CTS-V no longer available with stick?!?!
05-17-2009, 04:55 AM
#2
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Join Date: Mar 2001
Location: The Golden State
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I'm not surprized if true. The Thunderbird SC sold in a huge number as manuals in 1989, but by the the last year of 1996, manuals could be measure in hundreds instead of thousands. SHOs also lostr their manuals due to lack of intrest after the initial rush. I'd love to see the CTSv manual numbers as a percentage of sales.... it would likely be depressing.
Truth is that luxury sports sedans here in the US are overwhelmingly automatics, even when manuals are available.
Truth is that luxury sports sedans here in the US are overwhelmingly automatics, even when manuals are available.
05-17-2009, 08:17 AM
#5
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Location: Shelbyville, IN
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You know, before I stalled my auto in my Camaro I used to ride the Manual Train.
But now after realizing the performance that an automatic can provide, along with the driveability... I see no reason to own a manual unless you were going to make a SCCA Autocross car (or any other track/twistie type racing).
And as time progresses I bet we'll see that tap-shift autos on those circuits as well...
Just because it doesn't have a clutch doesn't mean it can be made to perform. In fact, if they can get the tap shift to work with almost no delay; I see no reason to even have a manual...
But now after realizing the performance that an automatic can provide, along with the driveability... I see no reason to own a manual unless you were going to make a SCCA Autocross car (or any other track/twistie type racing).
And as time progresses I bet we'll see that tap-shift autos on those circuits as well...
Just because it doesn't have a clutch doesn't mean it can be made to perform. In fact, if they can get the tap shift to work with almost no delay; I see no reason to even have a manual...
Last edited by Chrome383Z; 05-17-2009 at 08:20 AM.
05-17-2009, 09:10 AM
#6
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Location: Indianapolis, IN
Posts: 3,650
The auto has multiple clutches, not just one. 
But it is a deeper level of driver / machine involvement that attracts us manual addicts. However, I have to admit that after driving my brother's Z28 coupe and my buddy's SS droptop, both with automatics, I can see the appeal for some people. Mainly in the launch. Only having 4 gears sucks, and the lack of total control over WHEN the shift happens sucks too.
The new autos have fixed the 4 gears problem, and the tap shift gives much more control over shift timing when you want it (though they never seem to respond quite as quickly as I'd like, in any brand of car I've tried it in).
For a car like the CTS-V, though, I admit that I'd have to at least give the auto a try before buying. As a side bonus, it is the quicker of the two. But I know that I'd kick myself now and then for opting for the auto if I bought one.
Even in a new Camaro, I could see the appeal. But I'm pretty sure I'd go manual in that car if it were an SS for me. If the wife wanted to check out a V6 LS, I'd have no problem with her getting a 6A. Well, maybe a little problem, but not much...
But it is a deeper level of driver / machine involvement that attracts us manual addicts. However, I have to admit that after driving my brother's Z28 coupe and my buddy's SS droptop, both with automatics, I can see the appeal for some people. Mainly in the launch. Only having 4 gears sucks, and the lack of total control over WHEN the shift happens sucks too.
The new autos have fixed the 4 gears problem, and the tap shift gives much more control over shift timing when you want it (though they never seem to respond quite as quickly as I'd like, in any brand of car I've tried it in).
For a car like the CTS-V, though, I admit that I'd have to at least give the auto a try before buying. As a side bonus, it is the quicker of the two. But I know that I'd kick myself now and then for opting for the auto if I bought one.
Even in a new Camaro, I could see the appeal. But I'm pretty sure I'd go manual in that car if it were an SS for me. If the wife wanted to check out a V6 LS, I'd have no problem with her getting a 6A. Well, maybe a little problem, but not much...
05-17-2009, 09:46 AM
#8
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Location: City of Champions, MA, USA
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Sticks don't sell. Thats just the way it is. I feel like a standard is more reliable than an auto. The auto scares me, with the stick at least I'll feel the syncros wearing outor the clutch slipping. Every auto I have ever had go on me just made a loud bang and then no reverse and nothing beyond 2nd gear and it stuggled to get there.
05-17-2009, 09:46 AM
#9
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Location: South Jersey
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I'll make no argument that automatics aren't usually faster or more advanced. However, there is a level of driver involvement that is absent in the case of the automatic.
In one case, I feel like I'm driving. In the other, I feel like I'm being driven.
Someday, they may come out with a car that has automatic steering, and can go around a racetrack faster than a human. I'll still prefer to steer myself.
In one case, I feel like I'm driving. In the other, I feel like I'm being driven.
Someday, they may come out with a car that has automatic steering, and can go around a racetrack faster than a human. I'll still prefer to steer myself.
05-17-2009, 10:26 AM
#10
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Join Date: Jan 2004
Posts: 929
I'll make no argument that automatics aren't usually faster or more advanced. However, there is a level of driver involvement that is absent in the case of the automatic.
In one case, I feel like I'm driving. In the other, I feel like I'm being driven.
Someday, they may come out with a car that has automatic steering, and can go around a racetrack faster than a human. I'll still prefer to steer myself.
In one case, I feel like I'm driving. In the other, I feel like I'm being driven.
Someday, they may come out with a car that has automatic steering, and can go around a racetrack faster than a human. I'll still prefer to steer myself.
Automatics are for the lazy and uninterested.
Yet another big thumbs down for GM.
05-17-2009, 11:04 AM
#12
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I was taking your word for it at first but I just took a look for myself. Maybe its an error in the build your own options. Its still listed in the specs. The manual is also not available when building a 3.6 CTS.
05-17-2009, 12:52 PM
#13
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Location: U.S.A.
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The reason there are so few standard transmission cars in today's world is that the majority (by a big margin) of people don't want them.
Automatics have not only mostly caught up with standard transmissions in performance they exceed the performance of standards in many applications.
Standard transmissions can be fun and they have their benefits but except for very small minority of enthusiasts, they just don't sell or even make sense for a manufacturer to produce.
I like the CTS-V a lot and if were shopping for a new daily driver it would be on my very short list but I doubt I'd buy a standard shift and doubt very many others who can afford the CTS-V would either.
Automatics have not only mostly caught up with standard transmissions in performance they exceed the performance of standards in many applications.
Standard transmissions can be fun and they have their benefits but except for very small minority of enthusiasts, they just don't sell or even make sense for a manufacturer to produce.
I like the CTS-V a lot and if were shopping for a new daily driver it would be on my very short list but I doubt I'd buy a standard shift and doubt very many others who can afford the CTS-V would either.
05-17-2009, 01:00 PM
#14
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I see what you're saying, but last month on "build your own" they had a 6 speed manual choice.
05-17-2009, 02:32 PM
#15
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GM updated several sections of their sites including the build your own sections. Unfortunately we all know they always make mistakes. The Camaro no longer displays stripe packages on the preview car when you select them. I remember earlier this year you were able to build a V8 Colorado with a manual trans. If only that were true.
This shows that for 2010 the manual is available. This documentation should also be more trustworthy. (Though they don't have the 3.6 listed in the left column)
http://eogld.ecomm.gm.com/NASApp/dom...16&addOptions=
I didn't realize the LF1 3.0 V6 was going in the CTS.
This shows that for 2010 the manual is available. This documentation should also be more trustworthy. (Though they don't have the 3.6 listed in the left column)
http://eogld.ecomm.gm.com/NASApp/dom...16&addOptions=
I didn't realize the LF1 3.0 V6 was going in the CTS.