacles that most any other global company does not -- political turmoil for example (BP just shut down two pipelines in Georgia due to the Russian-Georgian conflict, though this is not expected to raise the price of crude)....

I don't mean to sound so "pro-big oil", I am simply defending them as I would any other business. A business that is publicly-traded mind you -- it's too bad we all didn't have the foresight to buy up EM stock in the 90's when it wasn't so hot, eh?

 

Poor BP.

Oil is also the primary reason for war and political instabilty, too. Can't have a war if it's not about oil...

Well let me explain... the war in Georgia has possibly something to do with that oil pipeline that the Russians don't want the Western World (namely the US) to have 'access' to. Wouldn't you know it, the US has condemned the Russians actions...

The pot calling the kettle black, it seems!

You don't need me to provide you with links... you are far too clever and are able to dig the information for yourself.

One thing the Russians haven't done in comparison to the Americans in Iraq is oust the Georgian leader... but it is bound to happen as the Russians are demanding it in order to end the war.

 

Not exactly, though the misguided comparisons were bound to be made at some point.

I hardly feel like re-hashing the bipartisan reasons given as to why we went into Iraq, so let me just conclude by saying I believe we agree to disagree about what "needs" to be done (if anything) about oil profits.

 

You are correct. The Rothschilds are probably the richest family on earth. The problem is that their family is/was intentionally spread out all over the world - a plan of the patriarch Mayer Amschel Rothschild (1744-1812).
"The family's rise to international prominence began with Mayer Amschel Rothschild (1744–1812). Born in the ghetto (called "Judengasse" or Jew Alley) of Frankfurt-am-Main, he developed a finance house and spread his empire by installing each of his five sons in European cities to conduct business. An essential part of Mayer Rothschild's strategy for future success was to keep control of their businesses in family hands, allowing them to maintain full discretion about the size of their wealth and their business achievements. Mayer Rothschild successfully kept the fortune in the family with carefully arranged marriages between closely related family members."
A simple link to get you started... Rothschild family

Some families maintain such exclusivity that their records are not available.
I previously listed the top ten that are KNOWN to exist and were/have been validated by multiple sources. I specifically did not open the can of worms regarding Rothschild, because it is so hard to "prove" their wealth... the others have been validated. The Rothschilds have a lid on it... a good one too.
""It would be insufficient to sum up the (Rothschild) family as still very wealthy. ..(their fortunes are as) ineffable as always....today the family grooms the inaudibility and invisibility of its presence as a result, some believe that little is left apart from a great legend -- and the Rothschilds are quite content to let legend be their public relations." (The Rothschilds, Frederick Morton, 1962)"

I challenge anyone on this board to research the Rothschild family (which is VERY broad) and try to assess their total net worth today. These families do NOT want this information to get out - it puts a price on their heads for kidnapping, extortion, bridery, blackmail, etc and even simple jealousy/hatred of wealth... think about it.

The best I have saved in my favorites list only shows one creditable accounting for the family which dates back to 1847. It goes as follows...
Morton (1962) noted that the Rothschild wealth was estimated at over $6 billion US in 1850. Not a significant amount in today's dollars; however, consider the potential future value compounded over 147 years!
Taking $6 billion (and assuming no erosion of the wealth base) and compounding that figure at various returns on investment (a conservative range of 4% to 8%) would suggest the following net worth of the Rothschild family enterprise:
$1.9 trillion US (@ 4%)
$7.8 trillion US (@ 5%)
$31.5 trillion US (@ 6%)
$125,189.1 trillion US (@ 7%)
$491,409.0 trillion US (@ 8%)

To rattle the cage of any naysayers that might still be reading this...
In his book, Fritz Springmeier writes:
“According to one source ‘it was estimated that they controlled half the wealth of the world’. At one point, the Federal Reserve Bank of New York was controlled by five banks which owned 53% of its stock. These five banks were controlled by Nathan M. Rothschild & Sons of London. Control over the U.S. ‘Fed’ is basically control over the world’s money. That fact alone shows how immense the Rothschilds’ power is.
“If one examines who has been appointed to head the Fed, and to run it, the connections of the ‘Federal’ Reserve System to the Rothschilds can further be seen.” For example, “former Paul A. Volker went to work for the Rothschilds as chairman of the European investment banking firm, J. Rothschild, Wolfensohn and Co. in March 1992.”

Mind-boggling wealth and power.
There are several sites that link the Rothschild family to control over the media via ownership of networks and broadcasting companies (they controlled all 3 major US networks through stock ownership), radio, and newspaper (printed media). The internet is proving to be a harder entity to control (by any government or power-group) because it is so spontaneous, fast, and vast.
Maybe this (the internet and message/chat forums) will ultimately become the undoing of some historically corrupt policies. One can only hope... and try.

 

But this is where YOU (with all the respect I have) are "missing the point".

This IS NOT just "any other business". This is a business that controls the entire economy of not just our own country, but in fact the entire world.
There are only a few players in this game, and they are all long-time (over 100-years) players at that. They have eliminated upstart competition through aquisitions and takeovers. They control the governmental policies that allow them to exist through money and placement of staff. They buy policy.
And last but not least, the oil companies are owned/run by the very same powerful people that own/run the banks that rule the world, and also own/run the governments of the world.

Our only salvation - as Americans - is that our government is supposed to be run by the people via a voting process. Thanks be to god for the foresight of our founding fathers who were trying to run from control and oppression like this and had the foresight to establish a government that gave us that power to vote. We can/should at least take back the governmental side of things and try to bring some sanity to the control that oil has been given. IMO, it's our only hope.

