Did DCX say they are pulling the plug on the dodge and cryslet lx coupes? When did this happen?

 

The Mustang is the "exception" and not the "rule" when it comes to 2-door coupes.

 

The Mustang is not the exception, it is the guideline. Everytime I hear this it just gets me upset. There is no exception, just the example of what works. Is there anything out there that is similar to the Mustang? I think the strongest selling point is that you can get a GT for under 30k. What other coupe gives you the performance for the GT price? I think that if Chrysler made a LX car on a 110" WB and with a HEMI under 30k, the car would be a ablsolute hit, just like the Mustang. Name it the Challenger or something with a significant past name.

 

i have to agree with you there
how many stangs are sold each year, yet there is no market for 2 doors huh?

 

Outside the Ford Mustang, the coupe market is in the toilet. GM's F body was the 2nd best selling coupe structure when it died, yet Mustang outsold it by 2 to 1!! Currently, Mustang outsells all other coupes sold in the US... combined! And even about 2/3 of that other "combined" total belongs to either the Monte Carlo or Chrysler's Stratus-Sebring coupe & convertible. I'd say that makes Mustang the exception.

The only reason there are even Toyota Celicas (now Scion TCs), Mitsubishi Eclipes, Accord Coupes, and Soleras is that they are a version of existing high volume FWD sedans. The Stratus & Sebring coupes owe their entire existence to the Eclipes (it shares not only the structure, but also interior & even the whole doors!). All these cars even with the "tuner" crowd's enthusiasm (too bad very young buyer's don't buy new cars) sell at numbers guaranteed to shut down plants if built on their own structures.

I know why Trevor Creed said what he said. There is only a finite number of coupe buyers today, and every study anyone's done shows that. The coupe market is also the most unstable portion of the auto market. The moment there's an economic downturn, that's the 1st part of the market to get hit.

But what I think he missed or is ignoring is not only do eye catching coupes bring in showroom traffic, but also that the coupe market is subject to sudden sales explosions. It's happened every decade since the 60s (though to ever decreasing totals). Though the economy seems to be ready to drop (traditionally bad news for coupes), there's still alot of people that seem to be getting a little tired with SUVs and alot of people whose kids are leaving home who are likely to be ready to spend on something sporty.

Find a high volume chassis, find a way to do a coupe for pennys what it cost years ago, and ride the wave.

I suspect this is what GM is thinking.

 

Are the LX coupes dead? I was very much looking foward to the 300 coupe and the "Challenger" LX coupe from Dodge.

A shame if its been canned.

 

Honestly, I don't know.

There was a coupe developed, then sat on for a few years. Then seemingly released for 2007, now Trevor Creed is sounding like it isn't going to happen.

I left a message with Max Gates this morning, so I should be able to find out a little something (he can't actually talk about future products, but he can tell me what to make of Trevor Creed's comments) by the end of the day if he's not on vacation.

 

I'm getting the impression that the coupes......both LX and Galant based, may be dead.

A two door convertible Sebring however, will be made.

What a shame.

 

Man that guy is dumb. First of all, the Dodge Stratus and Chrysler Sebring coupes are really alme cars to begin with.

Secondly--Ford Mustang. Enough said. If Chyrsler would make a 2 door Charger....they would get alot of faithful enthusasts to buy.

 

guionM, while I respect your opinion bcuz you have more insight into the auto industry then most of us, I think you are wrong on this coupe thing.

The Mustang you say is the exception, but as far as I know it is the only coupe that has a usable back seat. Eveyone will agree that the 4th Gen Camaro's back seat sucked. It felt like you were getting into a capsule for launch. The other thing that the Mustang has that no other coupe has is the price/performance. There is no other coupe in that 20-30k price range that offers the performance of the Mustang.

You said that there was an explosion of coupe sales in the 60s, but coupes then and coupes now are totally 2 different times. Then, we had cars that had usable trunks, adults could fit in the back seats, and power that had no end. Now, we have a bunch of coupes that are over prices(M3) and underpowered(tC). What fun is driving a coupe when you can get better acceleration out of a SUV?

I think most people don't care too much about how well a car handles. Proof in point, the Mustang, until 04, had been sitting on the same suspension since '85! Even when GM redesigned the 4th Gen, they gave it a better suspension then the Mustang. The only reason that the Camaro and Firebird sold more then other coupes is bcuz of the loyalty to the brand.

Now some will ask, what about the GTO? I don't know about the backseat use in the new GTO I can tell you that it is over priced, and I know everyone agrees. If GM would put this car below/right at 30k, they would probably not have any problem selling them. It also helps if a car has a good design. Obviously GM thought there was enough of a market for coupes to bring over a GTO, they just missed the target price. Also, I think this proves that people in the US want coupes that have a V8 and RWD, what fun is having to rev a car to the moon to have driving excitement(e.i. RX8).

When it comes to coupes, you must have one that has a useable back seat, priced in that 20-30k price range, rwd, and en engine that has power to boot.

 

Wish I was wrong on this coupe thing, mastrdrver, but both Chrysler and Ford has done the research on this, and that probally means GM has as well. I'm sure if the Camaro replacement takes on alot of the positive Mustang traits (which I believe it will), it will just as likely cut into Mustang's total sales (as well as all other coupes) as bring in anyone new. It will probally **** a few Cobalt & Monte Carlo sales as well.

As for the 60s, take a look at Mustang trunks or the trunks of 1st gen Camaros. They weren't that usable. Makes the last Mustang trunk and the new GTO seem huge by comparison. Regarding 60s performance, gotta be careful not to over rate it.

As for the back seat of the 4th gen, it's actually roomier than the Mustang. The problem is that the car sat very low, the rear seat cushion was virturally on the floor, and the lack of rear side windows made it feel line you were crawling into small ground level cave.

As for 'Stang sales, most Mustangs are sold with the V6. The GT probally makes up less than 1/3 of Mustang sales. That means the Mustang V6 alone probally sells double what all other coupes sold in the US combined sell.

Remember, we are on a performance site with alot of other performance junkies. In the real world, we are just a small portion of what's actually sold in the marketplace.

 

Is an M3 really that overpriced? Its a 2+2 coupe, that nipps the heels of a similiarly priced Corvette... and its alot more luxurious, and has a backseat to boot...


I don't think the problem of the GTO was its price.. its just that people's perceptions, couldn't justify paying $32k for a Pontiac, no matter how good of a car it actually is.. and alot of people on here are still trying to compare to the F-bod niche, which its not..


If only GM didn't have that healthcare problem, they could shave an extra $1500 off on avg per vehicle..


Still, I think a the 2005 GTO with the LS2 and bigger brakes for $33k is a good deal..

 

They paid that for a live axle Trans Am with a body that dated back to 1993 and a chassis that went back to '82. To top it off, they could get the same engine in a Formula Firebird for almost $8K less, and still went for the WS6 in bigger numbers.

I'm still at a loss over that one.

 

2 Door Luxury Cars and 2 Door "Go-Fast" Cars are still A on my list.

 

You know why? Dealers stocked WS6s (90% of which appeared to be black) and were never very creative. People bought what they saw. I, on the other hand, ordered and sold TEN Formulas in 2002, one of which is in my father's garage. WS6s? 3

At $27,595 with cloth seats, chrome wheels, a Hurst shifter and no TCS or 12 discs, Formulas were a deal. I found Formulas were easier for me to sell than the $33k WS6s, despite being more popular!!!!!!!! That $5,500 equates to $110/month over 5 years...not chump change.

And yet, a paltry 901 Formulas were sold in '02 versus 13,000 WS6s. Again, people bought what they saw...a shame.