"Iffy"? What the heck does that mean? Are they saying that because they have a reason to or are they just assuming because it's a GM product?

 

from that automobile.com article...
[q]Oh yeah, and the trunk houses the fuel tank (moved from under the car; too bad for you golfers). [/q]

why did they do this??

 

I hear you guys... everything I've ever heard before about GTO was how good the quality of the product was... espescially the interior... so, I don't know where they get off saying this.

In fairness, I didn't have a chance to read the whole article yet, I was pretty busy over the weekend... that was a blurb from their "High's and Low's" box...

 

Fuel tank was moved to meet U.S. regulations. I will suspend judgement on fit and finish till I actually see a production unit at the dealer. These mags drove and tested pilot vehicles that may or may not be indicative of the final product available to the general public. Could explain the contradiction from one mag to another.

 

I just read your post......

They're going to think you're on my payroll after reading that!

 

Car & Driver, August 2001 issue. Holden Commodore vs BMW 5series. Came within a whisker of winning. No mention of "iffy" quality, in fact the opposite. They also chastized GM for not bringing it here.

I still have that issue.

 

I missed a couple of days of Dale Carnegie... if you never noticed before.

You're my pal. I don't like when they shaft one of my pals.

Besides, I think they oughta hire you since you're the best qualified automotive journalist I know.


You've been through the 5th gen forum boot camp and passed with flying colors.

"My name is Gunnery Sergeant PacerX, your Senior Drill Instructor. From now on you will speak only when spoken to, and the first and last words out of your filthy sewers will be sir. I am hard, but I am fair. Because I am hard you will not like me, but the more you hate me, the more you will learn."

 

"F.M.J.", Our E6 lounge's "training" video from my Navy days

 

Seems to me Pontiac doesn't advertise enough in C&D to make them happy so they give the GTO an OK review. They do advertsie in MT so the review is better. Each magazine is bought. Notice all the advertising done my BMW, Porsche, Audi, and M-B and they get all the good press. Jaguar doens't enough so they always finish in 2nd or third in the rankings. Silverado and F150's are praised because they are advertised heavily. Heck even the Camaro used to be in MT and guess what they said it was a great car.... I have to agree!

MT and C&D never met a car they didn't like! And if you advertise in their magazine they will tell people about it. If not they won't!

Let me peer into my crystal ball..... MT 2004 Truck of the year.... F150. Car of the Year... hmm this is hard I'll say Chevy Malibu.... They had a bid advertisement in the last issue.

 

you're smoking crack. C&D is possibly the most respectible car mag on the planet. they're biased toward good vehicles, can you blame them?

MT on the other hand is a joke.

 

C&D is probably my favorite car magazine. I've been reading it forever. They are very tough critics...but I also find them to be fair. They are tough on everyone. Yes, even BMW and MB.

When everyone had long abandoned the 4th gen, they were one of the few still praising it's performance. WHY? Because, even with it's shortcommings, the 4th gen F-car could still lay down the numbers.

Even if you don't agree with everything that they have to say....their comments are interesting and thought provoking. That's alot more than I can say about other mags. Some other mags have road tests and reports that are so tepid that they sound like a manuafacturers' brochure. BORING!!!!!!!!!!!

As far as calling the GTO's build quality "iffy"..a couple of parts fell off for cripes sake ....you don't think that they would just let that go....do you?

 

He are some quotes from the 2 magazines on there test of the GTO

MT: "Fit and finish are the finest we've seen on a GM vechicle in decades. The body emits not a squeak and shimmies not a whit, parts gaps are tight and uniform."

MT: Comparing to the Cobra "The aging Cobra is quick, sure, but driving it means putting up with its clunky personality and a suspension that clomps over the road as if it's wearing horseshoes. The GTO in stark contrast is all finesse and gracefulness."

MT: The mighty Corvette engine is deliciously smooth and flexible and the six-speed shifter moves as if cradled in a vat of precision goo. For sheer drivetrain refinement, the GTO easily matches Europe's best sporting coupes."

C&D: "The best GM seats in any GM product ever"

C&D: The corn-stalk shifter provides the leverage to easily shove the heavy forks around the Tremec T-56 six-speed. The detents are mushy and the gates are somewhat sloppy."

C&D: "After decades of festooning their vehicles with grotesque fiberglass stick-ons, they have created a GTO cunningly diguised as a phone-company fleet car. When I first spotted our dishwater dull, battleship-gray GTO I thought perhaps a Navy recruiter had stopped by."

C&D: " The new GTO's styling is a snooze"

 

I can remember two C&D reviews - one where they absolutely trashed an ION and another similar one about the Toyota Echo subtitled "Something new from Toyota - A Mistake."

They also ranked a Mustang Mach1 over an S2000 at one point. The C5 Corvette has also been a consistent 10 best winner.

 

You put down the crack pipe and listen to what your saying. C&D is great and MT is a joke.... Are you flippin serious all the major mags are just about the same. You honestly beleive there is a difference in the mags philosophy or something. Its guys like us who work at all the mags. Your reading C&D's opinions about one car so I guess you agree with them.... so that makes C&D great right??
And you must not agree with MT so that makes them a joke right??
-boy they've got the wool pulled over your eyes!

They are in this to sell magazines and make money and nothing else. If you advertise in their mag and you help them make money they will write a good review for you. They are not going to turn on cars that are advertsied in their mag. Sure they have favorites but they won't turn on vehicles advertised. I work in a marketing group and we deal with magazines for our products and they will tell you almost up front that for us advertsing in their mag they will write the best review they can for our products. And in turn we let them know that any bad press from them and we'll take our business elseware.

Magazine sales from newstands or subsripions don't make money for mags they will just about break even in that area. Advertisements are what makes the profit. They won't turn on that.

If you belive any different then you don't know how this works. They are free to write any kind of review they want but if its good they may get more advertising or some first time advertising because of the review, and if its bad the company will pull its advertising.

 

...but isn't the size of the subscriber base what determines the amount of money a magazine can get for an ad?