I would like to see

A/pha - All the performance goodies, plus the basics of a modern car (power windows/locks/steering, etc., manual seats, but a decent stereo. Keep some options available, like leather and a big boomer stereo. This car would have the firmest suspension. Kind of like a Z06 in spirit, but offer a T or Targa top and keep it inexpensive. Maybe make them all stickshift.

Betta - Like the A/pha, but fully loaded. Power everything - but with the same engine and horsepower rating. The suspension would be very firm but not as stiff. It could be a little better on the drag strip than the A/pha car, but by no means would it be a drag car. This car would look Different, but not "better". On this car some of the performance goodies standard on the A/pha would be optional. This would keep the prices of the cars similar, with the "Beta" being 1 or 2K more (base model to base model). Also, if you wanted a V8 convertible, this is your only way to go.

Basically - two different UNIQUE cars. One for the real extremists, and one for everyone else who just wants a great fast car. But the key is that neither is "better" than the other.

This would allow GM to keep all the models relatively affordable and it wouldn't have to develop two unique V8 engines. [zips flamesuit] I also think that going after the Cobra with either model is a mistake. A $34K-$37K Camaro is just too expensive and too close to vette territory to make financial sense. I think GTO makes more sense as a Cobra killer. [/unzips flamesuit].

 

Then kill me now 'cause I'm buying a Cobra!

I don't want no stinking turbo in MY 5th gen Camaro! I want my power at WOT from idel. I don't want to have to wait for a stinkin' turbo to spool up. HP drain on modern superchargers is This aint no 6-71 Jimmy son! Gimme a supercharger over a turbo any day of the week.

Remember the old addage... Injection is nice, but I'd rather be BLOWN!

 

It is obvious that the Cobra's sole mission in life is to challenge the Corvette. When the Z06 goes to 500hp and the base Vette goes to over 400, would anybody be surprised if the Cobra's horsepower rating gets bumped also? With the Shelby version of the Cobra (almost a scary though, but in a good way!) being mentioned these days, I would expect nothing less.

 

1. Base
(RS option or model should be here)
2. SS
3. Limited/all-out Z28

That's the only way it makes sense and should be.

 

 

I say, put WERM in charge of GM.....he gets it.

For both Alpha and Beta to both prosper and add value to the Camaro name, they both must be unique, desirable, not better from each other...but different, and aimed at different niche's.

I believe that his is the definitive post of the thread!

 

Going back to the original question at hand...

If by two "performance" models you mean stripper model and luxury/full-frills model (you weren't neccessarily clear), quite honestly, I don't see a need for a stripper performance Camaro. Base Camaro with a V6 yes... but if you're basically talking about a fully optioned (sorry I'm going to use that word) "SS" and a stripped down version with all the cosmetic crap taken off but with all the performance goodies in tact.... why bother?

I don't want a stripper car.

I just want a badass V8 powered high horsepower Camaro... with leather seats, AC, PW, PL, alarm, etc.

 

I definitely think there can be two performance models.
You can have one with modest performance that would just out perform the Mustang GT. Then another one that would have more power (50hp) or whatever the magic number may be.

I don't think you will get a camaro that will be able to compete with the Cobra. Ford is turning the Cobra into a corvette competitor and GM isn't going to make a camaro that can compete with the vette long term (ie not just one year exceptions like the TTA)

I think if there is a two level camaro it would compete with the Boss or Bullit mustangs. Then the vette, Viper and the cobra will duke it out for the fastest american sports car.

I would like some different looks for the two upper camaros, either a front clip or 2 different hoods or soilers whatever it will be. Maybe one with IRS the other without. There are many different ways you can differentiate them.

As far as power adders, by the sound of it this would probably end up being a dealer installed option to lower the complexity during production. So there could be a lot or different variations in the end when model and dealer options are available.

 

NOPE! That wasn't what I was trying to get at, at all.

And really, I'm not sure where this notion of a stripper performance model started anyway. There is a difference between limiting performance sapping features and a stripper.

Lets face facts...from a marketing point of view, Alpha or Beta are interchangeable.

In fact, they have swapped positions a couple of times.

The question I posed is, in order to reduce brand schizophrenia, does one model need to be dropped or do both need to be differentiated?

 

Just to share my thoughts....

1. Base Camaro, V6
2. Camaro Alpha, A 302 or 350 that is better at handeling.
3. Camaro Beta, a 396 LS1 ( ) that is better for speed

Option 1: RS, better handeling abilities
Option 2: 1LE, the "stripper" version, drops everthing not needed for performance.

It would be nice to have limited run Yenkos or COPO cars with a small block 427 to deal with the cobra (plus I love Yenkos).

I tired to base these on the 1st gen. Camaros with a little bit of moderness injected in.

 

By the time Camaro comes back, Chevrolet will be up to Gen IV DoD powerplants.

#2 & #3 Don't exist on that platform.

 

I'm not big with DoD. Didn't they try it in the 80's and it sucked? I'm sure they made improvements but i still don't like the idea. i like all my power all the time (why i don't like turbos) and all my engine there all the trime (why i don't like DoD).

 

After reading reviews and articles on it, it seems DOD has improved vastly over what you may remember. Activation and deactivation of cylinders is imperceptable. Nothing like turbo lag in the least. Writers on a test drive said that the only way they knew the system was active was a little light on the dash. They drove something like 10 miles and the system had activated/deactivated cylinders more than a hundred times if I remember correctly.

The truth is you don't need that power all the time. If you do, than drive with your foot on the floor for the entire trip....If you really can't tell if the system is on or off, then what's the difference? Maybe exhaust idle note.....What do you get in return? A 15-20% increase in gas milage/range or more power....I think it's more than worth it.