Holden has a long history of being independent since it did in fact start it's car making history as a body assembly business in Australia (for Ford, ironically). GM began it's close association with Holden after WW2, as Holden assembled various General Motors cars for the Australian market.

Holden's first exclusive car was a discared Chevrolet design that's now refered to as the FX. In the 50's, General Motors heavily invested in Holden's production expansion.

In the 1960s, Holden came into it's own. a car they were producing under the GM-Europe Vauxhall name became the Torana. Chevrolet & Pontiac production was replaced by models under the Holden name (Holden models from the late 60s & early 70s look exactly like they came from Pontiac or Chevy showrooms).

Holden produced it's first independent V8 in 1969 (a 4.2 & 5 liter...253 & 308 ci respectively). In 1970, they started making their own automatic transmissions and every model was an Australian design for the 1st time. In the 70s, Holden got fully into auto racing. In the late 70s, just like here in the US, Holden downsized their cars, switching their large cars from US based chassis to Opel based.

In the 80s, Ford Australia came close to wiping Holden from the map, as Holden had to make deals with Toyota and even Nissan (which supplied turbocharged 6 cylinder engines for a time) to survive. Holden even sold rebadged Suzukis for a while to round out their line, in many cases selling rebadged cars under their name that competitors were also selling under theirs.

In the 90s, Holden did a complete turn around, increasing Australian market share 50% in that decade and creating a very strong export business. Over half billion AUD were spent to upgrade local vehicle programs. Locally produced cars were condensed to Elizabeth City. Vehicles from GM Europe replaced vehicles sourced from Japanese competitors. Modified (for RWD use) Buick's 3.8 V6 were assembled in Australia.

This decade has been mixed for Holden. Holden has lost alot of atonomy to General Motors North America, market share dropped from 28 to just 15% at home now being outsold by Toyota, and Holden has recorded losses though admittedly a fraction next to what we're used to hearing from the big 3 here (a mere $6 million in 2007), primarily from the jump in the Aussie dollar, the billion used to create the VE & WM, and to a small extent, GM-NA cancelling a large majority of usage of the Holden created Zeta platform in North America.

Holden has developed an ability to manage itself in difficult times, has successfully turn itself around, has history and experience as an independent automaker, knows how to export successfully, & seems to have the product focus that's lacking with GM North America and it's large scale product over.

Holden was seriously looking at establishing a network here in the US nearly 10 years ago. If Holden were to take over Pontiac, it would have a dealer network already established with annual sales at over 200,000 annually to start off with as well as a couple of products with it's foot already in the door. On the flip side, the G6 can see a slight bump in sales via exports to the rest of Holden's markets.

Holden is also moving forward with a small 4 cylinder sedan to be made in Australia that would fit where a G5 sedan would fit in, while they would gain the Solstice for sale down under (the Vauxhall/Opel GT both are RHD, so a Sky interior on Aussie Solstices would be a no cost way to economically send a car that will sell in minute numbers).

Holden is too close to Chevrolet in market and demographics to survive any division closures at GM. Yet, Pontiac is still big enough to be GM GM's 2nd largest car division and would be a very strong independent brand.

Holden wouldn't need to buy Pontiac. GM should simply give it to Holden, save the cost of development of any new pending Pontiac vehicles, and cut any losses.

Under a new name, Holden might even be able to weed out under performing dealers.

 

I would be ALL in for that! I always wanted Holden to sell cars in the US anyway... I've always been a closet Holden fan and only because we really never had a chance to own any of there units here until the last 6-8 years. This is a big part of why I purchased my G8 GT.

I think Pontiac as an american Holden would be a big win!

 

GM can't afford to have an independent Holden. There would be too much duplication of effort.

 

No duplication.

Holden would return to it's quasi-independent subsidary at GM.

 

I think this would work well with a lineup where Buick turns into Opel and Saab and Saturn are axed.

 

G8's, G8 ST's (Elcamino's), an updated G6 and a Solstice thrown in and I'd say you have one heck of a division! A division that I'd be happy to spend my dollars at!

Man, and if I had my dream come true... maybe they could grant me a Pontiac G8 version of the Coupe 60! (Personally, I'd purchase the coupe 60 over the new Camaro! and I'm a Camaro Junkie!!!)

 

I would have no need for other GM brands if this happened.

Fullsize trucks excepted.

 

I like the way this sounds! This may be a way for Pontiac to rise up and become a player in the near luxury/import performance arena. Having owned an M3, an S4, various other Euro rides, I would welcome this whole-heartedly and I could see this working well for them. It would move Pontiac up a rung in the eyes of the rest of the world.

 

Your thoughts have been at Holden taking over Pontiac for some time now in some form or another. I will admit months ago the idea still didnt seem solid to me, but I fully agree now.

I wonder though - if you leave Pontiac to simply rebadge Holdens and call it a day - as a 'Holden brand' - could Holden decide what products to put into the showrooms without consent from GMNA? Would GM let them be independant enough to do as they wish? I think that would be the biggest problem the new Pontiac would face. Let the Aussies decide what our market will accept and how many cars to sell, away from the GMNA red tape.

...Until GMNA mgmt gets annoyed that the new pontiac is doing well and stealing sales from chevrolet/cadillac and comes in and takes pontiac back.

 

Agreed 100%

 

Most of Holden's lineup is Daewoos which are sold as Chevys in other countries.

However anything which would take Pontiac marketing away from the Detroit braintrust is a good idea.

 

Key point.

 

If they were "independent" of GM, then would they be subject to CAFE independently? In other words, with no Volt or hybrid vehicles to offset their offerings, I'm not sure it would be possible to meet near-future mileage requirements with the vehicles mentioned here. Don't get me wrong, I think it would be pretty cool; just playing devils advocate...

 

Barina & Viva are Daewoo.

Astra, Epica, & Captiva are Opel/Vauxhall.

Colorado is from the good old US.

Commodore, Statesman, Caprice, & Ute are all Aussie cars.

For Middle East Chevys, add Corvette, the upcoming Camaro, and North America's truck lineup.

 

Being quasi-independent would be a duplication of effort: Management, product development, emissions certification, safety certification, materials specifications, etc., etc.

I hate to say this, but I think Ford's present strategy is the right way to go. You have ONE company. That way, you can share resources throughout the globe. Your products are consistent and are of the same quality, built to the same standards, and are easily interchangeable from country to country, plant to plant.