Certainly you can agree that you nor I can start our own oil company today. Now if we choose to open a company to make doorstops - we're all good to go. Shoes - ditto. We could even start making cars like Saleen or Roush, though we might need venture capitalists. But try to open a power generation company or an oil production comapny by yourself today - AIN'T gonna happen.

You ask of me to view oil as "just another business" and allow them to operate under that premise. I am asking you to stop viewing oil as "just another business" because it simply IS NOT.

With Respectful Sincerity,
PP

One last thing... "publicly traded"?!?! Does the word "camouflage" mean anything to us?
Do you know who FOUNDED what is the modern-day ExxonMobil company?
How much of the company is actually held by a few private investors or investment groups? And guess who owns the investment groups?
You should reconsider your position on defending a business because it is "publicly traded", lest we have to go into researching the inside trades of said company.
There are still sand fleas on our beach when we humans are there too.

 

If you are refering to my posts, I can assure you that anything I put between quotations and italicise in blue are quotes copied from another source. Some have trhe reference in the text (if you will read it). And if ultimately challenged, I will put the links in the post. I'm definitely not making this crap up.

But to be very honest, you are 100% capable of doing a search on Google or Yahoo and looking up anything you question on your own. My purpose for even giving this thread as much effort as I have is to GET YOU GUYS TO THINK ON YOUR OWN. I am not trying to brainwash anyone, or sell my POV. I want to bring a few facts to the table that are typically not known, and spur some kind of interest in you to go after it yourself... read what you can find, and draw your own conclusion. If you have a paradigm shift because of this - great - either way. Just don't sit like a frog on a log and absorb whatever the next guy throws at you as gospel.

An easily-persuaded mind is not really a mind, but a memory.

PLEASE... Try looking it up for yourself, and if you can't find what you are questioning, let me know. I will attach links.

 

It's a good thing we are bound by the same love here... otherwise every forum would turn into a boring political debate. What this discussion invariably touches on is our ability to keep our passion alive! That's the crux of the issue. And the actions of the powers that be are quite divisive in that regard. You only have to have a look at any company and look at the divisions that exist between white collar and blue collar workers. Why is it that the blue collar worker is always made to look like the scapegoat for a company's poor performance (e.g. UAW)? Is that because it tends to take the focus away from the real problem area? Food for thought, maybe...

Sorry to digress but it's great to have a level headed discussion with people far more knowledgeable than myself.

 

And if you want to know how virtually every war involving the US is started, you could find the source here. It's not the US that is going to war with other nations, it's its citizens. Think about that (people)... those citizens are fighting for the cause of somebody extremely powerful!

I commend you ProudPony on your ability to research material that is not usually discussed publicly. Why is that, I wonder? Oh yes, the media, that powerful entity also owns the media!!!

 

Oh no, say it ain't so!

It looks like most of the people on this board are as stupid as the media. I had higher hopes for ya'll.

XOM made 7% profit. Let me say it again 7% profit.

We should all be saying, "damn, thats pretty bad, no wonder they missed earnings."

Obviously, most of you are not investors. The dollar amount is irrelevant!!!!

7% profit!!!!!!!! Thats not even good!!!!!!!

 

YUP! But we're glad you are here anyways! We take all kinds here!


Seriously... you have no idea what you are talking about.

If you feel that strongly about "7%" being so terrible, go beat up on the banks and lending institutions that want ME to accept 2.5-3.5% for my $100,000 cash for 12 months. Go tell THEM "damn, thats pretty bad, no wonder I missed my earnings."
Meanwhile, they want me to pay them 18.99% on a $10,000 credit card advance... Yeah, right. That's fair. My money is worth 3%, but their is worth %19.

What else you got to discuss besides "percentages"?

As for your comment about "being investors", I'll put my wealth and investments up against you any day. Wanna wager?

 

You are really starting to embarrass yourself. Others here may have you on a pedestal (soapbox is probably a better word) but I am not one of them.

7% return on investment is not considered excessive in virtually any line of businesses, actually it is often mediocre to poor compared to other industries as you have unwittingly pointed out with your comparison to the banking industry. I believe that is the point he was trying to make in the first place.

What was once a somewhat reasonable discussion about corporate power and wealth has steadily devolved into rants about global conspiracies and the Bilderburgers. The fact of the matter is that this whole situation is bad medicine for all of us, but absolutely necessary in the long term. Nothing, nothing, nothing at all was going to convince Americans that they needed to start using less gasoline except one simple thing: when it hit them in the wallet. It did, and they have.

Meanwhile, oil prices are down again today and gas prices are slowly but steadily making their way back down as well. I guess the Rothschilds finally figured out that you were on to them and scaled back their timeline for world domination. And I'm not someone who "just doesn't get it", I have read most of Jim Marrs' books from cover to cover so I know exactly what you're talking about.

The problem with you is one shared with most intelligent people, unfortunately. Deep deep down, whether you admit it or not, you truly believe that no other intelligent person could possibly see things differently than you do. I have certainly had this problem myself. Any opinionated person struggles with it.

Step away from the keyboard for a bit. All is not lost. Take some solace in that the oil speculators and energy company shareholders have been getting their clocks cleaned in the market for a few weeks now. I am down several thousand myself this past month (but I'm not one to make insinuations about the size of my portfolio as a way to bolster my credibility). You seem like a decent enough fellow, very intelligent and well-read but I think this lavish praise you get from other members fires you up a little too much. Take a cue from guys like Eric Bryant who do a better job of keeping their emotions in check when making a point, and you will probably get a lot less flak from gadflys like me. But then again, that may be the way you like it. Carry on regardless.

 

damn people, buy more gas and gas guzzlers!

my stocks are dropping