dambippy!
Let's go ahead and avoid the crisis by being proactive - develop the alternative fuels NOW, don't wait until there's a crisis, economic peril, and riots in the streets. If the new fuels are also cleaner, more efficient, and replenishable - ALL THE BETTER.

 

I think it should have.

I am the first to admit that when my father-in-law bought a 250 Superduty in 1987 for job work, I was more than skeptical. It had the 6.9 diesel and he was going to pull Bobcats and Backhoes with it to construction sites. It only took a couple rides and I was made to believe. Mileage was decent - mid to low teens - while strong as an ox. And his wasn't turbo'ed either. I still didn't like the rattle and the obnoxiously loud clatter it made, but it worked.

Likewise, I despised the early diesel cars. It seemed like every Mercedes diesel I got behind fogged me. There were some obnoxious American versions too - I beleive Buick had some diesels in their large cars in the '80s, no? Short story - I hated them all. I even saw an '88 Ranger 4x4 that was diesel powered up in the mountains of NC - wierd. It was imported by a service man. Hated it.

Then I finally needed a truck to pull cars, horses, tractors, and the like. I wanted more than the 1/2 ton or 3/4 ton trucks offered. I wavered between the gas 460ci and the Powerstroke diesel. Under pressure from fellow horse owners and car pullers, I got the diesel. Well, now I can't ever see me being without one.
Diesels are AMAZING these days. Powerful, efficient, and the newer ones are getting even quieter - Ford's and GM's anyways. (I think Dodge LIKES the loud pinging rattle of the Cummins?!?! ) Mine has yet not to start quickly even in cold weather, does not smoke you to death, and has been trouble free for 108K miles.

Now they are not rocket ships by any means, but there are companies offering aftermarket goodies for diesels now that are awesome. Propane does for diesels what NOx does for gas cars, and there are Propane kits for about any diesel out there. Turbos are computer-controllable so you can program exactly when and where you want your boost curves to be via wastegate management. I've seen some crazy-fast 1-ton trucks running the 1/4 mile in 17 secs and less - duallies too!

If the American car makers would offer the same kind of technology and aftermarket support for car-based diesels as they are getting for the HD trucks, I'd seriously consider one for daily commuting. The mileage alone would about sell me on it.

I'd LOVE to see the Explorer/TB/Durango all offer a medium sized diesel in V6 or I4 configuration. Talk about towing capacity? The weight of the vehicle would then be the limiting factor. 30-35mpg average would be VERY attainable, and with proper turbo application they would be very peppy to boot. My current 19mpg-getting 4.0L Eddie Bauer Explorer would be traded in in a heartbeat.

 

A few random ramblings...

I don't know about the global warming. But on the oil, while I'm no expert, if you can even come close to fathoming the amount of gas being used every day, it's difficult to think that we can't run out.

And if we don't run out, it'll be more and more expensive to drill in newer, harder to get to, locations. End result is that the price will climb eventually.

Even so, if there was indeed a crisis, everything would get thrown into overdrive for a solution. You'd see tons of money going into a new infrastructures and technologies then!

 

A group of guys riding to work together is one thing, but to have the government have any mandate for it is wrong.

 

Wow, what a wild thread. These are my parting shots:

Like Joe K 96 Zee! said, just becuase we might not run out doesn't mean it won't be harder to get and thus more expensive. Pus, the current problem (as I've heard on the news) isn't supply from the ground as much as it is refinery limits.

I'm not whole heartedly behind taxing anything, but if you can afford the truck's bloated price and lousy milage, then I think you can foot a 'vanity tax'. I'd much rather see the whole tax system revamped (get thesse so called 'off shore companies' to ante-up what they owe). If that would ever happen, I think we'd all benefit from it.

I strongly believe the system should regulate it self through supply nd demand changes, but sometimes I also think sometimes we need to be saved from ourselves.

Like proud pony siad, why not be proactive and avoid the crisis? The problem with old rich white men is they're too reactionary. They won't change unless the barbarians are at the gate. I asked this in grad school and I'm still surprised that the world's strongest and most innovative economic engine can't make sustainabitlity work in a capitalist market.

And finally, forget the extreme right and left, point your common sense towards the middle and I think people generally tend to do what's correct.

Good night.....

 

--How the hell does anyone know exactly how much oil is in the ground? The concept that someone can actually figure this out is ridiculous. Even if you are correct that there's not that much here, that is no reason not to go get it or work to discover new deposits.

--What about the rise in respiratory ailments, and why are you linking them to cars? Cars, trucks, and the internal combustion engine where not just invented 10-15 years ago. Besides, this smells of another statistic that has been twisted to scare people into accepting even more regulations. As for L.A.'s skyline, has it ever occured to you that part of the reason for smog hanging in the air in L.A. may be geography? Has if ever occured to anyone here that if you had a large urban area located in a valley or low area that you may not get the wind action necessary to constantly clear the air? I would also wager that the air over L.A. has been clearing up over a longer period than just the past 10-15 years since emissions controls have been around longer than that. I guess my biggest beef with the whole emissions argument is the CO2 part of it.

--Yeah, that's right. Another tax on people excercising their free will. God forbid that someone purchase the vehicle they want and not purchase the vehicle that the holier-than-thou enviromentals want.

