hey, someone's gotta be the guinea pigs, i mean, early adopters to new tech. I'll consider the Volt if it delivers.. maybe wait till the 2nd year run..

I mean, there are some people here that won't even buy a 1st year run of a 5th gen Camaro..

 

This...brought a tear to my eye.

So you should hate the people that drive them, not the car TBH Prius's, like Camaro's and so on have a lot more potential with some modding. If you do the plug-in mod with a Prius, you can easily get 100 Lifetime MPG. It's just too bad the aftermarket is so laughable at best for hybrids and you really have to do some digging to find the people that do this stuff.

The comparison of the Yaris and Prius is unfair. That's like saying a Mustang GT500 is lame because it's no faster than a naturally aspired Corvette. The Prius is capable of much higher MPG than the Yaris. People don't always get it because they don't know how to drive for good MPG, but there is more potential.

This is part of the reason why there's so much bias when it comes to hybrids, especially on a forum like this. People don't realize that there's hybrid enthusiasts too. Instead of seeing how fast they can make their cars, they like to see how many MPG they can get out of it. Enthusiasts on this board like to spend more money for faster cars, whats wrong with spending more money for cars that get better gas milage?

 

That's kind of where I stand. Many Prius owners are so full of themselves, just like in the South Park episode. They see themselves as saving the environment yet have no clue as to the long term impacts their green vehicles will have when it comes time to replace them, or their batteries.

I think its cool what some of the electro-gearheads are doing to mod their hybrids into plug-ins. Personally, any hybrid that isn't a plug-in is a wasted effort IMHO. The only problem I see at this point is the cool hybrids are still too expensive. (Lexus 460h.)

There are also full electric power enthusiasts that are just as much into performance as we are. They have the best of both worlds IMHO. Hybrids are somewhere in the middle, they aren't quiet "green", yet they are a little greener than gasoline powered vehicles. Hybrid buyers tend to think they are greener than us, yet they aren't as green as full electric owners, but they're a heck of alot more arrogant.

That's part of the reason I think hybrid buyers are full of themselves when they start acting like the characters in South Park. I'm sure there are some that buy them just to save money on gas. But are they really driving hybrids because they think they are saving the environment? Or are they buying them just to save money? (Long term of course.)

Personally I'd rather wait for the full-electrics to improve on performance/range than to opt for a hybrid. Give me freeway speeds, room for four adults and a range of 400 mi per charge all priced for under $35k, and I just may buy. (It depends on the time it takes to recharge the batteries.) Until then, its just too darn hilly and there's too much traffic to take full advantage of what the current hybrids have to offer to be truly a "green" vehicle in these parts.

 

It will certainly be AC - DC is all but dead for traction applications.

The mod potential for this thing will be enormous - huge gains could be had by playing with phase advance (a software change), changing the controller's target V/f constant by increasing the modulation index (yet another software change), or physically rewinding the motor to change the Kv and Kt constants. Once people get their heads wrapped around EV architecture, modding the internal combustion engine is gonna seem like a total PITA. It'll be a good time to be an electrical engineer

The warranty claims that result from all of this tinkering should be entertaining as well.

 

ECE Major here .

 

Good - start paying attention in your electrical machines classes, 'cause you'll need that stuff out here in the real world Here's a strong hint - study up on three-phase AC.

 

I can see how you Cali guys don't like the Prius because of the owners. In my experience, Cali has more self-important people than any other state, either on a total or per capita basis, that Smug Prevention® is needed way before you even get to the car choice.

Around here, I see lots of hybrids, but mostly for one reason- single rider access to the HOV. They killed that privilege July 1st, so I wonder if hybrids have taken a big hit. I did see a bumper sticker on a Prius- "More Coal. Less Middle East Oil. I can live with that." I'm thinking- this guy gets it perfectly.

Some people- like my uncle, an '04 Prius owner- are technology freaks, and just buy on that alone. Some people- like my brother, an '06 Prius owner- here people like me talking about the tech, and just go buy it. Some people- like my parents, '06 Highlander Hybrid owners- well... I have no idea why they bought it. They live in a rural area, do NO city commuting, are not tech-lovers in any way, but they wanted it, just cause.

Civics don't sell as well because they have no golf-cart mode. Escapes don't sell because they look and feel like Escapes.

I was ready to buy a hybrid- Camry, likely- last year when I picked up my new TL. I also realized that on my 6.0 mile work commute, the engine would likely run the whole time, because of the emissions restrictions for cold-starts, so I'd get no benefit. I borrowed Mom's Highlander, and I was right (for that model, at least). So, I wait... for something like Volt.

 

People, in general, aren't interested in changing the way they drive. Leadfoots will always be leadfoots, and lightfoots will always be lightfoots. Driven the same, Prius and Yaris have very similar MPG results. Prius is a little better in the city, Yaris is a little better on the highway.

 

FWIW, that isn't the case in the transit industry. Our trains run on 1000v DC power.

 

They've stop issuing the HOV permits for hybrids here as well. For city driving and level terrain, hybrids offer a huge savings. For me personally (22 mile round trip on freeway with hilly terrain) I just don't see a huge benefit. And while I'd love to consider a full electric vehicle, the 12% grade to get up my street makes that idea less than practical.

 

I havent driven a full eletric car yet. But they should have a lot of torque. I dont see a hill being much of an issue. But I could be wrong.

 

Yeah, I know Prius drivers of all sorts -- the smug fart-smelling kind, the tech nerds, and the people who just wanted to get the HOV pass. Also, just in general, small nice cars appeal to people out here.

 

Nor do I think it would be an issue in something like the Tesla Roadster. However I can't justify the price, nor is its range practical enough for my needs.

From everything I've read, torque/performance negatively impacts range/battery life. At the present, you can only have one or the other.

 

All, I gotta say is, at least for very large application, our US military believes series hybrid is the future. Look at the new HEMTT A3

http://web.camaross.com/forums/showthread.php?t=522760

Interstingly, they hint that this tech will appear on 18 commercial wheeler trucks in the near future. Now that would be a feat, considering how rough those trucks' lives are.

Freight trains already use series hybrid. IMO, its ironic that this concept has to be shrunk down to something for avg civillian transportation, instead of the other way aroud, some super small light vehicle that needs to move its way up in size.

 

Is that the input power to the train, or is that the architecture of the motors? There's a big difference. I'm guessing that your traction motors use AC drive, because damn near everything else either has gone that direction or is in the process of doing so.