Originally Posted by QATransAm

Exactly...

We're a little more than a year away from having national ID cards(with transmitters)...nevermind black boxes in the 5th gen, it won't matter what car you're in. We're also on the brink of a 'North American Union'...unbeknownst to most, new laws, no more constitution.

Not trying to be Dooming either, but can you honestly say things are looking up for us? Buying a 5th gen may be the least of our worries.


Back to our 'reality'...what happens if you blow your motor at the track...whats the point of buying a performance car if you can't use it, even legally? There is no don't be doing stuff you shouldn't be doing argument.

I swear this, i wish i was born in the 50's

Originally Posted by Maximum Bob

I'm all in favor of those checkpoints. If a guy walks in the door of a store & starts to pull a gun, but a cop behind him jumps him before he finishes pulling it out & yells "This is a stickup." should we find him not guilty of attempted armed robbery? If a DUI checkpoint is an assault on my civil liberties, then it's one that I'll gladly accept just to get the jackasses that insist on driving drunk off the road! When a drunk driver get's on the road they're playing "Russian Roulette". And not just with their life, but yours & mine as well! And without our permission! I don't know about you, but I prefer that someone DOESN'T take chances with my life! ESPECIALLY without my knowledge or consent! In fact I would be in favor of a law mandating the installation of a breathalyzer in bars so that someone leaving who is legally drunk the bar is obligated to keep their key's (which they would have to turn in when they came in.) & call them a ride. A motor vehicle is a weapon. And with a drunk behind the wheel of it, it becomes a loaded weapon,(in more ways than one.). The thing that a lot of people seem to forget (& not just the drunks) is that driving is a priviledge that the state is granting you. It's not your God given right!

Originally Posted by jaguar5822

LMAO ID cards with transmitters. North American Union and no more constitution. I'd like to see some of your "proof" for these things. Bwaahaahahahahahh you're so paranoid you probably think your own family is spying on you for the government.

Originally Posted by muckz

To quote something that has been misattributed to Benjamin Franklin, "Those who would give up Essential Liberty to purchase a little Temporary Safety, deserve neither Liberty nor Safety."

Bottom line - you can find out if the driver has been drinking by asking him/her to step out of the car, or by smelling something. But when police asks to open the trunk and do a thorough search on the car, they better have a warrant.

Originally Posted by R377

Exactly. Look at DUI checkpoints ... hard to believe that our society voluntarily accepts illegal search and seizure and thinks nothing of it. But it's for a good cause, many folks say. That's not the point. Once we start allowing the government to make judgement calls on when it's okay to infringe on our established rights, we're well on the path to losing those rights. Same thing with DUI legislation, which is basically making a person a criminal based on the probability they will commit a crime, not for actually commiting a crime itself. Again, society thought it was okay to give up some freedom for some perceived, short-sighted, 'greater good', but now look what's happening: they want to make driving while cell phoning illegal too. That wouldn't have been remotely possible if we didn't already open the door on DWI. I wonder what they'll make illegal next?

I'm not real happy about these black boxes either. Unfortunately they're so integrated into the vehicle electronics you can't remove them. However I'm not sure they violate the 5th since you're not incriminating yourself; the black box is (then again, I'm no law-talking dude so I could be wrong). Other than ownership, would it be that different if the evidence was provided by a street camera instead of your car's computer? Still, I'd like to see some automaker make a big point about protecting owners' privacy and not recording this information, and then naming all the competing cars that will rat you out. Such a market force is probably the only way to stop this.

Originally Posted by Maximum Bob

I'm all in favor of those checkpoints. If a guy walks in the door of a store & starts to pull a gun, but a cop behind him jumps him before he finishes pulling it out & yells "This is a stickup." should we find him not guilty of attempted armed robbery? If a DUI checkpoint is an assault on my civil liberties, then it's one that I'll gladly accept just to get the jackasses that insist on driving drunk off the road! When a drunk driver get's on the road they're playing "Russian Roulette". And not just with their life, but yours & mine as well! And without our permission! I don't know about you, but I prefer that someone DOESN'T take chances with my life! ESPECIALLY without my knowledge or consent! In fact I would be in favor of a law mandating the installation of a breathalyzer in bars so that someone leaving who is legally drunk the bar is obligated to keep their key's (which they would have to turn in when they came in.) & call them a ride. A motor vehicle is a weapon. And with a drunk behind the wheel of it, it becomes a loaded weapon,(in more ways than one.). The thing that a lot of people seem to forget (& not just the drunks) is that driving is a priviledge that the state is granting you. It's not your God given right!

Originally Posted by jaguar5822

LMAO ID cards with transmitters. North American Union and no more constitution. I'd like to see some of your "proof" for these things. Bwaahaahahahahahh you're so paranoid you probably think your own family is spying on you for the government.