--Ahhh, I can partially agree with you here. I hate tying "using less oil" to "making us less dependant on foreign oil" because to me it does not matter how much of it you use, as long as you need it you are dependant upon it. But it would be nice if oil-burning homes could be switched over to natural gas and if we could switch all our electrical production from burning fossil fuels to things like natural gas, hydro-electric, or nuclear power, that would help things out, too.

 

Actually my wife works in medical research at Vanderbilt University on the regulatory side, maybe I can explain it to you. As one of the largest research hospital/universities in the country in terms of research dollars spent, at least 50% of the research going on there is funded by private sector compaines such as drug companies.

Government rarely develops applied technology, government funded research usually discovers things but it is up to the private companies to find out how to use the knowledge to make money.

I think you missed my point about itemizing your taxes. What I am saying is, if you think taxes are too low and we all should pay more, why itemize? If you took the standard deduction the government would keep more of it, and if you think taxes should be higher that would be the only consistent thing to do. Likewise with mailing you refund check back and asking them to keep it.

I'll let this die now, maybe Charlie can rescue the post. Sorry Charlie (starkist tuna reference unintentional)

 

I don't know why you'd hate hate using less with less dependence. They are intrically and directly related. Use more need more pay more. This is why I floated the tax credit idea. My Z gets 20mpg ave. as compared to Mr. Jones' Tahoe that gets 11-12, and Mr.Smith's Impala that gets 23 or so. Mr. Smtih gets a bigger credit than me who gets a credit while Mr. Jones doesn't. I know this is a huge blanket solution (and I really can't type long enuff gor the arguements), but it could be the start of a solution.

 

Hey...you know what we haven't talked about here...GASAHOL.

Here in the Midwest....ALL of our gas now has 10% ethanol.

It is touted as an all-American renewable fuel resource. BULLSH!T!!! Frankly, I believe that this is one of the biggest scams and rip-offs ever foisted on the American people!

I read somewhere once, that it takes more than one gallon of fossil fuel to created one gallon of ethanol. Also, using it it, will decrease your fuel mileage by about 5-10%...requiring you to use more fossil fuel. And there are also the issues of ethanol damage to your fuel system.

Ethanol fuel is nothing more than a farm subsidy. Let's just be honest and call it that! It makes us more dependant on foreign oil....not less!!!!!!!!!

 

I had heard the same thing. Does E85 fall into that? Really all the current renewable fuels have that same curse, it might be more readily available but processing it costs alot more at the moment. But things do seem to be progreesing tho.

Isn't it funny how all the country's problems seem to point right back at one particular city, or district?

 

I don't need to be saved from myself and I sure in hell don't need the government or anybody else trying to save me from myself.

As for the idea of taxing to save the environment.....this is absolutely assinine. This ranks right up there with taxing cigarettes to encourage people not to smoke. If the government cared that much for people's health, then outlaw cigarettes. And if you truly think burning gasoline is ruining the environment then be genuine and demand the outlaw of petroleum-based fuels. And then outlaw the internal combustion engine. Make a law that only allows for the sale of "low-emissions" vehicles.

 

Prozac!

 

Dude...go take a breather...

 

Isn't Ethanol made from corn,or is that "Methenol", not from fossil fuel??
Ofcourse there are additives to keep it from being consumed etc...And doesn't Alcohol, when introduced to the fuel system, make it more Octane tollerant. The Turbo Regal guys sell alcohol injection systems to allow them to run more boost w/o pinging..I personally ran it from a "StarFire" station near Troy, Ohio...and it seemed to make my car run smoother with a little more "pick-up"...Also alcohol dries water in the fuel system, seemingly that would keep it from damage?? My experience was ONLY with my EFI cars, I ran regular + Lead alternative additive on my older cars...

And if we allow "responsible" exploration and drilling of Alaska's HUGE wildlife reserves, there's Billions of barrels to be had...BUT companies MUST be forced to reduce damage to areas drilled as much as possible and NOT just pay fines...Our Govt seemed Hell-Bent on bankrupting and owning the Alaskan pipeline under the guise of defending the Environment, a little research into the pipelines consrtuction will show you the REDICULOUS standards imposed even on the workers TOILETS, costs like $50,000 each! And many times made them tear out huge sections for bad welds, when the companies had proven by "X-Rays" that they were perfect! They continued fining them and making them to do BOGUS repairs until it costs MANY times what it should've.....
Plus, we get most of our oil from Exxon's wells ALL OVER THE PLANET, not just the Middle East companies. We seem to want to be dependant on foreign oil, saving ours for war or after others are depleted or nearly depleted...hence we call them our "Oil Reserves"..

 

I'll agree with you on that one. But it's a lot easier said than done.


I don't know where you are getting your info, but I wouldn't hold much stock in it if I were you.

First off, there aren't $50,000 toilets. Just regular portable outhouses like most places. On several jobs I have worked on, there were insulated ones with heaters because we were working out in -40*F weather, but I'll guarantee that they are nowhere near $50K.

Secondly, If a weld passes an x-ray test, then that is the final decision on the weld. Weld inspection companies are private companies contracted by the pipline contractors. If there was even a thought that they were failing the welds without cause, then they (inspecting company) would be replaced in a heartbeat.

Just so you know, I've worked on the Prudhoe Bay oilfields in Alaska for about 4 years, and lived in Alaska for 8. I have also had first hand experience working for the big oil companies like BP, and ARCO, and I know how those companies operate and exactly what goes on there.


Back on topic, I hear Jeep Liberty will be offered in the US with a diesel engine pretty soon.