Chrysler RWD 300C to start @ $25,000 ($35,000 with HEMI)
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Joined: Jan 2000
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From: Albany, NY
Originally posted by jrp4uc
But not for $35k... maybe C5 Z06.
But not for $35k... maybe C5 Z06.
Compring the GTO to this car is a bad example too.Pricing looks good, but I wonder if the styling is going to hold it back, I like the looks of the 300M better. All the other cars it is selling against are a lot more sleaker.
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by guionM
G35's cheaper and .5 seconds quicker to 60 than than the CTS, but the CTS is generally recognized to have superior handling.
You seem to have a knack for really stating things that are false (put diplomatically). CTS is infact attracting import buyers, and is the only domestic brand doing this in sizable numbers.
To you it's not a convincing product, however you seem to be out of step with the actual market on this. Cadillac's CTS (and to a much lesser degree, the current STS) is doing well with luxury import buyers.
My figures come from the November 24, 2003 BusinessWeek article. Only about a quarter of CTS buyers are trading out of imports, and the majority of those aren't "premium import" brands. BMW isn't scared.
Oh, and yes, the G35 is a bit "tail happy" with the stability control off. It's a peculiarity that reminds me of old Beemers - long before the day of stability control.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by guionM
I won't argue with you on the LS's style, since my tastes run towards "sleepers". However, you yourself stated that LS were great handling cars when I posted my observations on the one I rented Labor Day last year. The car isn't quite a benchmark, but it still is a mighty fine car. My only issue was that it's overpriced by $8-10,000. That's all.
Seriously, the LS has a great chassis but so did the MN-12. Being "$8-10,000" overpriced is the real killer, as it would be for any car.
When it comes to Crossfires, it would seem that three is a crowd - especially since the dealer still had the first one that came in. Auto dealers aren't typically Rhodes Scholars. The same owner has a dusty brace of 2003 T-birds.
G35's cheaper and .5 seconds quicker to 60 than than the CTS, but the CTS is generally recognized to have superior handling.
You seem to have a knack for really stating things that are false (put diplomatically). CTS is infact attracting import buyers, and is the only domestic brand doing this in sizable numbers.
To you it's not a convincing product, however you seem to be out of step with the actual market on this. Cadillac's CTS (and to a much lesser degree, the current STS) is doing well with luxury import buyers.
My figures come from the November 24, 2003 BusinessWeek article. Only about a quarter of CTS buyers are trading out of imports, and the majority of those aren't "premium import" brands. BMW isn't scared.
Oh, and yes, the G35 is a bit "tail happy" with the stability control off. It's a peculiarity that reminds me of old Beemers - long before the day of stability control.
[QUOTE]Originally posted by guionM
I won't argue with you on the LS's style, since my tastes run towards "sleepers". However, you yourself stated that LS were great handling cars when I posted my observations on the one I rented Labor Day last year. The car isn't quite a benchmark, but it still is a mighty fine car. My only issue was that it's overpriced by $8-10,000. That's all.
Seriously, the LS has a great chassis but so did the MN-12. Being "$8-10,000" overpriced is the real killer, as it would be for any car.
Originally posted by guionM
The LS1 is technically a "Truck Motor" with a different displacement and camshaft. Ford's 4.6 is also a "Truck Motor". Seems you are reaching once again when there isn't something really worth complaing about. The Hemi is the worlds newest designed V8 at the moment, putting out big engine power while reaching fuel mileage of many lower powered V6s from the Imports.
The G35 you mentioned earlier gets 24mpg highway, & 19mpg city with a 3.5L 260 horse, 260 torque 6 cylinder engine.
The 300C HEMI with roughly 345 horses, 375 torque, 5.7L engine is expected to get 20 & 25 mpg respectively in a car that weighs 700 pounds more than the G35.
Pacifica bombed at 1st because it was overpriced. It's picked up quite a bit since Chrysler brought out a lower priced version.
1. The LS-1 at least had an alloy block - something the HEMI doesn't have despite being 7 years newer. Considering how cheap the HEMI is to produce, even cheaper than the SOHC 4.7 liter, it shouldn't require a $10,000 upgrade on the base 300C. Of course, the lethargic 4.6 liter "truck motor" in the Town Car Crown Vic and outgoing Mustang GT is more primitive yet.
Oh, and forget about the fuel economy arguement. Detroit vehicles typically get better fuel economy than luxury imports, but seriously, who cares?
2. With the exception of the over-designed rear suspension, the Pacifica is just a rebodied minivan. (Or more appropriately, a version of the next-generation D-C minivan.) The availablity of less-upscale Pacificas doesn't cure the ultimate price/value woes of the vehicle. The Pacifica is slow and dowdy, even by current "minivan" standards. This vehicle is still a posterchild for bad design and marketing. Chrysler is a low-end, bargain basement imaged brand.
As far as Cross fires piling up at your dealer:
Doubtful that Crossfires are stacking up at your local Chrysler dealer, there hasn't been that many produced just yet. And assuming that there were, I think your dealer wouldn't be buying them if he couldn't sell them.
The LS1 is technically a "Truck Motor" with a different displacement and camshaft. Ford's 4.6 is also a "Truck Motor". Seems you are reaching once again when there isn't something really worth complaing about. The Hemi is the worlds newest designed V8 at the moment, putting out big engine power while reaching fuel mileage of many lower powered V6s from the Imports.
The G35 you mentioned earlier gets 24mpg highway, & 19mpg city with a 3.5L 260 horse, 260 torque 6 cylinder engine.
The 300C HEMI with roughly 345 horses, 375 torque, 5.7L engine is expected to get 20 & 25 mpg respectively in a car that weighs 700 pounds more than the G35.
Pacifica bombed at 1st because it was overpriced. It's picked up quite a bit since Chrysler brought out a lower priced version.
1. The LS-1 at least had an alloy block - something the HEMI doesn't have despite being 7 years newer. Considering how cheap the HEMI is to produce, even cheaper than the SOHC 4.7 liter, it shouldn't require a $10,000 upgrade on the base 300C. Of course, the lethargic 4.6 liter "truck motor" in the Town Car Crown Vic and outgoing Mustang GT is more primitive yet.
Oh, and forget about the fuel economy arguement. Detroit vehicles typically get better fuel economy than luxury imports, but seriously, who cares?
2. With the exception of the over-designed rear suspension, the Pacifica is just a rebodied minivan. (Or more appropriately, a version of the next-generation D-C minivan.) The availablity of less-upscale Pacificas doesn't cure the ultimate price/value woes of the vehicle. The Pacifica is slow and dowdy, even by current "minivan" standards. This vehicle is still a posterchild for bad design and marketing. Chrysler is a low-end, bargain basement imaged brand.
As far as Cross fires piling up at your dealer:
Doubtful that Crossfires are stacking up at your local Chrysler dealer, there hasn't been that many produced just yet. And assuming that there were, I think your dealer wouldn't be buying them if he couldn't sell them.
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Joined: Nov 2000
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From: five-one-oh/nine-oh-nine
the 300C is looking pretty legit to me these days. i think it grew on me. it has a lot of presence to it. not so much "look at me flash" but "it must be someone important" presence. and with a V8 making 345hp, for 35k, wow, it IS legit. I'd say this 300 will be a huge success.
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